Car Play, Android Auto, Built in infotainment
Lexus Test Driver
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 1,419
Likes: 11
From: California
It cancels out an entire brand of cars (for me) because critical functionality is missing. My wife's prior Lexus was fully loaded, including Navigation. I think we used it three times total. But she used Waze on her phone every single day. My Father-in-law's Nissan (he lives with us) has their navigation system, and we plugged an old iPod loaded with music into its iPod interface. But instead he streams Pandora from his phone, and if we need navigation, we use our phones, not the built-in system.
It's not so much a navigation being funky thing as the fact that a static, fixed map system that's rarely updated and doesn't have real-time traffic is of nearly zero value to me, except perhaps on a Sunday morning where there is no traffic. When I said I don't use AA all the time, it's because sometimes I'm just making a short trip out to a restaurant, or my kid's sports practice, and I don't need navigation/traffic. That said, I know for a fact I'm going to use Waze for my evening commute, because it's proven over the years to take on average 15-20 minutes off that commute vs. not. 2 extra hours per week of not sitting in traffic is valuable to me, and becomes even moreso when we're on long trips and there are traffic snarls. Why would I want to spend $50k or more on a car that requires me to either give this up, or continue illegally holding my phone?
It's not so much a navigation being funky thing as the fact that a static, fixed map system that's rarely updated and doesn't have real-time traffic is of nearly zero value to me, except perhaps on a Sunday morning where there is no traffic. When I said I don't use AA all the time, it's because sometimes I'm just making a short trip out to a restaurant, or my kid's sports practice, and I don't need navigation/traffic. That said, I know for a fact I'm going to use Waze for my evening commute, because it's proven over the years to take on average 15-20 minutes off that commute vs. not. 2 extra hours per week of not sitting in traffic is valuable to me, and becomes even moreso when we're on long trips and there are traffic snarls. Why would I want to spend $50k or more on a car that requires me to either give this up, or continue illegally holding my phone?
I don't find Android Auto as a "critical feature" at all. It'll be nice to have it as an option - but its not going to hurt if they don't offer it at all. When I shop for a luxury car or a performance car, I'm going to be like "It doesn't have Car Play/Android Auto - I'll never buy it." That's too restricting in my point of view.
I love the F80 BMW M3, the M2 Comp Pack, and I will for sure love the G20 BMW M3 in a few years when its out. The thing is - BMW doesn't offer Android Auto and Apple Car Play is sub-based only now. Am I going to not buy a legendary M Car because of they don't have some cheapo mirroring service? No. Because that's not what those cars are about. And iDrive is amazing as well.
I love the Lexus LS/LC. They both don't have Apple Car Play or Android Auto. But that won't stop be from buying an extremely luxurious car that has insane interior details. The mirroring service won't make the LS/LC anymore or any less luxurious.
I'll agree with you. Google maps definitely update more often than standard Navigation maps. However - Google map updates vary in time and likely will barely impact your travels. And - a lot of nicer luxury cars now offer free traffic and weather.
Lexus Fanatic
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 35,474
Likes: 383
From: ON/NY
I agree. Google maps is one of the best map services out there. I don't doubt that and I use Google maps while walking too. I have mentioned it before - I think Apple Car Play and Android Auto is only a must have if the applications are merged into the functions of the standard infotainment system. What I mean by this is - you can fully interact with everything. Right now - as it stands - you have to exit out of the Apple Car Play screen to use Lexus system stuff. What I want to say is - IE: Google Maps functioning and you can split screen it on your Lexus to do other things.
At its current state - with the car companies keeping Apple Car Play and Android Auto at an arm's length by not properly mixing them together. It'll just be clunky, in my opinion.
At its current state - with the car companies keeping Apple Car Play and Android Auto at an arm's length by not properly mixing them together. It'll just be clunky, in my opinion.
Re-read what I said about the Virtual Cockpit, please.
Virtual Cockpit is only available on the Premium Plus and up trims - not the Premium base trim.
My cousin owns an Audi S4 with Virtual Cockpit. Its by far the best digital gauge system out in the market right now - better than MBUX. I didn't feel the need to use Apple Car Play once while driving his car. I customized the maps to my liking on Virtual Cockpit display and left it there. It updated me with live traffic and did the job better than using the smaller screen for Apple Car Play.
