So what is it with drivers these days?
Thread Starter
Lead Lap
Joined: Oct 2002
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From: TX
Exactly. The German standard may be unique because their take on driving is that it's a skill. North America treats it as a free-for-all where anything goes as long as local law enforcement is not around.
In my burg where redneck goofiness is on display all day and in all ways: eg. high brow lady in a Nissan CUV pulls out of a side street in an urban neighborhood and promptly speeds up behind me to get to know me better. This as I'm doing just under the speed limit to the red light at the intersection about four blocks ahead.
It's a speeding and get-outta-my-way epidemic that is unenforced because cops don't like doing traffic duty - not sexy enough.
Tougher standards for licensing for sure. The price of entry needs to be higher in terms of skill.
Look to the aviation world - you'll see why pilots are strictly controlled in how they fly and what they fly. Not advocating that for car drivers but you know some aspects wouldn't hurt.
Lane discipline, speeds, car control, tailgating and aggresive road behaviour, distracted driving. These are all issues leading to all of this.
In my burg where redneck goofiness is on display all day and in all ways: eg. high brow lady in a Nissan CUV pulls out of a side street in an urban neighborhood and promptly speeds up behind me to get to know me better. This as I'm doing just under the speed limit to the red light at the intersection about four blocks ahead.
It's a speeding and get-outta-my-way epidemic that is unenforced because cops don't like doing traffic duty - not sexy enough.
Tougher standards for licensing for sure. The price of entry needs to be higher in terms of skill.
Look to the aviation world - you'll see why pilots are strictly controlled in how they fly and what they fly. Not advocating that for car drivers but you know some aspects wouldn't hurt.
Lane discipline, speeds, car control, tailgating and aggresive road behaviour, distracted driving. These are all issues leading to all of this.
Lexus Test Driver
Joined: Jan 2007
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From: CA
Originally Posted by dseag2
Can't agree more. There are many times on the freeway that I have had to move over to the right lane and fly across two lanes just to get in front of the ******* that is going too slow in the left lane.
Thread Starter
Lead Lap
Joined: Oct 2002
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From: TX
Lexus Fanatic
Joined: Oct 2003
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From: Virginia/D.C. suburbs
I was a licensed pilot myself (and Ground Instructor). Aviation, like driving, also sometimes has strict speed limits , With some exceptions, like for the military, air shows, and fighters, most planes are strictly limited to 250 knots IAS (Indicated Air Speed, which is different from True Air Speed), below 10,000 feet MSL (Mean Sea Level). Aircraft are often tracked and controlled by transponders, particularly in Positive-Control Airspace. Pilots, like drivers, who exceed the limit, can be fined, given infractions, or have their licenses suspended/revoked.
Lexus Test Driver
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From: NT
Paddle shifters are an attentive drivers best friend. 😈
Lexus Champion
Joined: Jul 2013
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From: RightHere
I was a licensed pilot myself (and Ground Instructor). Aviation, like driving, also sometimes has strict speed limits , With some exceptions, like for the military, air shows, and fighters, most planes are strictly limited to 250 knots IAS (Indicated Air Speed, which is different from True Air Speed), below 10,000 feet MSL (Mean Sea Level). Aircraft are often tracked and controlled by transponders, particularly in Positive-Control Airspace. Pilots, like drivers, who exceed the limit, can be fined, given infractions, or have their licenses suspended/revoked.
Your speeds and settings are everything. It's the most basic aspect of operating anything.
Most of the Fast-Master Superheroes in their fancy pickup hickup trucks and various other metal would fail a basic flying test. Ice on the road - speed up and tailgate, lol. Opposite of what a sane person or a pilot would do.
Lexus Champion
Joined: Jul 2013
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From: RightHere
I must live in a totally different world in Dallas, because NO ONE speeds up for anything. I am always stuck behind cars that are going less than the speed limit. It's like they don't have lives or anywhere to go. Must be a laid-back Southern thing. The good part is that coming from South Florida where everyone drives aggressively it is always easy to find opportunities to get around them.
But where I live... wild west frontier and that's no joke. It sort of works because people only kill each other once in awhile. But drivers in my area code challenge you all the time. Grannies, kids, texting types, general all around butthats.
It's one of the reasons I actually enjoy my GS. It will in fact quickly deal with tailgating yahoos, and assorted idiots with its power and cornering ability.
I actually find American drivers more civilized in Canada. Maybe because they are going to be more careful and there's the aspect of US to metric speed limits. And this is from a guy who has driven on L.A. freeways and Montana highways.
Lexus Fanatic
Joined: Oct 2003
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From: Virginia/D.C. suburbs
if you get a chance, though, try out a Piper PA-28 Cherokee. Same engine as the regular 172 Skyhawk, but the wing-design and flying characteristics make it more stable than a high-wing Cessna on the approach and landing, particularly in turbulence or a crowding, with can be dicey in a Cessna. The Piper's main drawbacks are only one single door for the cabin and the difficulty of looking under the wings on the pre-flight, fuel-****, and tie-down.
