Are Present-Day Jeeps Overpriced?
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The Phaeton failed here yes but did great overseas and they really didn't care if it did or didn't....the point was revenge on Mercedes for the A class. That and to just outright show off and provide a platform for the the newly acquired Bentley.
The comparison to Audi is one people often make but couldn't be more wrong, they share nearly nothing and the feel/goals of the cars couldn't be anymore different!
The A8 is far sharper, lighter, direct, and made to please the driver as the first goal vs the Phaeton being intended to RELAX everyone in it. That's why they chose steel instead of aluminum, it was an intentional choice to make the car more damped and heavy to further the feeling of serenity.
The Phaeton also has insane attention to detail and bespoke systems that nothing else has ever used, the powered trunk is a hydraulic system for example with hidden latch. The HVAC system is a masterwork as well with Mercedes air scarf like shoulder heater systems for all 4 outside passengers and a draft-less diffuser system for air. All lights fade in/out and interior lights are only by individual door etc, just so many little things it's amazing to behold
Its a level of attention to detail greater than an LS430 and backed up by a world class suspension and driveline
The comparison to Audi is one people often make but couldn't be more wrong, they share nearly nothing and the feel/goals of the cars couldn't be anymore different!
The A8 is far sharper, lighter, direct, and made to please the driver as the first goal vs the Phaeton being intended to RELAX everyone in it. That's why they chose steel instead of aluminum, it was an intentional choice to make the car more damped and heavy to further the feeling of serenity.
The Phaeton also has insane attention to detail and bespoke systems that nothing else has ever used, the powered trunk is a hydraulic system for example with hidden latch. The HVAC system is a masterwork as well with Mercedes air scarf like shoulder heater systems for all 4 outside passengers and a draft-less diffuser system for air. All lights fade in/out and interior lights are only by individual door etc, just so many little things it's amazing to behold
Its a level of attention to detail greater than an LS430 and backed up by a world class suspension and driveline
Last edited by mmarshall; May 25, 2025 at 08:27 PM.
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Originally Posted by SW17LS
I think its a tough market to break into at that level. You have a lot of entrenched competitors with very loyal customer bases.
Like I said earlier, the most likely reason is trying market a six-figure vehicle under the plebian Jeep nameplate. Like it or not, it didn't work for VW (Phaeton)...and it probably won't work for Jeep. It should probably be reclassified under the Chrysler (or maybe the Chrysler Imperial) nameplate...particularly as the Chrysler division badly needs another vehicle, currently selling only minivans in the U.S. market since the 300 was dopped.
Last edited by mmarshall; May 27, 2025 at 04:42 PM.
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Like I said earlier, the most likely reason is trying market a six-figure vehicle under the plebian Jeep nameplate. Like it or not, it didn't work for VW (Phaeton)...and it probably won't work for Jeep. It should probably be reclassified under the Chrysler (or maybe the Chrysler Imperial) nameplate...particularly as the Chrysler division badly needs another vehicle, currently selling only minivans in the U.S. market since the 300 was dopped.
Chrysler has nowhere near the brand cachet Jeep has.
Last edited by SW17LS; May 27, 2025 at 06:05 PM.
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They sell six figure Yukons and Tahoes. Most Wagoneers are not six figures. It starts at $62k, Grand Wagoneer starts at $91k. And the Grand Wagoneer of old was a Jeep. Note though, that a Grand Wagonner doesn't say Jeep on it anywhere.
Chrysler has nowhere near the brand cachet Jeep has.
Chrysler has nowhere near the brand cachet Jeep has.
I was referring to the Grand Wagoneer. I agree...the standard Wagoneer is not in the same class.
Chrysler was an upmarket/semi-luxury (not full-luxury) nameplate, comparable to Buick, Olds, and Mercury, for decades....only recently has it moved downmarket some with the elimination of the 300.
As for Jeep cache, it's hard to see much "Cache" in a Compass, Patriot, Renegade, or Liberty...or even a regular Cherokee. The Wrangler, of course, is a cult-machine, with its own dedicated crowd...... so the other rules applying to Jeeps don't necessarily apply to it. The Grand Cherokee, however, particularly the generation you owned, does have some class.
Last edited by mmarshall; May 27, 2025 at 08:03 PM.
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Chrysler for as long as I can remember has been a "meh" a best brand, Jeep always has been perceived better and considered more upmarket for the time I've been alive. The Grand has ALWAYS been bought by people who had higher luxury nameplates alongside it, my family when I was young usually had an ML/GL and a Grand alongside it and market research shows the Grand is oftentimes alongside much more expensive cars in owners garages.
Mostly because it is damn good. IF you get a good one they will exceed 200k miles no issues really......
The liberty etc are just the mass market compliance vehicles.
Mostly because it is damn good. IF you get a good one they will exceed 200k miles no issues really......
The liberty etc are just the mass market compliance vehicles.
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The Wagoneer and the Grand Wagoneer are the same vehicle. Think Yukon vs Yukon Denali.
Chrysler is a dead brand. It has no brand cache with buyers at all. Jeep has a lifestyle type brand, kind of like an American Land Rover. You see Jeeps in driveways alongside luxury cars, my own included. Jeeps are cool, Chryslers are not cool. Jeep sells strollers and outdoor lifestyle gear with the Jeep brand, because the brand has cache.
Case in point I always wanted a Jeep, and having our Jeeps was a bucket list thing for me. Never had any desire to have a Chrysler. Olds and Mercury have no relevance with buyers today, the comparison to Chrysler demonstrates how dead the brand is lol
Chrysler is a dead brand. It has no brand cache with buyers at all. Jeep has a lifestyle type brand, kind of like an American Land Rover. You see Jeeps in driveways alongside luxury cars, my own included. Jeeps are cool, Chryslers are not cool. Jeep sells strollers and outdoor lifestyle gear with the Jeep brand, because the brand has cache.
Case in point I always wanted a Jeep, and having our Jeeps was a bucket list thing for me. Never had any desire to have a Chrysler. Olds and Mercury have no relevance with buyers today, the comparison to Chrysler demonstrates how dead the brand is lol
Last edited by SW17LS; May 27, 2025 at 08:35 PM.
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Chrysler is a dead brand. It has no brand cache with buyers at all. Jeep has a lifestyle type brand, kind of like an American Land Rover. You see Jeeps in driveways alongside luxury cars, my own included. Jeeps are cool, Chryslers are not cool. Jeep sells strollers and outdoor lifestyle gear with the Jeep brand, because the brand has cache.
Never had any desire to have a Chrysler.
Last edited by mmarshall; May 27, 2025 at 08:59 PM.
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Has nothing to do with it being a Chrysler. We like the vehicle independently of the brand. Jeep has a brand cache that buyers seek out, no such cache with Chrysler.
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