R154 tune up/maintenance question
11-06-15, 06:01 PM
#1
R154 tune up/maintenance question
Hey guys what are some things that for sure should be done one the Soarer R154 while its separated from the engine and out of the car?
Thanks will be getting one soon and want to make sure its good to go before putting it in
Thanks will be getting one soon and want to make sure its good to go before putting it in
11-06-15, 09:07 PM
#3
SCFactory,
It depends on how critical you want to get. And also what your initial and long term power goals are.
First off, is this an early Soarer R154 from a 1991-1993 model with the classic toploader extension housing? Or is this a 1994-1995 early Tripod or 1996-2000 Tripod R154 from one of the 1996+ VVT-i models?
As Studiogeek said above, definitely go ahead and replace your rear output shaft seal and inspect the condition of the shifter: For a Tripod, maybe replace the rubber bushings in the exterior cage.... and for an early extension housing model, inspect the condition of the shift housing main gasket (Driftmotion sells the new OEM gaskets-- I don't remember the P/N, sorry) and replace the shifter seat bushing and lever bushing.
Beyond that you *can* get into internal reconditioning if you want to. I don't think it's a bad idea if you plan for a lot of power.
The main thing that affects people pushing a lot of power is that 1st gear thrust washer which would require a rebuild to replace with a Marlin Crawler Chromoly unit. Second to that, Marlin's chromoly front bearing retainer plate. Those are the two known weak areas in this already stout transmission.
If you do have a 1991-1993 early type or 1994-1995 early tripod type you should be able to use the heavy duty bearing rebuild kit from Driftmotion to cure any excess wear-- if applicable.
Last thing you can do is replace all the shift forks with Marlin Crawler and Driftmotion billet aluminum aftermarket examples. While the gears and shafts are strong in an R154, the shift forks are all cast from the factory. Still strong stuff but if you're already in there you might as well. I did when I had my MKIII R154 rebuilt and at the time only the DM billet aftermarket 5th & Reverse fork wasn't available.
But note that those replacement forks and possibly the standard rebuild kit may not be compatible with 1996+ Tripod R154's. If you're interested I'd call Driftmotion and get Aaron on the phone and double check with him to be certain of compatibility.
Of course, I'm covering all the bases and you don't necessarily need a rebuild. But just be aware of the 1st gear thrust washer depending on your use of the gearbox and that you usually have these additional parts available to you as an option.
And since you're in Florida, you're close to a very reputable rebuilder for these. Again, IF this applies to your case.
Lastly, always run only Redline MT-90 transmission oil every 15k and your R154 will be happy for years of use
It depends on how critical you want to get. And also what your initial and long term power goals are.
First off, is this an early Soarer R154 from a 1991-1993 model with the classic toploader extension housing? Or is this a 1994-1995 early Tripod or 1996-2000 Tripod R154 from one of the 1996+ VVT-i models?
As Studiogeek said above, definitely go ahead and replace your rear output shaft seal and inspect the condition of the shifter: For a Tripod, maybe replace the rubber bushings in the exterior cage.... and for an early extension housing model, inspect the condition of the shift housing main gasket (Driftmotion sells the new OEM gaskets-- I don't remember the P/N, sorry) and replace the shifter seat bushing and lever bushing.
Beyond that you *can* get into internal reconditioning if you want to. I don't think it's a bad idea if you plan for a lot of power.
The main thing that affects people pushing a lot of power is that 1st gear thrust washer which would require a rebuild to replace with a Marlin Crawler Chromoly unit. Second to that, Marlin's chromoly front bearing retainer plate. Those are the two known weak areas in this already stout transmission.
If you do have a 1991-1993 early type or 1994-1995 early tripod type you should be able to use the heavy duty bearing rebuild kit from Driftmotion to cure any excess wear-- if applicable.
Last thing you can do is replace all the shift forks with Marlin Crawler and Driftmotion billet aluminum aftermarket examples. While the gears and shafts are strong in an R154, the shift forks are all cast from the factory. Still strong stuff but if you're already in there you might as well. I did when I had my MKIII R154 rebuilt and at the time only the DM billet aftermarket 5th & Reverse fork wasn't available.
But note that those replacement forks and possibly the standard rebuild kit may not be compatible with 1996+ Tripod R154's. If you're interested I'd call Driftmotion and get Aaron on the phone and double check with him to be certain of compatibility.
Of course, I'm covering all the bases and you don't necessarily need a rebuild. But just be aware of the 1st gear thrust washer depending on your use of the gearbox and that you usually have these additional parts available to you as an option.
And since you're in Florida, you're close to a very reputable rebuilder for these. Again, IF this applies to your case.