You keep bringing up money and cost. The thing is - people in the higher price market range are likely not going to care. When you are spending well over 40K for a car, you are putting in an investment - you'll pay for the options. A lot of times - money isn't an issue for people at this price range. Yes - it would save money. But it comes at a cost to owning a vehicle that is less luxurious than it really is. Its similar to people saving over 10K and buying a stripper 3 series over a loaded 3 series. The thing is - the empty 3 series is worst than a Honda Civic.
I can ask you the same thing - what's so important about Apple Car Play that is so alluring to you too? Its just difference of opinions. I think Apple Car Play is main function is for people that doesn't have navigation or don't have the fancy upgraded navigation.
I used Apple Car Play multiple times on different cars - I never really found the need for it.
Again - it goes back to needs. All I was saying is Apple Car Play and other mirroring services are important if you like Waze, Google Maps, Audiobook and Pandora. If you don't really find the need for those things, you are pretty much never gonna use it.
If we are going to have a 3rd party company develop software for Lexus, I wouldn't have Apple do it. I would rather have another software company do it.
Virtual Cockpit is only available on the Premium Plus and up trims - not the Premium base trim.
My cousin owns an Audi S4 with Virtual Cockpit. Its by far the best digital gauge system out in the market right now - better than MBUX. I didn't feel the need to use Apple Car Play once while driving his car. I customized the maps to my liking on Virtual Cockpit display and left it there. It updated me with live traffic and did the job better than using the smaller screen for Apple Car Play.
You keep bringing up money and cost. The thing is - people in the higher price market range are likely not going to care. When you are spending well over 40K for a car, you are putting in an investment - you'll pay for the options. A lot of times - money isn't an issue for people at this price range. Yes - it would save money. But it comes at a cost to owning a vehicle that is less luxurious than it really is. Its similar to people saving over 10K and buying a stripper 3 series over a loaded 3 series. The thing is - the empty 3 series is worst than a Honda Civic.
I can ask you the same thing - what's so important about Apple Car Play that is so alluring to you too? Its just difference of opinions. I think Apple Car Play is main function is for people that doesn't have navigation or don't have the fancy upgraded navigation.
I used Apple Car Play multiple times on different cars - I never really found the need for it.
Again - it goes back to needs. All I was saying is Apple Car Play and other mirroring services are important if you like Waze, Google Maps, Audiobook and Pandora. If you don't really find the need for those things, you are pretty much never gonna use it.
If we are going to have a 3rd party company develop software for Lexus, I wouldn't have Apple do it. I would rather have another software company do it.
Last edited by Toys4RJill; Sep 24, 2018 at 05:57 PM.
second, thinking of apple car play or android auto only in terms of navigation and music/audio might be true today but it sure isn't going to be limited to those things in the near future. there's ZERO chance the car companies can keep up with what's ahead in their own pea brained infotainment systems. they do provide nice controllers and screens though.
plus car makers offer LOUSY support as far as software upgrades once you have a vehicle. a few bug fixes or map updates, etc., but with AC/AA you can get massive increases in features, speed, more cloud integration, etc.
probably the best feature of my g90's infotainment system is the google button on the rear view mirror or all places. i can press it and ask for any place and it will contact google, bring back the list of matches including addresses, phone numbers, etc., and i can navigate from there. really handy. but i'd also like to be able to just ask directions for a contact address in my phone, but i can't.
anyway, i just don't believe you're thinking outside the box.
Lexus Test Driver
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 1,419
Likes: 11
From: California
I am trying to agree with some of what you have said, however I watched some videos tonight on You Tube when I got home, it is tough to go against Apple Car Play and Android Auto as things appear to be a lot easier than the embedded stuff found in cars. The WSJ review in the Chevrolet Corvette was very telling. It should also get better as time goes by for the two systems.
Like I mentioned before, I do think Apple Car Play and Android Auto is better than some infotainment systems. I, however, do not think the Apple Car Play/Android Auto is better than luxury car maker systems though. Systems like the iDrive and MBUX are class leading - in my opinion. They also function better and more smoothly than Apple Car Play and Android Auto. There are actually quite a bit of reviewers out there that tried using iDrive + Apple Car Play but just ended up iDrive only because its better integrated.