Most of the Fast-Master Superheroes in their fancy pickup hickup trucks and various other metal would fail a basic flying test. Ice on the road - speed up and tailgate, lol. Opposite of what a sane person or a pilot would do.
Last edited by mmarshall; Mar 27, 2016 at 09:31 PM.
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Lead Lap
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From: West Coast
I think it wholly depends on the area in which you live. Whenever I am in the Pacific NW, people drive very cautiously and the area is notorious for left-lane campers. WA State has even started ticketing people for hogging the left lane. Most roads are very narrow, are 1 or 2 lanes in each direction, have 40 mph speed limits tops, and everything is very close together, so people are just used to driving slowly.
Then when I'm in LA it's another world, where people drive so dangerously it all times of the day. They tail, swerve lanes, drive 95 then slow down to 70 and do it all over again. It's really nuts. I suppose you have to do that in order to beat LA traffic.
I'm in the upper Midwest now and people are more aggressive than in the Pacific NW but it's nothing like LA.
Then when I'm in LA it's another world, where people drive so dangerously it all times of the day. They tail, swerve lanes, drive 95 then slow down to 70 and do it all over again. It's really nuts. I suppose you have to do that in order to beat LA traffic.
I'm in the upper Midwest now and people are more aggressive than in the Pacific NW but it's nothing like LA.
Lexus Fanatic
Joined: Oct 2003
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From: Virginia/D.C. suburbs
I think it wholly depends on the area in which you live. Whenever I am in the Pacific NW, people drive very cautiously and the area is notorious for left-lane campers. WA State has even started ticketing people for hogging the left lane. Most roads are very narrow, are 1 or 2 lanes in each direction, have 40 mph speed limits tops, and everything is very close together, so people are just used to driving slowly.
Then when I'm in LA it's another world, where people drive so dangerously it all times of the day. They tail, swerve lanes, drive 95 then slow down to 70 and do it all over again. It's really nuts. I suppose you have to do that in order to beat LA traffic.
I'm in the upper Midwest now and people are more aggressive than in the Pacific NW but it's nothing like LA.
Then when I'm in LA it's another world, where people drive so dangerously it all times of the day. They tail, swerve lanes, drive 95 then slow down to 70 and do it all over again. It's really nuts. I suppose you have to do that in order to beat LA traffic.
I'm in the upper Midwest now and people are more aggressive than in the Pacific NW but it's nothing like LA.
Lexus Test Driver
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 6,284
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From: Long Island
The main problem, though, with the left-lane rule is that so many people want to go substantially faster than the posted speed limit, even if it is simply too fast for conditions.....in other works, "**** the law, I'm going to drive as I please or just not use common sense." While I agree that those in the left lane should move to the right if they are holding up traffic and/or if there is an opening in traffic, that alone is not an excuse for speeding. One does not have a legal right to speed just because one happens to be in the left lane, impatient, and/or decides to show contempt for the law. Speed limits are set by traffic engineers, usually for good reason...and not just to collect revenue. Of course, in Germany, there are some stretches of road with no speed limit at all...but even those areas are shrinking because of increasing traffic congestion.
Now, I'm not saying that one has to just sit there and nail the limit, like on cruise-control...leeway is built into speed-enforcement for a number of reasons, and most police, radar/laser, or speed-cameras won't bother you if you are within 10 MPH or so of the posted limit. But too many people simply think that the left lane is a race-track, and IMO they are as bad or worse than Grandpa or Grandma plodding along at 40 MPH.
Now, I'm not saying that one has to just sit there and nail the limit, like on cruise-control...leeway is built into speed-enforcement for a number of reasons, and most police, radar/laser, or speed-cameras won't bother you if you are within 10 MPH or so of the posted limit. But too many people simply think that the left lane is a race-track, and IMO they are as bad or worse than Grandpa or Grandma plodding along at 40 MPH.
doing 100 in some old jeep wrangler (if it'll even go that high) and a flagship luxury sedan are very different experiences and thus should be treated as such. as long as everyone can follow the simple rule of keep right except while passing there's literally no danger. high end cars can very rapidly increase and decrease their speed at a rate most people don't even know is possible, so of course they're likely to get hysterical when they hear that someone was going OVER 100 MPH!!!
take this E63 for example (skip to 17 seconds):
there's no reason why it and a 23 year old ford pickup truck should be treated as equal vehicles. i would never advocate weaving in and out of cars but it is possible to safely drive much more than the speed limit
Lexus Fanatic
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From: Virginia/D.C. suburbs
Well, that's just it. You hit the nail on the head. E63s were designed and built for the No-Speed-Limit Autobahn....not for 55 MPH to 75 MPH American Interstates, But that doesn't give them the authority to go Autobahn speeds on American roads, even if they can do so safely in uncongested areas. Unfortunately, we can't have a different speed limit on the same Interstate highway for each car, depending on just how it is designed and built. To do so would be unfeasible.