Lastly, always run only Redline MT-90 transmission oil every 15k and your R154 will be happy for years of use
Last edited by KahnBB6; 11-06-15 at 09:17 PM.
11-07-15, 10:49 PM
#5
Not in Florida but you can get there in half a day from the middle of the state. SpeedForSale in Alpharetta, GA. Very good people. I used them to rebuild my MKIII R154.
I am sure there are good rebuilders in Florida too but I don't know of any to recommend. Definitely not Titan Motorsports though. I did contact them and they basically shrugged at the prospect of rebuilding R154's, possibly V160's too.
I am sure there are good rebuilders in Florida too but I don't know of any to recommend. Definitely not Titan Motorsports though. I did contact them and they basically shrugged at the prospect of rebuilding R154's, possibly V160's too.
11-08-15, 07:44 AM
#6
I was careful not to be condescending or look past her as a source of info, empathizing with her possible experiences as a female tech in my mind......
And she TOTALLY talked down to ME. Was totally, impatient, abrupt, talked over me and possibly even wrong on some things.
She has learned some things working with men I see. LOL
It was a hilarious few minutes
I have to call back and run my question by Aaron.
Last edited by Studiogeek; 11-08-15 at 09:42 AM.
11-08-15, 07:59 AM
#7
Kahn,
How can I figure out what tripod R154 I have? My shifter rattles like a rattlesnake in third gear mostly. It's crazy loud and there is loads of side to side play in gear.
On a side note, I feel resistance pushing it into first when its cold. Its like it hits something and I have to push past it. It's not bad, but I am concerned about it getting worse.
I LOVE IT when you participate in tranny threads!
How can I figure out what tripod R154 I have? My shifter rattles like a rattlesnake in third gear mostly. It's crazy loud and there is loads of side to side play in gear.
On a side note, I feel resistance pushing it into first when its cold. Its like it hits something and I have to push past it. It's not bad, but I am concerned about it getting worse.
I LOVE IT when you participate in tranny threads!
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11-08-15, 08:17 AM
#8
Studio which tripod do you have.....Mine is from a chaser/soarer (JZX100/JZZ30)...which came on 1jz vvti
If you have the money I would recommend doing a rebuild with a MC parts and Driftmotion....
This is the kit you want from driftmotion if you have the same tranny as me....
http://www.driftmotion.com/product-p/dm3069.htm
If you have the money I would recommend doing a rebuild with a MC parts and Driftmotion....
This is the kit you want from driftmotion if you have the same tranny as me....
http://www.driftmotion.com/product-p/dm3069.htm
11-08-15, 08:23 AM
#9
Here is the inside of mine...with all brand new gears, HD bearing, synchros, etc....you can still see the paint marking on the gears...
It is fully built......i.e the most you can do to an r154.....it should hold 700hp....
You can see the Marlin Crawler billet shifter fork for 1-2.....
Over the winter I may add the 3-4 billet fork from Driftmotion
It is fully built......i.e the most you can do to an r154.....it should hold 700hp....
You can see the Marlin Crawler billet shifter fork for 1-2.....
Over the winter I may add the 3-4 billet fork from Driftmotion
11-08-15, 01:14 PM
#11
FYI, moved to Performance & Maintenance, guys.
Awesome! Aaron figured out a rebuild kit for the late model tripod R154's! That's huge.
In case anyone reading this needs to know, This ^^ kit is not what you want for an MKIII R154 or very early Soarer R154. In those cases you want this kit:
http://www.driftmotion.com/product-p/dm3045.htm
It also appears that the MC 1-2 billet shift fork and DM 3-4 billet shift forks work across both internal revisions of the R154. They probably don't include the 5th-Reverse billet fork in either kit because it's overkill for most but I'd still check to see if that also works in a the late model tripod R154's.
Studio,
Thanks! Just relaying what I know. Still not the same as actually having rebuilt these things yourself however.
As to your concerns:
When the R154 is dead cold and it and your engine are still coming up to normal operating temperature it's going to give you some resistance. I get this with mine just a bit in 1st and 2nd and I am sure others will report similar experiences. This is with the MT-90 transmission oil. Unless I absolutely have to rush I always like to give my engine a chance to get the temp needle to start moving or get to partway into operating temp before I start moving. At the same time, your R154 will get some heat transfer from the block which will help it warm up as well, however the best thing for it is actually driving the car so that the internals start working and it also comes up to its normal internal temperature.
I find that about 10min or less of driving, even in a commute, is all it takes. And of course if the engine is still warming up I'll take it easy anyway. I just assume a bit of driving time to allow the internals to get to their optimum. It's just a quirk of how these gearboxes were first designed in 1985: VERY tough but with tolerances that work best at full operating temperature. And the Redline MT-90 oil really helps too.