Lexus Test Driver
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 1,419
Likes: 11
From: California
first off luxury isn't only about 'need' it's about want and would be nice, and oh well, why the hell not.
second, thinking of apple car play or android auto only in terms of navigation and music/audio might be true today but it sure isn't going to be limited to those things in the near future. there's ZERO chance the car companies can keep up with what's ahead in their own pea brained infotainment systems. they do provide nice controllers and screens though.
plus car makers offer LOUSY support as far as software upgrades once you have a vehicle. a few bug fixes or map updates, etc., but with AC/AA you can get massive increases in features, speed, more cloud integration, etc.
probably the best feature of my g90's infotainment system is the google button on the rear view mirror or all places. i can press it and ask for any place and it will contact google, bring back the list of matches including addresses, phone numbers, etc., and i can navigate from there. really handy. but i'd also like to be able to just ask directions for a contact address in my phone, but i can't.
anyway, i just don't believe you're thinking outside the box.
second, thinking of apple car play or android auto only in terms of navigation and music/audio might be true today but it sure isn't going to be limited to those things in the near future. there's ZERO chance the car companies can keep up with what's ahead in their own pea brained infotainment systems. they do provide nice controllers and screens though.
plus car makers offer LOUSY support as far as software upgrades once you have a vehicle. a few bug fixes or map updates, etc., but with AC/AA you can get massive increases in features, speed, more cloud integration, etc.
probably the best feature of my g90's infotainment system is the google button on the rear view mirror or all places. i can press it and ask for any place and it will contact google, bring back the list of matches including addresses, phone numbers, etc., and i can navigate from there. really handy. but i'd also like to be able to just ask directions for a contact address in my phone, but i can't.
anyway, i just don't believe you're thinking outside the box.
Definitely a good point. In the future - there could be tons and tons more application integration. But we aren't talking about then, we are talking about now. And right now - in my opinion, Apple Car Play isn't worth it on luxury cars unless you really like Waze, Audio Book or Pandora. But to follow up on your point - increasing application integration on Apple Car Play brings in a lot of factors we have to ask ourselves too. What app would be considered "Okay" for vehicle use?
I have seen on forums - some people demand YouTube on Apple Car Play. I for one that think that is a bit ridiculous. What would be cool though is YouTube integration onto backseat screens for the kids.
Yes - the support is lacking because that's how the car market works. Its to get people to continuously buy/lease cars. Its horrible that car companies force you to pay out yearly to update your map.
I wouldn't say "massive increase" in features. What you do get is an alternative option to use maps with extra features, such as Waze, Audio Book, and Pandora. I wouldn't consider massive. I would consider an option but not a deal breaker option. This goes back to my point from earlier - is this enough for someone to be like: I refuse to buy a BMW M4 or BMW M2 Comp pack (two of the best driving cars in the world) because of no phone mirroring services?
Maybe I'm not. Maybe I just don't get it Apple Car Play or Android Auto. Even after multiple uses of it - I really tried to find use for it - I just never really did.
The only time I found it useful was on a Camaro SS rental because that thing had no navigation.
CL Community Team
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 9,375
Likes: 614
From: IL
I love the F80 BMW M3, the M2 Comp Pack, and I will for sure love the G20 BMW M3 in a few years when its out. The thing is - BMW doesn't offer Android Auto and Apple Car Play is sub-based only now. Am I going to not buy a legendary M Car because of they don't have some cheapo mirroring service? No. Because that's not what those cars are about.
But I'm not at a place in my life where a weekend toy is in the cards (son going to college in a few years, planning for early retirement), and an M2 would not be a good DD for me--wouldn't hold all my son's lacrosse gear, for one
. So that's kind of moot in my case. If I was dead-set on a new BMW as my DD--I've been driving a 3-series exclusively for the past 2 decades, after all--I'd probably deal with converting over to an iPhone so I could use CarPlay. Or just install a cellular iPad Mini like I did in my current car 
And yes, some higher-end cars include traffic data. But in my experience with our own Nissan (provided by XM NavTraffic) and Audi (Google maps), it doesn't seem to help much. In the example I gave above, Here maps with Google traffic resulted in a trip that took 50% longer, vs. Waze on my phone.
