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Spy Shots: Latest Cadillac XTS prototype caught (STS/DTS replacement)

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Old 03-13-11, 08:00 PM
  #16  
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Originally Posted by 97-SC300 View Post
Nobody is saying there is something wrong with that. I was just pointing out that this consistency is very boring. There is nothing to look forward to because odds are, if they keep on this path, the next design will look near identical with only minor tweaks.
Seems to work for BMW and Mercedes. And Porsche's redesigns are almost unrealized with each generation.

I would say Cadillac's redesigns are more significant. Comparing the the first gen CTS to the 2nd is hugely different.
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Old 03-14-11, 12:08 PM
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Originally Posted by mmarshall View Post
Cadillac still needs a big, heavy, smooth, soft-riding car for the old folks, though. That need was nicely fulfilled with the DTS ...
don't know when you last drove one. it was about 5 years for me, and i'd driven every generation of it back into the 80s (when it was sedan de ville, right? - ex's relatives had 'em one after another) - and they had gotten progressively firmer and firmer, esp. with northstar engine, with particularly hard tires it seemed. the suspension still could float but i don't know if they'd put stiff anti-roll bars on 'em or something but they were nothing like caddy's of old. for example, going over speed bumps in a parking lot road was very noticeable - the car did not just 'soak them up' like an old caddy would.

also, those old boat suspensions may have been comfy, but were a huge liability in evasive maneuver or bad weather conditions. thankfully, they're never coming back.

anyway, i completely disagree about caddy needing a big heavy smooth soft-riding car for the old folks. old folks need a smooth, soft-riding CUV! one they can get in and out of easy, but isn't huge so they don't hit things while parking. they will also have interior 'blue hair detectors' and flash rear lights when detection occurs. ok, that last part i keed i keed.

actually, i'm seeing older folks around here buying priuses, sonatas, the new taurus... but i did recently take a trip down to "The Villages" nearby which is a GIANT 55+ community (over 35,000 homes!) and was amused to still see some giant hulking old school town cars and crown vics with two round bellied guys up front and two 'q-tip' frail women in back)

where are the smooth-rider fans going to go without spending $90,000 for a Mercedes S-class?
tons of options. buick. toyota avalon. even the prius with standard 15's is pretty darned soft.

But, of course, good suspension engineering can do wonders for a ride-handling combo...the old DTS, admittedly, had comfort, but it also anything but good handling. And, I'll admit, when I sampled the new Buick LaCrosse, I was very impressed with the steering/chassis, which lacked some of the pillow-softness of the old LaCrosse, but still retained some ride comfort and had a far better ride/handling combo.
ah, catching up to this part of your post, seems like we're more on the same page.
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Old 03-14-11, 12:24 PM
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Only on the internet, lol.

The best of the major automakers don't make big efforts selling to the aged demanding geezer-pleezer gas guzzlers with vomit-inducing/low control suspension. Often this subset of less than astute buyers will be losing drivers license soon enough (or worse losing the ability to drive or function or breath), on a fixed income, don't purchase cars with near the frequency that normal car buyers do, in general a low growth market to say the least.

Yes, I am the one that brought up several months ago how advancements in suspension systems have improved ride/handling combos.

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Old 03-14-11, 02:36 PM
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I think people underestimate the demographics Cadillac is targeting with this car. I see it as the same split Lexus is doing with the IS and the ES. Both cars are in similar price ranges but are focused on distinctly different buyers. I support Cadillac and their XTS, which I see as the "ES" side of the equation... There will always be a market for them as seen by the sales success of Buick. So as long as they do something to address the big void above the CTS, the so-called "IS" side of the equation. They need a flagship model.
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Old 03-14-11, 02:57 PM
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Originally Posted by IS-SV View Post
Only on the internet, lol.

The best of the major automakers don't make big efforts selling to the aged demanding geezer-pleezer gas guzzlers with vomit-inducing/low control suspension. Often this subset of less than astute buyers will be losing drivers license soon enough (or worse losing the ability to drive or function or breath), on a fixed income, don't purchase cars with near the frequency that normal car buyers do, in general a low growth market to say the least.

