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Beautiful in any trim. The shape is very reminiscent of the Levante.
Unfortunately, like the Giulia, it's interior is an entire generation behind the competition in design, quality, and technology. You've really got to love the way it looks and drives to dismiss those other shortcomings. The F-pace is also flawed in this manner.
I've actually found all the recent Alfas, Maseratis, and Jags to be great looking cars and SUVs that just kind of suck in every other way. At the end of the day, the most solid and well-engineered luxury vehicles come from Germany (with Lexus not far behind).
Last edited by BrownPride; Dec 3, 2016 at 01:35 PM.
My mistake -- it cannot be Mazda-based, since it is RWD and not FWD.
True, but regardless of the drive wheels, it can look like a CX-5.
Given the current popularity of SUVs, it will be interesting to see whether it can actually sell in the U.S., where the Alfa badge has about as much appeal as overcooked pasta.
Last edited by mmarshall; Dec 3, 2016 at 08:47 PM.
True, but regardless of the drive wheels, it can look like a CX-5.
Given the current popularity of SUVs, it will be interesting to see whether it can actually sell in the U.S., where the Alfa badge has about as much appeal as overcooked pasta.
I don't think Alfa Romeo carries the negative connotation you think it does. It's going to be a niche luxury brand just like Jaguar.
I don't think Alfa Romeo carries the negative connotation you think it does. It's going to be a niche luxury brand just like Jaguar.
Very niche at best....although, of course, we are living in an age of SUVs, which could boost the Stelvio's sales. Alfa does carry a negative connotation in unreliability. That's one of the things that forced it out of the U.S. market 20 years ago....along with low sales and excessive, costly government regulations. But, of course, things can change in 20 years....as Hyundai and Kia have proved so well.
Very niche at best....although, of course, we are living in an age of SUVs, which could boost the Stelvio's sales. Alfa does carry a negative connotation in unreliability. That's one of the things that forced it out of the U.S. market 20 years ago....along with low sales and excessive, costly government regulations. But, of course, things can change in 20 years....as Hyundai and Kia have proved so well.
Why do you say very? The Giulia and Stelvio are right at the heart of 2 very popular segments. People who want something stylish and different than the normal will definitely be drawn their way.
I'm well aware of the reasons Alfa Romeo left the U.S. market and the reputation for unreliability, but that doesn't mean Alfa Romeo has the appeal of "overcooked pasta." It is still seen as a upscale brand and a bit of an "exotic" choice in the market. Jaguar and Land Rover have never had a reputation for reliability yet are doing just fine. People are gobbling up Grand Cherokee's like there's no tomorrow and its spotty reliability has been well documented. For the record, I seriously doubt these Alfas will have high reliability but I do think they will be a compelling alternative to the norm. They're just Italian Jaguars in my mind.
Why do you say very? The Giulia and Stelvio are right at the heart of 2 very popular segments. People who want something stylish and different than the normal will definitely be drawn their way.
I'm well aware of the reasons Alfa Romeo left the U.S. market and the reputation for unreliability, but that doesn't mean Alfa Romeo has the appeal of "overcooked pasta."
OK, partly I could have used a better term, and partly you misunderstood me. What I meant was not that the brand has no appeal among its "Alfisti" enthusiasts (it does), but that it is not, and probably never will be, a mainstream brand in the U.S. I agree, though, that the Stelvio is likely to outsell the 4C.
It is still seen as a upscale brand and a bit of an "exotic" choice in the market. Jaguar and Land Rover have never had a reputation for reliability yet are doing just fine. People are gobbling up Grand Cherokee's like there's no tomorrow and its spotty reliability has been well documented. For the record, I seriously doubt these Alfas will have high reliability but I do think they will be a compelling alternative to the norm. They're just Italian Jaguars in my mind.
Yes, Consumer Reports has panned Grand Cherokee reliability. But general experience with them by owners, here on Car Chat, has been mixed...and actually more on the good side more than bad, with reliability. Steve and Bitkahuna, for example, were generally quite pleased with theirs. And I found every one of the present-generation (non-SRT) versions I've sampled quite pleasant to sit in and drive.
I wouldn't quite call the Stelvio an Italian Jaguar (that would probably be a better term for the Maserati SUV), but I agree it will certainly be an unusual alternative to the norm.