To put a finer point on it, a 2018MY car with one of the most well-regarded infotainment/navigation systems in the business is markedly inferior (in performance; it's WAY better-looking) at one of its most basic functions to an app on my phone when brand new. This gap will only widen as the vehicle ages and mobile technology continues to march onward.
It "barely impacts my travels" to the tune of about 2 hours a week. I literally did a head to head test a couple of weeks ago, and the actual commute home (on the same day, at the same time) turned out to be 35 minutes different--55 minutes vs. 1:30. I've also avoided 1-2.5 hour delays on longer trips thanks to traffic-based rerouting (confirmed by others making the same trip that took the "logical"/most direct route). That time is intensely valuable to me.
And yes, some higher-end cars include traffic data. But in my experience with our own Nissan (provided by XM NavTraffic) and Audi (Google maps), it doesn't seem to help much. In the example I gave above, Here maps with Google traffic resulted in a trip that took 50% longer, vs. Waze on my phone.
To put a finer point on it, a 2018MY car with one of the most well-regarded infotainment/navigation systems in the business is markedly inferior (in performance; it's WAY better-looking) at one of its most basic functions to an app on my phone when brand new. This gap will only widen as the vehicle ages and mobile technology continues to march onward.
And yes, some higher-end cars include traffic data. But in my experience with our own Nissan (provided by XM NavTraffic) and Audi (Google maps), it doesn't seem to help much. In the example I gave above, Here maps with Google traffic resulted in a trip that took 50% longer, vs. Waze on my phone.
To put a finer point on it, a 2018MY car with one of the most well-regarded infotainment/navigation systems in the business is markedly inferior (in performance; it's WAY better-looking) at one of its most basic functions to an app on my phone when brand new. This gap will only widen as the vehicle ages and mobile technology continues to march onward.
Advanced
Joined: Sep 2018
Posts: 507
Likes: 55
I am trying to agree with some of what you have said, however I watched some videos tonight on You Tube when I got home, it is tough to go against Apple Car Play and Android Auto as things appear to be a lot easier than the embedded stuff found in cars. The WSJ review in the Chevrolet Corvette was very telling. It should also get better as time goes by for the two systems.
right now - in my opinion, Apple Car Play isn't worth it on luxury cars unless you really like Waze, Audio Book or Pandora. But to follow up on your point - increasing application integration on Apple Car Play brings in a lot of factors we have to ask ourselves too. What app would be considered "Okay" for vehicle use? I have seen on forums - some people demand YouTube on Apple Car Play. I for one that think that is a bit ridiculous. What would be cool though is YouTube integration onto backseat screens for the kids.
or how about "where is my brother john right now?" or "what's the estimated travel time to my office?" or "sell 100 shares of aapl stock on my etrade account" or "play rolling stones" or on and on and on...
Advanced
Joined: Sep 2018
Posts: 507
Likes: 55
Re-read what I said about the Virtual Cockpit, please.
Virtual Cockpit is only available on the Premium Plus and up trims - not the Premium base trim.
My cousin owns an Audi S4 with Virtual Cockpit. Its by far the best digital gauge system out in the market right now - better than MBUX. I didn't feel the need to use Apple Car Play once while driving his car. I customized the maps to my liking on Virtual Cockpit display and left it there. It updated me with live traffic and did the job better than using the smaller screen for Apple Car Play.
You keep bringing up money and cost. The thing is - people in the higher price market range are likely not going to care. When you are spending well over 40K for a car, you are putting in an investment - you'll pay for the options. A lot of times - money isn't an issue for people at this price range. Yes - it would save money. But it comes at a cost to owning a vehicle that is less luxurious than it really is. Its similar to people saving over 10K and buying a stripper 3 series over a loaded 3 series. The thing is - the empty 3 series is worst than a Honda Civic.
I can ask you the same thing - what's so important about Apple Car Play that is so alluring to you too? Its just difference of opinions. I think Apple Car Play is main function is for people that doesn't have navigation or don't have the fancy upgraded navigation.
I used Apple Car Play multiple times on different cars - I never really found the need for it.
Again - it goes back to needs. All I was saying is Apple Car Play and other mirroring services are important if you like Waze, Google Maps, Audiobook and Pandora. If you don't really find the need for those things, you are pretty much never gonna use it.
If we are going to have a 3rd party company develop software for Lexus, I wouldn't have Apple do it. I would rather have another software company do it.
