For inexperienced or careless mechanics/technicians, working with their heads in their butts, lots of things can go wrong during a (seemingly) simple oil change. Drain plug not screwed on tight enough, causing leaks (or too tight, stripping the threads), oil filter too loose or too tight, also causing leaks or thread-stripping, wrong filter itself used (sometimes the wrong ones will still fit the base and thread-pattern), oil filter O-ring not finger-lubed with a thin film of oil as required, wrong grade/viscosity oil used for the vehicle-model, too little or too much oil added, oil spilled on hot (or potentially hot) engine parts, engine started back up before oil change is complete (it happens, especially at some quick-lube shops like Jiffy-Lube). Or, if they want to be crooked enough, they can do what some of the West Coast Jiffy-Lubes have done (and have gotten caught doing)......just out-and-out charge customers for work that was deliberately not done.

Of course, one would assume (and, in most cases, one would be correct) that Toyota/Lexus dealership service bays, and those from other auto manufacturers, are not going to indulge in such nonsense, and that they hire technicians that are not only ASE-certified but have manufacturer/factory training as well. But, even if a shop is honest, human beings, even the sharpest ones (never mind the heads-in-butts), occasionally make honest mistakes. A wise and prudent shop will recognize that, and stand behind the work they do, even if and when those mistakes happen.

 

I didn't read through all the posts, since im sure a lot of people already chimed in

However, I will say, I am looking into buying a 95 or earlier sedan or coupe BMW 318. When I do, the motor is going to be pulled out along with the tranny and swap it with either 1jz or 2jz w/r154 tranny. The reliability of these motors, and somewhat least expensive parts, it should be easy and cheap to work on. Now, when I say, least expensive. I am comparing it to BMWs and Mercedes

 

We're not talking about Jirfy Lube, or some hack, we're talking about a good, independent machanic with references and a reputation.

And ASE/Lexus techs do not change oil at Lexus dealers.

 

Did I say just oil and filter change?

All service and parts are warranted for 24 month or 24k...now that is something I have no problem paying extra for. Knowing it will be done right, at spec, and with real OEM parts is good in my opinion.

 

Same general idea, though....at least as I see it. Any good repair/service shop, dealership or not, should stand behind their work. Otherwise, even with lower-than dealer prices, what incentive is there for customers to take their business there? And many independent shops these days (Pat Goss's included) won't hire people without at least an ASE rating.

 

But what are you having done on a newer/under warranty car other than changing fluids and filters? Nothing.

Is there no end to the additional amount that you will pay? For instance when I first stopped usin the dealer was when I had the timing belt done at Lexus in my 03 ES at a cost of $1600 when the independent I found would have done it for $800. is it worth twice as much?

Remember, at my independent or a Toyota dealer its all done right, at spec, and with real OEM parts. So what did I get for that $800? The receipt with Lexus on it. $500 for brakes at the dealer, $280 at my guy.

 

$800 rental coverage for driving there 2015 Lexus around, while your car is being repaired. Didn't you read the fine print on the back of the last page you never got lol jk. Its unreal how Lexus can get away with that price. In 08, the stealerships hourly price was $101. I just found out its $175/hr.

I would never take my car to a stealership unless its a recall problem. Other than that, I will take it to my guy who charges $80/hr to work on my car.

Edit: That being said, a friend and I plan to do a gasket overhaul to my motor. This way, I can learn the ins and outs of the motor, so when I decide to go boost, I know what I am looking at. A complete Toyota gasket kit was just under $300 from mvpmotorsports

 

My last really maintenance intensive Lexus was an LX470, there were a number of sevices needed before the warranty period was over, items such as lubrication front drive bushings, lub and re torque of the propeller shaft, brake fluid, air filter, engine coolant, and AC filter were all needed every 30k. This was needed at 30k.

Our current 4 banger Tacoma 4WD which we are ditching this week has brake fluid change, propeller shaft lube, tighten propeller shaft bolts, brake fluid replacent all before the warrant expires...and oil and filter of course.

After the warranty, I recall having AVS fluid changes and timing belts, I would not leave those two services in the hands of an independent, especially when Lexus will warrant the parts and labour for 2 years or 24k.

 

You're exactly the customer the dealer is looking for LOL. You trust blindly that the dealer is going to know best how to do this "complicated" work on your "complicated" vehicle, and that they will stand behind the work, and you will pay any premium to have that "security". I've owned Lexus vehicles and had them serviced at the dealer and elsewhere for 17 years, I have found nothing that shows me there is any truth in any of that.

