BMW didnt have naturally aspirated 6cly over 300hp, in great numbers at least... yes, there is m3 and it is awesome, but it is an low volume car with well documented engine issues...

if lexus did IS350 with twin turbo's first, german fans would laugh at how it needs turbo's to keep up...

In fact, we all know about Aussie BMW commercials where they laughed at Subbies for having to use turbo's...

yes, I am overreacting, welcome to the internet forums :-).

 

The BMW engine is smaller 3 liters vs 3.5 liters, lighter (415lbs vs 450lbs), makes more power (underrated BMW numbers), makes more torque with a flatter torque curve, has a LOT more modding potential (can easily achieve 70 more hp with a simple stage 1 ECU tune), has full direct injection and is more efficient all while doing so with a smaller capacity engine. It is also the worlds first direct injection engine with two small lag-free turbos. It is definately high-tech.

Just making the engine bigger? while still a high tech engine, just increasing the displacement is kind of the easier less innovative way of going about that business.

http://www.worldcarfans.com/news.cfm...ngine-in-depth

 

Anyway... this thread is about the "over heating issues", which I think have been pretty much determined not to be much of an issue at all (at this point). When/If a few owners track their cars and have problems then it'll be an issue. If I'm stranded on the ring on October 20th I promise this is the first place I will post.

 

I love the 335 so far but c'mon
1. Plastic fenders. Plastic? That is **** poor.
2. Mitsubishi turbos...Maybe from the EVO?
3. 3 and 1 series share parts. Read up mahn

Then its the costliest car. BMW ain't stupid, they make as much profit as the best of them.

 

Hehehe, that probably would be the test results. For me in the real world the competition are all pretty close. Each has an advantage and disadvantage. If the BMW has better predicted reliability there would be no reason to buy anything else. If the G35 (In coupe form for me) has better fit and finish and quality there would be no reason to buy anything else. If the IS350 had better driving dynamics and steering feel there would be no reason to buy anything else At least that is my perspective. Too me each are so close to being the clear winner but comes up short in a few areas. I wouldn't mind owning either though. It just makes the decision that much harder.

 

The good thing about these cars is 10 years ago, there was a winner, maybe 2nd place was close and everyone else sucked monkey *****.

With todays competiton, its really what a person PREFERS because the cars in this class are damn near all solid. EVen when you look at mag scores, they are all very close. The winner maybe 1 pt away (like when the IS and 3 series tied but C&D awarded the 3 a 1 point win)

Cept the Jag X-type, lol

 

That doesn't explain why all the other people who drove the 335 at various est events on the track did NOT have the same problem. That is the point. That car, or cars he drove had some sort of problem that is a given. It is not a common problem though as others around the country were doing similar track testing at BMW events in even HOTTER weather then he was and had no such problem.

As to the IS not having any engine problems that is great. But it does have its issues like the excess gas in the oil problem. I don't really think any of us Lexus owners here are willing or planning to bet money that BMW has as good or better reliability than Lexus. However, the point is most of us here don't make a mountain out of a mole hill when it comes to other manufacturers, and don't overlook the problems with our Lexus cars if there is one. If the car sucks, the car sucks, If the car is good, it is good. Give credit where credit is due.

 

IMHO, getting a 4-door car to acheive 4.8 seconds to 60 in automatic trim is a technological achievement just like being able to get a 4-door car to do 5.2 seconds with an automatic is. People don't realize how hard it is to achieve a 0.2 much less a 0.4 second lower time. Remember just a couple of years ago a Corvette ZO6 making 405 HP from a V8 was marveled at for achieving 4.6-4.8 second times. To be able to do that from a 3.0L I6 turbo or a 3.5L NA V6 is incredible. Also remember noboby here praised the NSX-R motor that ultimately makes over 300HP from a 3.2L V6. Like I said, give credit where credit is due.

 

Allow me to join this friendly discussion.

Actually, there have been at least more than a couple relatively reliable versions of BMW inline six engines developing more than 300hp throughout the past decade.