Virtual Cockpit is only available on the Premium Plus and up trims - not the Premium base trim.
My cousin owns an Audi S4 with Virtual Cockpit. Its by far the best digital gauge system out in the market right now - better than MBUX. I didn't feel the need to use Apple Car Play once while driving his car. I customized the maps to my liking on Virtual Cockpit display and left it there. It updated me with live traffic and did the job better than using the smaller screen for Apple Car Play.
You keep bringing up money and cost. The thing is - people in the higher price market range are likely not going to care. When you are spending well over 40K for a car, you are putting in an investment - you'll pay for the options. A lot of times - money isn't an issue for people at this price range. Yes - it would save money. But it comes at a cost to owning a vehicle that is less luxurious than it really is. Its similar to people saving over 10K and buying a stripper 3 series over a loaded 3 series. The thing is - the empty 3 series is worst than a Honda Civic.
I can ask you the same thing - what's so important about Apple Car Play that is so alluring to you too? Its just difference of opinions. I think Apple Car Play is main function is for people that doesn't have navigation or don't have the fancy upgraded navigation.
I used Apple Car Play multiple times on different cars - I never really found the need for it.
Again - it goes back to needs. All I was saying is Apple Car Play and other mirroring services are important if you like Waze, Google Maps, Audiobook and Pandora. If you don't really find the need for those things, you are pretty much never gonna use it.
If we are going to have a 3rd party company develop software for Lexus, I wouldn't have Apple do it. I would rather have another software company do it.
It's nice the Lexus IS has integrated the screen nicely with the dash. Anyway, it was nice to confirm (again) that Audi MMI hasn't changed an iota in the last 5+ years. The whole setup was completely unintuitive, and offers me nothing that I even need, other than access to basic car settings. What's more, it's not future proof and can't be upgraded. If you could upgrade it, I wouldn't have the same dated MMI in my 2013 Audi. Virtual Cockpit is a nice parlor trick, but I'd rather have just one or the other (VC or screen on the dash). It certainly doesn't buy me any prestige, since it's available in every model, all the way down to the little A3.
I don't understand the bit about "when you are spending well over 40K for a car, you are putting in an investment - you'll pay for the options." Buying a car isn't an investment, it's an immediate 10% loss the second it hits pavement. This really proves my point entirely, that at least something like CarPlay would benefit from future improvements to software, whereas proprietary infotainment systems are usually fixed for good at some particular iteration. While I appreciate all the assumptions about the benefits of throwing cash at a car, it's just a simple fact that proprietary infotainment systems are incredibly underwhelming. In the case of my loaner, Audi is free to create a basic interface that allows me to adjust the vehicle settings, but beyond that, all I require is a nice screen with which to interact with my iPhone (also, it's incorrect to say it's "mirroring" the iPhone screen - it's not... not exactly, anyway).
It boils down to the fact that once I set my vehicle exterior/interior settings, I'll likely never touch them again. I don't need a pricey interface for that. On the other hand, I'm constantly interacting with my phone. Why? Because it's a gateway to the world and a very useful utility with which to generate income. I would prefer to interface with it the way Apple intended, not a 3rd party's interpretation. In the case of Audi (I haven't seen other systems lately, besides Lexus), they seem to agree. I know this because as mentioned, they've not updated their MMI in years and they've included CarPlay. They aren't going to pump a single dollar of R&D into MMI, but they'll still charge you several thousand for the "luxury".
Lexus Fanatic
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 35,474
Likes: 383
From: ON/NY
It is luxury to have either AC/AA. Not different than having the luxury of cylinder deactivation etc etc and being able to toggle that feature.
Lexus Test Driver
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 1,419
Likes: 11
From: California
It "barely impacts my travels" to the tune of about 2 hours a week. I literally did a head to head test a couple of weeks ago, and the actual commute home (on the same day, at the same time) turned out to be 35 minutes different--55 minutes vs. 1:30. I've also avoided 1-2.5 hour delays on longer trips thanks to traffic-based rerouting (confirmed by others making the same trip that took the "logical"/most direct route). That time is intensely valuable to me.
And yes, some higher-end cars include traffic data. But in my experience with our own Nissan (provided by XM NavTraffic) and Audi (Google maps), it doesn't seem to help much. In the example I gave above, Here maps with Google traffic resulted in a trip that took 50% longer, vs. Waze on my phone.
