can you even buy ANY car with manual roll-up windows anymore?? I don't want it - just curious.

 

Only in certain models, and only select markets. I think you can still get a kia rio, honda civic, toyota yaris (or whatever their small car is now), ford fiesta, chevy spark/aveo etc without.

 

I think the only ones left with manual roll-up are:

 

Those arguing for the "ruggedness" of the 4Runner as a way to offset the 4Runner's lack of cost-of-entry features are ridiculous in my opinion. I completely agree that nearly any 35K vehicle should have a power driver seat (doesn't need memory), push button start, auto headlights, etc. 90+% of the time these vehicles are being daily driven to work, errands, etc. No matter how the image of the vehicle might help portray a lifestyle we want to exude.

Toyota has a nearly 10 year old vehicle still on the market in the 4Runner with MINIMAL changes over that time period. Yet, how to convince them they're in the wrong when sales continue to climb with little to no incentives? It does well for the brand, with well over 100K units expected to sell this year. That's definitely nothing to sneeze at.

 

well it does have an electric seat (and 5 electric fully automatic windows, 6 if there's a moonroof) and maybe it's just me being silly, but i just like the physical act of turning a key lol.

also with a traditional key turn, and similar arrangements like in the LS 430 even though it was still keyless, you can just turn the key one click to stop the engine and have it stay in acc mode to keep the music going, but with the buttons you sometimes have to cycle through the procedure to get back to acc mode. in the case of the 2016 MDX for instance, i timed it as taking 16 seconds from the time the engine turns off to when the radio starts playing again. i know some cars will keep the radio going until one of the doors are opened or something but not all push button cars.

 

 

Maybe a good part of the 4Runner's buyer-base simply doesn't want, or care about, some of those items....even at 35K+. There is a LOT that comes on today's vehicles (often standard) that I myself could do (and, often, would rather do) without.

 

my friend who just started an SR5 lease doesn't like the lack of a button to open the tailgate from the inside but otherwise loves how "cowboy" the 4runner is lol

he's only had nissan rogues before so after i had him test drive the frunner he was like, now THIS is what an suv should feel like!

 

It could be that the 4Runner is a Toyota truck "halo" vehicle unto itself. This is a vehicle that built up a really great well earned reputation for itself. The casual dime store shoppers who just want a tough looking vehicle can go over to the new RAV for going grocery shopping or dropping kids off to school.

It is odd but Toyota has invested more in the offroading hardware and safety systems than convenience features on the 4Runner. The 4Runner is much more sophisticated than it was 10 or 15 years ago but it is still a basic truck at its core. That seems to attract buyers who want to know what sits underneath the floorboards vs what's inside the truck.

Yep. That's where 4Runners shine as do their now distant cousins the Tacomas, especially when you can modify them and do all sorts of stuff with them. They rarely break. The current 4Runner is a Prado and in world markets it is a rugged, tough vehicle that doesn't lard up on the options list. If it doesn't have the push button start or remote features, then a potential buyer for such a vehicle is better off buying a mainstream BoF SUV from another automaker.

 

Bro.... it's a 4Runner. Not a military vehicle.

It's not "just for offroad". If it was, it would at least have a front solid axle, diff locks,etc. Which is doesn't. A stock 4Runner isn't even good offroad. It comes with street tires, not AT or MT tires. Ground clearance isn't great, doesn't have skid plates, doesn't have anything that would make it "just for camping or trails".

4Runner was always a vehicle designed for family use on and offroad. And I agree with the OP, it BS that some of that stuff is not standard on a vehicle that costs this much.

 

In all 2014+ Mazdas, the emergency tow eyelet used for recovery no longer comes with the vehicle. You have to buy it from the dealer if you want it. I think it's ridiculous for Mazda not to include such a basic recovery tool on their vehicles.

 

Your argument makes no sense, I will tell you why. The TRD has a rear locking differential, so yes the vehicle is meant for offroading. Yes you can be a mall crawler and drive your limited/sr5 but what good is that when there are so many other cars that can do it better. For example a rav4, even hybrid rav4 for better mpg. What good is choosing a 4runner to feel more masculine or better when there are way better cars out there that are more comfortable and for cheaper. Sorry man, you dont make any sense. If you want family use buy a rav4 if you want actual usage and practicality for wht teh vehicle was intended to do, buy a 4runner and go offroading and to spots where you can take the car to go hiking and camping. Front solid axle, diff locks are available too, you just have to upgrade to the landcruiser for all of that. Just seems to me people make excuses to buy what they want instead of thinking logically and rationally about a car purchase. Its not my money though.

 

35G is not a lot of $$$ for a new vehicles nowadays. If one does not want to payfor all the bells and whistles 2 to 3 year old fully loaded CPO one is better choice, IMO.

 

OP: I rented a $45k Jaguar F Pace SUV for a week and it didn't have the auto-unlock as you approach with the fob feature. It had a decent turbo 4 cylinder but not very refined. It also had cheap feeling plastics littered around the dash and navigation system. The nav/infotainment system was laggy and buggy. But it looks stellar and had great handling/driveability. Maybe the only trim i'd consider would be closer to $60k in that Jag (better engine, auto unlock on approach, etc).

Lots of folks also point out that Lexus didn't use LEDs everywhere in many of their late model cars that cost $40-$60k (interior doors, trunk, cargo, turn signals, reverse were all standard halogen bulbs) while their competitors were using brighter, more modern LEDs for years.

I guess what i'm getting at is that price isn't a baseline that guarantees any feature.

 

That's really surprising in a luxury brand.. I feel the same way on this as I do about airlines - I'd rather they just bump up the sticker price a couple hundred bucks and give me the options on the lowest trim level instead of nickel and diming me for everything I feel should be included.