AMIRZA786

I agree with this. Every Toyota/Lexus owner I know regularly maintains their cars by taking them to the dealership or local mechanic. Also all three of my current Toyota's annoy you when it's time for maintenance. My Sienna takes it one step further by blocking the screen with a giant maintenance required message. People I know that own Hyundai or Kia aren't as diligent, maybe thinking the 10 year 100k warranty has them covered

xjokerz

I would MUCH rather by a Hyundai from the mid 2000's over a newer one. I thought the 06-10 Sonata was a very nice, inexpensive mode of transportation that was very similar to my 05 Camry. They might not look as flashy as the newer ones, but they were a lot more reliable with fewer problems. At least their engines didn't get recalled every other month lol

jgscott

iTrader: (1)

You are 100 about this. So H&K buyers were the saved money over the Toyota and Honda. Also I saved money on skimpy service visits too. On the Theta engine recall more than 67% could not provided proper documented oil change service receipts from any where, even Walmart DIY oil. The engine recall was not such a poor design as it was quality control that led to metal crank shaving.

For perspective I think Toyota has ben in the US for 65 years now. The 1st 30 years give or take they sucked worst that H&K has their 1st 30. Hyundai has been here from 1992.

Its happens
https://www.consumerreports.org/car-...camry-rav4-es/

Guess who had the biggest Auto recall in History?
https://www.motorbiscuit.com/what-wa...n-u-s-history/

Also In 2018 The Camay engines were recalled because the pistons were too big and were cracking the engines.

Toys4RJill

You my friend, you’ve got a good rebuttal

Motorola

I don't think first owners of Hyundai/Kia products default on maintenance, otherwise you would be seeing them torpedo in the annual 3-year JD Power dependability assessment.

Second owners though, absolutely, like I mentioned a few posts above. Hyundai/Kia products already tend to be cheaper than their competition when new, and their less-than-stellar resale value makes them usually the cheapest cars in their class in the used market. This draws in people who want the cheapest available car, but can't afford the post 3rd year maintenance.

I can understand why CR has to use second owners for the survey, because it's hard finding people who keep their cars longer than a 3-year lease period and are willing to respond to a survey. But it results in bad data.

Motorola

Who could forget Toyota's 6 million strong recall for stalling engines two years ago lol. Recalls are the lifeblood of every manufacturer.

Striker223

They didn't actually. I bought the LS at 202k and it was all OE parts that I pulled off it when I replaced anything down to the starter and VVT actuators etc. Still on its original wheel hubs somehow as well

The RX was bought at 170k and run to 210k under us with no fixes other than mentioned and oil changes/tires

Lot of the ones in my care have been in my care for 30-70k miles, they do better under me than the ones that come in for the first time for sure but given the same owner a Toyota will take it far better. Case in point the 07 ES I bought shares it's prior owner with the current one of 13 Kia I worked on. Same owner but the ES has over 50k more miles and is 6 years older yet overall in much better shape. His new cars are both Toyotas after the Lexus outlasted 3 other cars.....

Striker223

I literally can't think of ANY brand that can't go the first 3 with zero maintenance including oil changes in some cases. It's the point after that a car proves itself as good or not.....

You would be astounded how common it is people don't change oil during lease periods since they simply do not care.

Motorola

I doubt anyone who buys/leases a new car is negligent to the point of not knowing what an oil change is lol. And assuming they make it through those three years without a single oil change, that's going to blow up the moment it goes to the second owner.

The issue with the second owner is going to be whether they have the means to actually afford maintenance.

jgscott

iTrader: (1)

I'm not sure the thoughts of Lease customers not doing maintained is really accurate? I''ll tell you why. Over the past 12 years I have purchased numerous pre owned car for myself and family members both immediate and not immediate. I shop very well, and try to do things like avoid cars that the carfax shows 10k oil changes even by the manufacture recommendations.

Looking at various carfax history reports that indicated the car was leased, I have never seen any Leased car that was missing the servicing as mentioned here. In fact they all showed perfect servicing recorded. The only ones missing service history records were normally the 2nd and 3rd owners of purchases. Not to say that service was not performed DYI or at a Indy shop non reported to carfax, but missing still the same.

You have to remember mostly only Brand new cars like Lexus for example are Leased at a non used car price. This requires a nice down payment amount still, A-1 credit to get a good money factor and residual rate, and normally a hefty monthly payment. A new LS Lease guesstimate would likely be $5k - 10K Down and a payment depending on the months and miles allowed a payment of $650 - $800 per month.

I never really see Leased car missing service history at all. In fact normally, its the reverse and the history is perfect.

mmarshall

In general, I don't buy the "Can't Do it" routine. New or used, If one cannot (or will not) have their vehicle maintained, then they simply should not own one.

mmarshall

^^^ Totally agreed Like the 3Gen Camry and 4Gen Accord, the 5Gen Sonata was hands-down the best one ever done. The latest Sonatas, in particular, feel noticeably tinnier inside and out.

I was also very impressed with the 2Gen Santa Fe, roughly from the same time period.....it had what I thought was the most comfortable ride and solid construction of any before or since.

jgscott

iTrader: (1)

I don't think the earlier 2000 cars were better in anyway. They were more Accord Camay era builds. My Bother in law was at a very Big Kia Dealer as a Finance Manger. Rick Case Kia. In fact Rick Case was the one who convinced them to start the 100K Warranty years back. My Brother in law had many Demo's he drove of those cars. None of them rode or was as quite and safe as the 2015's on up. He was there for years and drove just about everything they had even allowed to use on vacation trips.

You can see the documented improvements in crash test, structural integrity and design, noise level disables, CR comfort ratings, and the Ratings and awards J.D. POWER INITIAL QUALITY STUDY from 2015 and up on the Soul, Forte, and/or many others. This is fact was the about starting of the Genesis line. You could tell the difference in in riding and driving the improved line up cars.

Striker223

You would be amazed. I have customers who go 20-30k between changes even when I try to warn them it's an extreme risk, the response is always "it hasn't failed yet so it's fine"

A lot of people only use the first free oil change and after that it's a roll of the dice if it's been done regularly after that. The record holder for me was a 2010 sonata that went 47k miles without a change till it blew up, Hyundai denied coverage so I put an engine in.

xjokerz

How incredibly stupid. Owning a car is a responsibility. I hate seeing people not want to get basic maintenance done. You're saying they couldn't be bothered to pull up to a Jiffy Lube and spend $30 on an oil change? Probably only needed it done twice or 3 times a year.