I've done both E63 and C63 reviews, BTW (both, of course, on American roads, not driving them flat-out).....and, yes, even under those conditions, they are wicked machines. The last E63 I drove had 507 HP and 469 ft-lbs (the latest ones have even more)....and, had I not kept the traction-control turned on, its throttle-response was of such force that I'm sure it could have done a burnout for an entire city block, reminiscent of late-60s American muscle-cars.
I've done both E63 and C63 reviews, BTW (both, of course, on American roads, not driving them flat-out).....and, yes, even under those conditions, they are wicked machines. The last E63 I drove had 507 HP and 469 ft-lbs (the latest ones have even more)....and, had I not kept the traction-control turned on, its throttle-response was of such force that I'm sure it could have done a burnout for an entire city block, reminiscent of late-60s American muscle-cars.
Last edited by mmarshall; Mar 27, 2016 at 10:14 PM.
Lexus Test Driver
Joined: Apr 2012
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From: Long Island
Well, that's just it. You hit the nail on the head. E63s were designed and built for the No-Speed-Limit Autobahn....not for 55 MPH to 75 MPH American Interstates, But that doesn't give them the authority to go Autobahn speeds on American roads, even if they can do so safely in uncongested areas. Unfortunately, we can't have a different speed limit on the same Interstate highway for each car, depending on just how it is designed and built. To do so would be unfeasible.
I've done both E63 and C63 reviews, BTW (both, of course, on American roads, not driving them flat-out).....and, yes, even under those conditions, they are wicked machines. The last E63 I drove had 507 HP and 469 ft-lbs (the latest ones have even more)....and, had I not kept the traction-control turned on, its throttle-response was of such force that I'm sure it could have done a burnout for an entire city block, reminiscent of late-60s American muscle-cars.
I've done both E63 and C63 reviews, BTW (both, of course, on American roads, not driving them flat-out).....and, yes, even under those conditions, they are wicked machines. The last E63 I drove had 507 HP and 469 ft-lbs (the latest ones have even more)....and, had I not kept the traction-control turned on, its throttle-response was of such force that I'm sure it could have done a burnout for an entire city block, reminiscent of late-60s American muscle-cars.
non "enthusiasts" also just usually don't even really want to drive all that fast. they're happy to just trundle along in their kia or whatever and probably wouldn't even notice that the limit was changed. and btw speed limits are set by politicians who want to increase revenues and not just traffic engineers. and if it truly is the 'limit' then why hasn't everyone already died?
i remember seeing this months ago, it'll explain it better than i could
Lexus Champion
Joined: Jul 2013
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From: RightHere
The 172, in a number of areas, was a much better plane than the 152...heavier, more stable, more power, and better payload without having to worry as much about weight-and-balance issues. I was lucky to be able to fly a fixed-pitch, fixed-gear 172 Skyhawk/Cutlass with the larger 180 HP Lycoming engine...only four of them were ever built.
if you get a chance, though, try out a Piper PA-28 Cherokee. Same engine as the regular 172 Skyhawk, but the wing-design and flying characteristics make it more stable than a high-wing Cessna on the approach and landing, particularly in turbulence or a crowding, with can be dicey in a Cessna. The Piper's main drawbacks are only one single door for the cabin and the difficulty of looking under the wings on the pre-flight, fuel-****, and tie-down.
if you get a chance, though, try out a Piper PA-28 Cherokee. Same engine as the regular 172 Skyhawk, but the wing-design and flying characteristics make it more stable than a high-wing Cessna on the approach and landing, particularly in turbulence or a crowding, with can be dicey in a Cessna. The Piper's main drawbacks are only one single door for the cabin and the difficulty of looking under the wings on the pre-flight, fuel-****, and tie-down.
Trained at a rural airport so you'd be going down the approach and then the thermals from freshly plowed farm fields would start causing problems. I had to overshoot one approach because there was no way I was going to get to the numbers on the runway.
In the winter it was the opposite - you had to be careful not to undershoot, which I did. My favorite story is the one where I had the main gear blasting through some snow drifts at the approach end. Man was that a short field landing. My instructor and I had a good laugh afterwards. No harm done and no damage. Just didn't see how tall those drifts were.
Lexus Test Driver
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 1,266
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From: NY / LI
People are getting crazier and crazier these days, switching lanes, passing people on the shoulders, and tailgating in bumper to bumper traffic. Nothing gets me more pissed than some a-hole riding my bumper while driving 5mph in traffic. I mean whats the point, there is traffic all around, you can't go anywhere but you still have to ride someone's bumper...
And WTF is it with Altima and Prius drivers, in my experience they're lunatics!!
Ok, done venting.....For now..
Last edited by JT4; Mar 30, 2016 at 10:39 AM.