The European E36 M3 Evo is a very good example, with 321hp on tab from a 3.2 litre N/A engine. There are, of course, the six-cylinder E34 M5 and the current E46 M3, both easily making over 300hp without any forced induction. These cars are rather abundant and I would never consider them scarce.

Indeed, the E46 M3 engines did have engine related problems on the early production models, but I believe they have been remedied a while back.

In my opinion, Lexus is always going to be considered one of the top-rated manufacturers. Its emphasis on quality control, customer satisfaction, and company reputation should also attribute largely to the fact that the IS350 is indeed, more reliable than its competitors.

Jon

 

You are 99% correct.

However, the Corvette Z06, even in the C5 form, is actually a high 3 to low 4 second car in a 0-60mph sprint exercise.

The 1994' C4 405hp ZR-1 could manage 4.7 seconds and the newer 375hp C5 is only a tick behind or so.

Jon

 

^^^how Ya Been Man!!!

 

It's nice to see you guys again.

Keep the nice conversation going. It would be cool to see how BMW and Lexus compete with one another through the eyes of the well informed and car savvy critics.

I'll be watching from the sideline and giving props from time to time.

Jon

 

you mean in manual? CD got Automatic IS350 0-60 in 5.1 sec, and manual 335i in 4.8... 0.3 sec? hardly an difference you pay 5k for... which will shrink or dissapear with 335i Automatic...

Comparing 330i and IS350, with naturally aspirated engines, IS350 has 16% bigger displacement, and 26% more torque... thats 10% torque less than IS350 when we level off displacement, and without any penalties in mpg.

on the other hand, to build 335i Sedan, BMW had to add twin turbos to be 0.3 faster at best in 0-60 and less than that in 1/4 mile, when comparing manual to automatic IS350 plus it is now porkier at some 80lbs more - lets remember how some BMW fans loved to call IS350 porky yet when 3 series evens out with power it is now porkier. So much about technology.

of course, we wont mention heatsoaking issues that are starting to appear right after car is out, which is kind of expected anyway and you got free maintainance anyway, right? Hey, if 330i managed to win comparo when it was broken, and had catastrophic abs failure during drag strip brakings, whats a bit of heat here and there....

 

No, I mean an automatic. The 335i Coupe was a manual and the 335i Sedan was an automatic. They got 4.8 for the Sedan and 4.9 for the Coupe. Obviously it was different days and conditions, but that is two different cars and different test days they were able to get sub 5 second times. What it shows is these cars are probably a consistent sub 5 second car. By the way, we are not talking about price. People who buy these cars obviously don't really care if they are spending 5K more. I know I don't thus the reason why I'm leaning toward the 335i Coupe after I sell the RX330 provided my wife will allow me/us to get a 2-door. Like I said in other posts, there are pros and cons to each car. Niether are clear but winners and it all depends on what items and features one values higher than others. I personally like driving dynamics and handling more than extra cup holders. That is why I used to drive a sports car as a daily driver. Differnt priorities for different people. I know for a fact I'd be happy in either car. The question is which one would I miss more if I had to sell it? Once I determine that, I know which car I'll buy.

PS. I'll hold off final say until I can confirm the transmission. At first everyone was saying automatic, but the article does say standard 6-Speed transmission. It doesn't specifically state if it is the automatic 6-Speed or manual though as far as I saw, but I could have missed it. Either way, if it was indeed a manual just add 0.1 second to the time and be done with it

PSS. Never mind, you were right. Under the specs they do say 6-Speed Manual. So, we can safely assume the automatic would be about a 4.9 second car since BMW claims only a 0.1 difference between transmission. The automatic tested was the Coupe. I had them backwards.

 

Sure, like everyone says. Lexus is not perfect so we can't expect BMW to be perfeft can we now? As for the ABS failure, that issue was solved by a simple software update in the E90. The problem is done with. Just like how we praise Toyota and Lexus for quickly addressing the problems that arrise, so should be applaud BMW for quickly figuring out the problem and coming up with a fix. Fair is fair right?