To put a finer point on it, a 2018MY car with one of the most well-regarded infotainment/navigation systems in the business is markedly inferior (in performance; it's WAY better-looking) at one of its most basic functions to an app on my phone when brand new. This gap will only widen as the vehicle ages and mobile technology continues to march onward.
And yes, some higher-end cars include traffic data. But in my experience with our own Nissan (provided by XM NavTraffic) and Audi (Google maps), it doesn't seem to help much. In the example I gave above, Here maps with Google traffic resulted in a trip that took 50% longer, vs. Waze on my phone.
To put a finer point on it, a 2018MY car with one of the most well-regarded infotainment/navigation systems in the business is markedly inferior (in performance; it's WAY better-looking) at one of its most basic functions to an app on my phone when brand new. This gap will only widen as the vehicle ages and mobile technology continues to march onward.
Google/Waze maybe does a big map update once a month versus the standard infotainment system of once a year (payment). I was trying to say: how often is a road going to change in a month that will affect your travels that dramatically? Its not like America is insanely quick with building roads and changing out roadways.
Is your Nissan an older vehicle? From my experience on my friend's C300 and 340i - I didn't find Apple Car Play or Android Auto any better than the standard infotainment system.
valid point about no youtube for the driver to see and i DO agree with you that AC/AA are not THAT useful right now, but to me the big thing either now or soon is actually useful and usable and reliable voice commands. cars still completely suck at this for the most part. if my phone makes it possible to ask the car 'remind me tonight that i have to pick up donuts on the way to work tomorrow', that's useful. or how about "where is my brother john right now?" or "what's the estimated travel time to my office?" or "sell 100 shares of aapl stock on my etrade account" or "play rolling stones" or on and on and on...
or how about "where is my brother john right now?" or "what's the estimated travel time to my office?" or "sell 100 shares of aapl stock on my etrade account" or "play rolling stones" or on and on and on...We are speaking different languages. Guess what, though, I have another Audi loaner today! Q5. I should post pics of "Virtual Cockpit". I forgot that VC is just a second screen for MMI where the usual gauge cluster is. So, now I have 2x the junk projecting the same interface. One thing Audi engineers overlooked is that due to varying driver seat positions, VC is usually only partially visible. If they are going to insist on it though, I would prefer to just have VC and no obnoxious screen jutting out of my dash It's nice the Lexus IS has integrated the screen nicely with the dash.
Anyway, it was nice to confirm (again) that Audi MMI hasn't changed an iota in the last 5+ years. The whole setup was completely unintuitive, and offers me nothing that I even need, other than access to basic car settings. What's more, it's not future proof and can't be upgraded. If you could upgrade it, I wouldn't have the same dated MMI in my 2013 Audi. Virtual Cockpit is a nice parlor trick, but I'd rather have just one or the other (VC or screen on the dash). It certainly doesn't buy me any prestige, since it's available in every model, all the way down to the little A3.
I don't understand the bit about "when you are spending well over 40K for a car, you are putting in an investment - you'll pay for the options." Buying a car isn't an investment, it's an immediate 10% loss the second it hits pavement. This really proves my point entirely, that at least something like CarPlay would benefit from future improvements to software, whereas proprietary infotainment systems are usually fixed for good at some particular iteration. While I appreciate all the assumptions about the benefits of throwing cash at a car, it's just a simple fact that proprietary infotainment systems are incredibly underwhelming. In the case of my loaner, Audi is free to create a basic interface that allows me to adjust the vehicle settings, but beyond that, all I require is a nice screen with which to interact with my iPhone (also, it's incorrect to say it's "mirroring" the iPhone screen - it's not... not exactly, anyway).
It boils down to the fact that once I set my vehicle exterior/interior settings, I'll likely never touch them again. I don't need a pricey interface for that. On the other hand, I'm constantly interacting with my phone. Why? Because it's a gateway to the world and a very useful utility with which to generate income. I would prefer to interface with it the way Apple intended, not a 3rd party's interpretation. In the case of Audi (I haven't seen other systems lately, besides Lexus), they seem to agree. I know this because as mentioned, they've not updated their MMI in years and they've included CarPlay. They aren't going to pump a single dollar of R&D into MMI, but they'll still charge you several thousand for the "luxury".