I have had plenty of instances where the Lexus dealer has damaged by vehicle, been unable to find problems where my independent has found them, done poor quality work that required redoing. The latest issue with my navigation system I wound up diagnosing it for them after they replaced the entire radio for no reason. Gee, who would have thought a fault that said "Unable to read SD card" would indicate an issue with the SD card? Anybody who isn't an idiot just reading out of a troubleshooting manual. I'm not paying that idiot $150 an hour to do that, sorry.

Look at what you're talking about, changing brake fluid, replacing coolant, tightening shaft bolts, replacing an air filter, changing a timing belt...these things are VERY simple and easy services. You can easily do them yourself with the time and proper tools...any schmo at a gas station can do them really, save for maybe the timing belt. The dealer tries to sell you on the fact that these things are specialized and difficult but thats BS. Its just a fancy Toyota, it has more in common with a Corolla or a Camry than anything else, even my LS. Thats the beauty of a Lexus vs an Audi, BMW or MB...that they are really a basic and simple vehicle to work on.

Remember, my independent IS a Lexus master tech. So, I no longer trust him because he left the employ of a Lexus dealership?

As for the warranty, the 2 year 24k warranty is something YOUR dealer offers. The reason they offer that is its no risk to them...because theres nothing to cover. "Hey, if my propeller shaft needs re-torquing in 2 years or 24k miles they'll re-torque it!", "hey, if my brake fluid winds up being bad, they'll redo it!".

I will argue that the dealer has the right to charge what they can because customers are willing to pay. I will even agree myself to use the dealer for a certain premium for the better experience and the perks such as a loaner. But, nothing in my decades of ownership and participation in Lexus forums has led me to believe that the dealer has any claim on being able to offer better quality work or better care of my vehicle than my trusted independent shop. You're totally fooling yourself if you believe that.

 

I have owned my 01 IS300 for the past 9 years. I bought it used at 80k miles. It currently has 280k miles on the clock. Not once have I taken my car to the dealership to have it serviced. And in that time, I never had my drive shaft retorqued and I have never heard of a drive shaft coming loose from not being retorqued.

And can you verify that they replaced the brake fluid? Im going to say, they looked at the fill tank and called it a day. They only do brake fluids when changing your brake pads. Engine coolant is the same thing. If it looks green or red and full, then its done. I have a friend who works at a Chevy dealership. He tells me, the more cars that touch his hands, the bigger commission he gets. In short, the less work they do, the bigger check they receive. That's the downfall of a big corporation.



You do realize, independent shops are just as qualified as dealerships? The independent shops hire the same people that Lexus does, who went to UTI and are ASE certified. The big problem with a big corporation like Lexus, is that they don't care about their employees and further more, their customers. They look at revenue and all they care about is numbers that start with a $ dollar sign. Some people feel comfortable to spend $2000 on a timing belt service through Lexus. If you have that much money, spread the wealth
Let me know when to send you my paypal account for the donation

This...

 

The other thing is, dealerships primarily do scheduled maintenance and warranty repairs on new or newer cars. By the time cars get old enough to need more significant repairs, or repairs troubleshooted, etc their owners have stopped using the dealer because of cost. When you have an older car, and you have a repair that a mechanic needs to figure out I would argue that an independent mechanic than knows the older cars better than the newer cars would do a significantly better job than the dealer.

For instance, my guy owns a 2000 LS400 and a 2004 LS430 himself. He works on cars 10+ years old every day, if I had a car like that and I needed something significant done, he's going to know a lot more about that car than the tech at the dealer that spends most of his time changing oil and tracking down rattles on new/newer cars. I very rarely see older cars in the service lane at my dealer.

Take my 03 ES for instance. At about 150k miles I had the lower control arms replaced, the dealer was $3,500. He told me what parts to buy and where to buy them from, parts cost me about $700, then he did the labor replacing them for about $800. So I wound up spending $1,500, not only did I save $2,000 but they had done the same repair several times that month, had the dealer? Probably not.

Now, what argument can you make that the dealer would have been worth that extra $2,000? That car is still in the family and riding great on those OEM control arms. I'd rather have him do it and take a little vacation! You can say "well the dealer would have warrantied it"...even if I had paid for the repair twice...I STILL would have saved $500. What is the justification for me as an owner paying that enormous additional cost?