Why is it that people can claim the spindle grille to be ugly but NO ONE will say that the Alfa Romeo horse collar grille is ugly. This must be the absolutely worse grille design, apart from the Edsel.
Come on, Alfa, where is your horse? Horse... your carriage awaits.
Why is it that people can claim the spindle grille to be ugly but NO ONE will say that the Alfa Romeo horse collar grille is ugly.
Well, some people may simply disagree about the Alfa grilles being ugly. Personally, it's not one of my favorites as to its general shape, but at least it is not way oversized like on some makes.
OK, partly I could have used a better term, and partly you misunderstood me. What I meant was not that the brand has no appeal among its "Alfisti" enthusiasts (it does), but that it is not, and probably never will be, a mainstream brand in the U.S. I agree, though, that the Stelvio is likely to outsell the 4C.
Well I would hope so, the 4c has a very narrow appeal. Not many people are out there looking to purchase a bare bones sports car with manual steering and scant sound deadening. This will have much more mass appeal as it will be equipped with similar technology to its competitors and be expected to drive just as nicely a sporting bent. The dynamic target was the Porsche Macan. There really isn't anything particularly unique about the Stelvio that should prevent it from being considered in comparison to other brands, outside perhaps the limited but growing dealership network.
Originally Posted by mmarshall
Yes, Consumer Reports has panned Grand Cherokee reliability. But general experience with them by owners, here on Car Chat, has been mixed...and actually more on the good side more than bad, with reliability. Steve and Bitkahuna, for example, were generally quite pleased with theirs. And I found every one of the present-generation (non-SRT) versions I've sampled quite pleasant to sit in and drive.
The extremely anecdotal evidence in this forum is just that, so I don't really see that as a point of discussion. And no one has ever aid they don't drive well, I was purely talking about reliability. Jaguars and Land Rovers were pleasant to sit and drive too, didn't make them any better after purchase from a reliability discussion. My point was that reliability isn't the paramount concern for all consumers.
Originally Posted by mmarshall
I wouldn't quite call the Stelvio an Italian Jaguar (that would probably be a better term for the Maserati SUV), but I agree it will certainly be an unusual alternative to the norm.
You missed my point- the same type of buyer that purchases a Jaguar would buy a Alfa Romeo. Alfa Romeo and Maserati have the same type of buyer just at different price points, for the record. And if we really want to go there, the Jaguar F-Pace is smaller and much cheaper than a Maserati Levante. It is closer in size and will be far closer in price to the Stelvio. Both the Stelvio and F-Pace are BMW X3 competitors.
Originally Posted by Sulu
Why is it that people can claim the spindle grille to be ugly but NO ONE will say that the Alfa Romeo horse collar grille is ugly. This must be the absolutely worse grille design, apart from the Edsel.
Come on, Alfa, where is your horse? Horse... your carriage awaits.
-snip-
You could have at least posted a production picture instead of that inaccurate photoshop.
You could have at least posted a production picture instead of that inaccurate photoshop.
There is a lot of hypocrisy and this is a perfect example right here. You ask me to post a more flattering photo of the Alfa horse collar, yet when people post pictures of the spindle grille on the new RX, taken with a fish-eye lens from waist level, they are never asked to post a more flattering photo.
Styling is subjective. What some people find ugly, others like.
There is a lot of hypocrisy and this is a perfect example right here. You ask me to post a more flattering photo of the Alfa horse collar, yet when people post pictures of the spindle grille on the new RX, taken with a fish-eye lens from waist level, they are never asked to post a more flattering photo.
Styling is subjective. What some people find ugly, others like.
No, this is a completely different situation. You posted a picture of a car that doesn't exist. I don't care about what angle the car is posted at or if you think it looks like a glorified Mazda CX-5. All I asked was for you to post a picture of the production Stelvio, not a photoshop that includes styling elements that aren't even on the actual real car. If you can't see the difference then I believe you're being willfully dense.
Agree with TangoRed. Alfa and Jaguar are targeting the same customers, and are both entering the same two high volume luxury segments with the XE/Giulia and the F-PACE/Stelvio. Something non-100K unit 3 Series and C-Class. Something that has some styling flair, and the premise of sharpened driving dynamics.
The Giulia has driving dynamics nailed, and with much of these segments heavily catered towards leasing customers, questions about long-term reliability as fairly moot at this point. That will be answered within the first few years and will impact whether or not there will be demand for the off-lease/CPO vehicles.