It's nice the Lexus IS has integrated the screen nicely with the dash.Anyway, it was nice to confirm (again) that Audi MMI hasn't changed an iota in the last 5+ years. The whole setup was completely unintuitive, and offers me nothing that I even need, other than access to basic car settings. What's more, it's not future proof and can't be upgraded. If you could upgrade it, I wouldn't have the same dated MMI in my 2013 Audi. Virtual Cockpit is a nice parlor trick, but I'd rather have just one or the other (VC or screen on the dash). It certainly doesn't buy me any prestige, since it's available in every model, all the way down to the little A3.
I don't understand the bit about "when you are spending well over 40K for a car, you are putting in an investment - you'll pay for the options." Buying a car isn't an investment, it's an immediate 10% loss the second it hits pavement. This really proves my point entirely, that at least something like CarPlay would benefit from future improvements to software, whereas proprietary infotainment systems are usually fixed for good at some particular iteration. While I appreciate all the assumptions about the benefits of throwing cash at a car, it's just a simple fact that proprietary infotainment systems are incredibly underwhelming. In the case of my loaner, Audi is free to create a basic interface that allows me to adjust the vehicle settings, but beyond that, all I require is a nice screen with which to interact with my iPhone (also, it's incorrect to say it's "mirroring" the iPhone screen - it's not... not exactly, anyway).
It boils down to the fact that once I set my vehicle exterior/interior settings, I'll likely never touch them again. I don't need a pricey interface for that. On the other hand, I'm constantly interacting with my phone. Why? Because it's a gateway to the world and a very useful utility with which to generate income. I would prefer to interface with it the way Apple intended, not a 3rd party's interpretation. In the case of Audi (I haven't seen other systems lately, besides Lexus), they seem to agree. I know this because as mentioned, they've not updated their MMI in years and they've included CarPlay. They aren't going to pump a single dollar of R&D into MMI, but they'll still charge you several thousand for the "luxury".
You said:
Virtual Cockpit is available in a base A4 with "Virtual Cockpit" selected
Obviously - its not future proof. Cars are never future proof - that's the big part of the industry. It makes you want to buy another car and another car right after that one. You think your Apple Car Play and Android is future proof? It seems future proof with updates now but on the car makers end - they perhaps - improve integration. What I want to say is a seamless integration where its not a mirroring service anymore - where you can use Audi Virtual Cockpit with Google Maps and Waze.
Again - you fail realize - not all Audi have Virtual Cockpits. Base-level cars usually don't offer it. Besides - Virtual Cockpit is suppose to bring you prestige as an Audi-owner. Its one of the best digital gauges out there right now and its only offered on Audi models. Think about this way: you think a car that only uses Apple Car Play is more prestigious than Virtual Cockpit Audi? Not likely - because Apple Car Play is generic.
You failed to understand my meaning of "investment". I'm not talking about drawing back profits. I'm talking about keeping the car for the long haul. If you purchase a car with no options on it and only use Apple Car Play, your car is worthless and less luxurious than someone else that got everything. It was a direct reply to your comment of saying: "options don't make a car luxurious". Options make the car more luxurious because your car has more options....
Yes - CarPlay would benefit from future improvement to software. Like I said - to how long though? You think Apple Car Play will be the same now versus 10 years from now? Things change - things will always change in the market. This is just how capitalism works.
To each their own. For me, personally, I don't want to spend thousands of dollars on a luxury car just to save a few thousand to skip an infotainment system just to run my iPhone all time.
I don't believe its "luxury" to have either AC/AA. Having Apple Car Play and Auto Android does not affect the luxury status of the car in anyway. Think about it this way: is the Lexus LC/LS and BMW 7 Series any less luxurious because they don't have Android Auto or Apple Car Play? Definitely no. Those things are insanely luxurious regardless of a mirroring service.
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I don't believe its "luxury" to have either AC/AA. Having Apple Car Play and Auto Android does not affect the luxury status of the car in anyway. Think about it this way: is the Lexus LC/LS and BMW 7 Series any less luxurious because they don't have Android Auto or Apple Car Play? Definitely no. Those things are insanely luxurious regardless of a mirroring service.
Last edited by Toys4RJill; Sep 25, 2018 at 01:10 PM.