Luxury car percentages
#16
Lexus Fanatic
Originally Posted by LexsCTJill
Keep in mind that Roger Smith made big profits (maybe even record) for their shareholders at the expense of the consumer....And you are seeing these harmful effects come back to haunt GM today.....the declining market share is just part of it.
Mary Barra, though, despite her recent controversial decisions, did a lot of good for the company, and brought back much of that old GM "Mark of Excellence" quality from the 1960s.
As far as GM's declining market share, the obvious question is.....what came first, the chicken or the egg? Did market share decline because GM eliminated five of its divisions, or did declining share force the elimination of those divisions? Personally (and this is simply my opinion, not necessarily fact), from what I've seen over the years, I am of the opinion that it is the former.......GM shot itself in the foot by eliminating these divisions. You cannot sell what you don't produce.
Last edited by mmarshall; 05-15-19 at 12:12 PM.
#17
Lexus Fanatic
Almost all established brands are growing outside of the US vs the US. Cadillac and Lexus are probably selling the same in China and the rest of the world.
#18
Lexus Fanatic
iTrader: (20)
As far as GM's declining market share, the obvious question is.....what came first, the chicken or the egg? Did market share decline because GM eliminated five of its divisions, or did declining share force the elimination of those divisions? Personally (and this is simply my opinion, not necessarily fact), from what I've seen over the years, I am of the opinion that it is the former.......GM shot itself in the foot by eliminating these divisions. You cannot sell what you don't produce.
no one can deny that gm's products today are vastly superior in terms of quality than ever before. but their price points are sometimes not that competitive, and of course they're still working on product mix, features, etc. cadillac has of course been reinvented a few times. i personally like the newest design language and it's now pretty consistent. the xt4, xt5 seem to be doing well. they need to upgrade the escalade even though it sells pretty well and makes gm a load of money. saw a ct6 yesterday and man that looked sharp.
the volt and bolt were innovative for sure, but just didn't quite have the range, room or design to really catch fire. looks like the hyundai kona ev is going to eat the bolt's lunch until they have a new version. a friend with a volt is going to get a kona soon.
back to luxury percentages though... gm will keep at it with cadillac, hopefully they have an ev cadillac soon, maybe before tesla's y arrives.
#19
Lexus Champion
i never said they didn't. but they didn't have 35% of the ENTIRE car market.
[color=#222222]
and you cannot sell junk and gm was producing vast quantities of junk, stuffing dealers and junk would sit on lots until they had blowout sales, losing money... gm was simply producing too much of what wouldn't sell, so restructuring was needed and they couldn't fix all the brands at once. oldsmobile and saturn were already on borrowed time... i was more saddened to see pontiac go. not important but what were the other two?
no one can deny that gm's products today are vastly superior in terms of quality than ever before. but their price points are sometimes not that competitive, and of course they're still working on product mix, features, etc. cadillac has of course been reinvented a few times. i personally like the newest design language and it's now pretty consistent. the xt4, xt5 seem to be doing well. they need to upgrade the escalade even though it sells pretty well and makes gm a load of money. saw a ct6 yesterday and man that looked sharp.
the volt and bolt were innovative for sure, but just didn't quite have the range, room or design to really catch fire. looks like the hyundai kona ev is going to eat the bolt's lunch until they have a new version. a friend with a volt is going to get a kona soon.
back to luxury percentages though... gm will keep at it with cadillac, hopefully they have an ev cadillac soon, maybe before tesla's y arrives.
[color=#222222]
and you cannot sell junk and gm was producing vast quantities of junk, stuffing dealers and junk would sit on lots until they had blowout sales, losing money... gm was simply producing too much of what wouldn't sell, so restructuring was needed and they couldn't fix all the brands at once. oldsmobile and saturn were already on borrowed time... i was more saddened to see pontiac go. not important but what were the other two?
no one can deny that gm's products today are vastly superior in terms of quality than ever before. but their price points are sometimes not that competitive, and of course they're still working on product mix, features, etc. cadillac has of course been reinvented a few times. i personally like the newest design language and it's now pretty consistent. the xt4, xt5 seem to be doing well. they need to upgrade the escalade even though it sells pretty well and makes gm a load of money. saw a ct6 yesterday and man that looked sharp.
the volt and bolt were innovative for sure, but just didn't quite have the range, room or design to really catch fire. looks like the hyundai kona ev is going to eat the bolt's lunch until they have a new version. a friend with a volt is going to get a kona soon.
back to luxury percentages though... gm will keep at it with cadillac, hopefully they have an ev cadillac soon, maybe before tesla's y arrives.