Yes, I am the one that brought up several months ago how advancements in suspension systems have improved ride/handling combos.
Unfortunately or fortunately, this segment of the population is going to compose the largest percentage of our population very soon. Baby boomers are reaching retirement age. This is the same group that have posed the greatest purchasing power and purchasing influence for the last 30 years and continue to do so. To say they are suddenly going to stop buying cars is inconceivable (whether they should or shouldn't is another topic). And as you get older you want more comfortable things. I'm sure this XTS is going to be far from the wallower the Caddys of the dark days were, but it will be softer sprung than the CTS. I don't think there is a coincidence that Buick is seeing a resurgence (after style and reliability were addressed).

Continuing to make a car that caters to this segment is smart on GM's part. Make it look nice, have good reliability and coddle its occupants is not a bad formula to follow. To be honest, my father falls into this segment. He's still looking for a car to buy. His auto ownership pedigree goes from a 71' Mustang Boss, to Caddy Deville, LS400, to S500. He thinks my S550 on 19s rides too hard. He prefers the LS but doesn't like the styling. If he takes to the XTS's design, it may be on his shopping list. And he still has a lot more purchasing power than I do, with properties scattered around NYC. Caddy is going down the smart path with the XTS (now that the CTS as paved a way making the marque respectable again). Actually, big luxo names who refuse to cater to this group will be losing out.
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Old 03-14-11, 03:16 PM
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Originally Posted by T0ked View Post
Unfortunately or fortunately, this segment of the population is going to compose the largest percentage of our population very soon. Baby boomers are reaching retirement age. This is the same group that have posed the greatest purchasing power and purchasing influence for the last 30 years and continue to do so. To say they are suddenly going to stop buying cars is inconceivable (whether they should or shouldn't is another topic). And as you get older you want more comfortable things. I'm sure this XTS is going to be far from the wallower the Caddys of the dark days were, but it will be softer sprung than the CTS. I don't think there is a coincidence that Buick is seeing a resurgence (after style and reliability were addressed).

Continuing to make a car that caters to this segment is smart on GM's part. Make it look nice, have good reliability and coddle its occupants is not a bad formula to follow. To be honest, my father falls into this segment. He's still looking for a car to buy. His auto ownership pedigree goes from a 71' Mustang Boss, to Caddy Deville, LS400, to S500. He thinks my S550 on 19s rides too hard. He prefers the LS but doesn't like the styling. If he takes to the XTS's design, it may be on his shopping list. And he still has a lot more purchasing power than I do, with properties scattered around NYC. Caddy is going down the smart path with the XTS (now that the CTS as paved a way making the marque respectable again). Actually, big luxo names who refuse to cater to this group will be losing out.
My original post said nothing about ignoring this huge segment of population known as the baby boomers and nothing about baby boomers not buying cars anymore. I only mentioned one subset of less astute buyers that are a minority of the total baby boomer generation. Lexus and Mercedes specifically for example cater to the older crowd and will continue to do so with biggest volume models being more comfort-oriented as usual. The reality of selling premium cars in volume has nothing to do with -F's, AMG's and M-series hot rods. I agree the CTS has made Caddy respectable, and Buick's turnaround resulting from very good products that are both comfortable, competent and stylish.

I know this segment of the population very well, being one of the oldest CL members here and I have retired parents and know exactly what they buy (a lot of cushy CUV's lately).

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Old 03-14-11, 03:21 PM
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Originally Posted by bitkahuna View Post
don't know when you last drove one. it was about 5 years for me, and i'd driven every generation of it back into the 80s (when it was sedan de ville, right? - ex's relatives had 'em one after another) - and they had gotten progressively firmer and firmer, esp. with northstar engine, with particularly hard tires it seemed. the suspension still could float but i don't know if they'd put stiff anti-roll bars on 'em or something but they were nothing like caddy's of old. for example, going over speed bumps in a parking lot road was very noticeable - the car did not just 'soak them up' like an old caddy would.

also, those old boat suspensions may have been comfy, but were a huge liability in evasive maneuver or bad weather conditions. thankfully, they're never coming back.

anyway, i completely disagree about caddy needing a big heavy smooth soft-riding car for the old folks. old folks need a smooth, soft-riding CUV! one they can get in and out of easy, but isn't huge so they don't hit things while parking. they will also have interior 'blue hair detectors' and flash rear lights when detection occurs. ok, that last part i keed i keed.

actually, i'm seeing older folks around here buying priuses, sonatas, the new taurus... but i did recently take a trip down to "The Villages" nearby which is a GIANT 55+ community (over 35,000 homes!) and was amused to still see some giant hulking old school town cars and crown vics with two round bellied guys up front and two 'q-tip' frail women in back)



tons of options. buick. toyota avalon. even the prius with standard 15's is pretty darned soft.



ah, catching up to this part of your post, seems like we're more on the same page.
I've been to The Villages, and you're right, it's HUGE. We have friends who live there and they say the population is 70,000+ now. One does see a lot of big U.S. brand cars there. I didn't notice too many imports, other than Avalons and Camry's, maybe because the dealers are down in Orlando and hour and half or so away.

Hey, with any luck we'll all be old round belly dudes some day.
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Old 03-14-11, 03:29 PM
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^ We have the Villages (55+) here here in San Jose hills, but only a few thousand people live there, not nearly as big as the Florida version. My "senior" tennis team (of older guys like me) plays away matches against them, good fun. Imports are prevalent but American cars are not uncommon too.

I look forward to being an old dude (lol, without the round belly) and hanging out at the club.
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Old 03-14-11, 04:31 PM
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Originally Posted by LexBob2 View Post
I've been to The Villages, and you're right, it's HUGE. We have friends who live there and they say the population is 70,000+ now. One does see a lot of big U.S. brand cars there. I didn't notice too many imports, other than Avalons and Camry's, maybe because the dealers are down in Orlando and hour and half or so away.
i believe the reason there's so many u.s. cars there is a HUGE number of people in the villages are from the midwest, and in particular michigan.
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Old 03-14-11, 05:47 PM
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With all the cheesy chrome in the cab, you might go blind on a sunny day.
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Old 03-15-11, 01:05 PM
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i actually like it. Maybe we'll see an XTS-V sooner or later like the STS-V
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Old 03-15-11, 01:38 PM
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Originally Posted by TJW98LS View Post
With all the cheesy chrome in the cab, you might go blind on a sunny day.
Even with AWD, it would be interesting to see them pushing 600hp out of a platform that will also underpin the Lucerne replacement and Impala.
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Old 11-10-11, 06:56 AM
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What you're looking at is the production version of the 2013 Cadillac XTS, the full-size luxury yacht that will be doing double duty when it goes on sale next year to replace both the DTS and STS.

We were all set to see the XTS debut next week at the LA Auto Show, but Cadillac beat us to the punch when it accidentally slipped the above image into a slide show on the company's consumer-facing website. The image has since been removed, but as the Internet proves time and again, nothing is ever forgotten.

The biggest thing going for the new XTS, besides its literal size, is the debut of Cadillac's new CUE infotainment system, which we gave you a hands on tour of earlier today. As for its looks, the production XTS appears to be almost identical to the XTS concept that debuted earlier this year at the 2011 Detroit Auto Show. The XTS concept is stunning to behold in person, though in pictures its design can appear too simple, lacking the visual impact that should be present in Cadillac's range-topping four-door. We'll have to wait until next week to see if the production XTS imparts the same first impression
http://www.autoblog.com/2011/11/09/c...ed-appearance/
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Old 11-10-11, 07:01 AM
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This is sad, IMO.

Art and Science could have translated into a wicked looking full-size flagship with very little effort: take the CTS, push the wheels all the way out to the corners, add more aggressive fender flares, another few inches of wheelbase, sharpen up some of the design cues and make a few nice wheel options available. It could have been very aggressive and very classy at the same time.

This XTS, to me, looks like a Taurus or Avalon competitor...not something to compete with the LS, S and 7, or even Equus. FWD or AWD, if the rumors are true, and only V6 or hybrid powertrains.
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Old 11-10-11, 07:34 AM
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^^ disagree, i think it looks great.
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