#20
"......NOT better than each car's competitors......"
Ah, as an XT4 owner that used to have a Lexus NX the interior is as good or better to me and the infotainment system on the Caddy is far superior. The Entune system is crap and needs a total revision along with eliminating the awful touchpad. But it's hard to get over the bias in this group which keeps spewing out nonsense.
Ah, as an XT4 owner that used to have a Lexus NX the interior is as good or better to me and the infotainment system on the Caddy is far superior. The Entune system is crap and needs a total revision along with eliminating the awful touchpad. But it's hard to get over the bias in this group which keeps spewing out nonsense.
#21
According to the graph, it appears Cadillac and BMW are the only ones with an uptick in share the last year. It's what have you done for me lately that counts, not 30 years ago. Cadillac is doing a nice turn around and will only get better in the coming years. Their emphasis on electric models will be interesting to see.
#22
Lexus Fanatic
"......NOT better than each car's competitors......"
Ah, as an XT4 owner that used to have a Lexus NX the interior is as good or better to me and the infotainment system on the Caddy is far superior. The Entune system is crap and needs a total revision along with eliminating the awful touchpad. But it's hard to get over the bias in this group which keeps spewing out nonsense.
Ah, as an XT4 owner that used to have a Lexus NX the interior is as good or better to me and the infotainment system on the Caddy is far superior. The Entune system is crap and needs a total revision along with eliminating the awful touchpad. But it's hard to get over the bias in this group which keeps spewing out nonsense.
#23
#24
Lexus Fanatic
You have not held a modern GM product long enough to inform us how well they hold up. The past perceptions of GM is why the declining market share of GM is still going on.
#25
Lexus Fanatic
Last edited by Toys4RJill; 05-15-19 at 02:37 PM.
#26
#27
Lexus Fanatic
#28
Well, I'm not a good one to chastise. I don't recall saying anything about how a Cadillac holds up. I lease my vehicles for 2-3 years so I don't have any issues. I thought we were talking about market share anyway.
#29
Lexus Fanatic
iTrader: (20)
I know that @mmarshall (and others) like to tout how GM and other American car companies have better quality products than they used to. But BFD--so does everyone. The fact is, very few, if any, GM products are at or near the top product in its category. In almost every instance, even if a GM product is "nice" or "good", there's almost always a competitor that's better. When was the last time you read a review of a GM product that didn't knock the interior as being either cheap or bland? This has been a problem for decades; yes, the new XT4 and CT5 are "better"--but only better than the bad interior of the predecessor Caddy models, and NOT better than each car's competitors. And, to your point, if Caddy is going to charge as much for an XT4 as an X3 or Q5, that's a tough sell when looking at 2 high quality interiors from the driver's seat. A top notch interior is going to go a longer way to selling more Caddy's than great driving dynamics.
so that's why sometimes compromises are made by gm... i've no doubt they have very talented designers, but management knows they simply have to make certain margins to keep going which sometimes means using less nice materials and designs than they would otherwise like.
Ah, as an XT4 owner that used to have a Lexus NX the interior is as good or better to me and the infotainment system on the Caddy is far superior. The Entune system is crap and needs a total revision along with eliminating the awful touchpad. But it's hard to get over the bias in this group which keeps spewing out nonsense.
According to the graph, it appears Cadillac and BMW are the only ones with an uptick in share the last year. It's what have you done for me lately that counts, not 30 years ago. Cadillac is doing a nice turn around and will only get better in the coming years. Their emphasis on electric models will be interesting to see.
#30
Lexus Fanatic
I don't think GM will ever gain market share. Perhaps if they bottom out, that said, they are still the #1 US brand for overall sales, but they just lose a percentage every single year.
It is admirable that you have changed brands all the time. BUT you don't keep them long enough and the fact that your Jeep was so lovable is irrelevant as you did not buy another one. Now contrast that to my family, my father hated his Lexus and knew it was not right for him, so he went with an Avalon realizing it was the correct vehicle. Or any case, my mother knew her past 4Runner was not to be given away, so we kept it and she got another one. (we know, you don't like the new 4Runner) If you buy another Genesis, than that is very telling.
. i once thought i'd never buy a ford. bought 2, loved 'em. never thought i'd buy a chrysler (jeep). did that, loved it. for those that can keep an open mind, there's great choices out there. but some won't venture out of a small comfort zone, and that's their prerogative.
Last edited by Toys4RJill; 05-15-19 at 03:25 PM.