Now if you have the same issues when the car has been at operating temperature for plenty of time and you are still having consistent trouble in a particular gear (other than trying to go too fast into 1st while slowing down) then it might be a wear issue. And I'd defer to others with higher mileage non-rebuilt R154's to confirm any symptoms like that.
However what you've described doesn't sound like that's the case to me. Just normal quirks of warming up.
Second concern:
The side to side play in gear might be the bushings in your tripod needing replacing. I get some very mild rattle with mine in 2nd and sometimes 3rd at very low speeds but I don't want to correlate because you have a newer shifting mechanism (mine is the OEM Soarer extension housing type-- converted. Plus I use an aftermarket shifter). My first thought is that some of your bushings on the tripod cage may be worn out and need replacing. Driftmotion sells the OEM bits for that as well.
See if this may be the case and please let us know what you come up with?
This is tricky and I don't have a good answer for you. As far as I know the early tripod and late model tripod R154's are externally identical. Unless you know what type of engine it came from (the big revision, to the best of my knowledge, went onto R154's that came bolted to 1JZ-GTE VVT-i engines from JDM 1996+ cars) you probably need to crack open the case as CatMan did and inspect the bearing design and synchronizer shapes. CatMan, does this sound correct to you?
And to CatMan-- excellent work on the rebuild! Looks great! 
^^ Yes. Well... technically... there is one more little thing we can do to an R154 to make it even stronger
https://www.speedforsale.com/suprapa...on-p-3930.html
Studio which tripod do you have.....Mine is from a chaser/soarer (JZX100/JZZ30)...which came on 1jz vvti
If you have the money I would recommend doing a rebuild with a MC parts and Driftmotion....
This is the kit you want from driftmotion if you have the same tranny as me....
http://www.driftmotion.com/product-p/dm3069.htm
If you have the money I would recommend doing a rebuild with a MC parts and Driftmotion....
This is the kit you want from driftmotion if you have the same tranny as me....
http://www.driftmotion.com/product-p/dm3069.htm
In case anyone reading this needs to know, This ^^ kit is not what you want for an MKIII R154 or very early Soarer R154. In those cases you want this kit:
http://www.driftmotion.com/product-p/dm3045.htm
It also appears that the MC 1-2 billet shift fork and DM 3-4 billet shift forks work across both internal revisions of the R154. They probably don't include the 5th-Reverse billet fork in either kit because it's overkill for most but I'd still check to see if that also works in a the late model tripod R154's.
My shifter rattles like a rattlesnake in third gear mostly. It's crazy loud and there is loads of side to side play in gear.
On a side note, I feel resistance pushing it into first when its cold. Its like it hits something and I have to push past it. It's not bad, but I am concerned about it getting worse.
I LOVE IT when you participate in tranny threads!
On a side note, I feel resistance pushing it into first when its cold. Its like it hits something and I have to push past it. It's not bad, but I am concerned about it getting worse.
I LOVE IT when you participate in tranny threads!
Thanks! Just relaying what I know. Still not the same as actually having rebuilt these things yourself however.
As to your concerns:
When the R154 is dead cold and it and your engine are still coming up to normal operating temperature it's going to give you some resistance. I get this with mine just a bit in 1st and 2nd and I am sure others will report similar experiences. This is with the MT-90 transmission oil. Unless I absolutely have to rush I always like to give my engine a chance to get the temp needle to start moving or get to partway into operating temp before I start moving. At the same time, your R154 will get some heat transfer from the block which will help it warm up as well, however the best thing for it is actually driving the car so that the internals start working and it also comes up to its normal internal temperature.
I find that about 10min or less of driving, even in a commute, is all it takes. And of course if the engine is still warming up I'll take it easy anyway. I just assume a bit of driving time to allow the internals to get to their optimum. It's just a quirk of how these gearboxes were first designed in 1985: VERY tough but with tolerances that work best at full operating temperature. And the Redline MT-90 oil really helps too.
Now if you have the same issues when the car has been at operating temperature for plenty of time and you are still having consistent trouble in a particular gear (other than trying to go too fast into 1st while slowing down) then it might be a wear issue. And I'd defer to others with higher mileage non-rebuilt R154's to confirm any symptoms like that.
However what you've described doesn't sound like that's the case to me. Just normal quirks of warming up.
Second concern:
The side to side play in gear might be the bushings in your tripod needing replacing. I get some very mild rattle with mine in 2nd and sometimes 3rd at very low speeds but I don't want to correlate because you have a newer shifting mechanism (mine is the OEM Soarer extension housing type-- converted. Plus I use an aftermarket shifter). My first thought is that some of your bushings on the tripod cage may be worn out and need replacing. Driftmotion sells the OEM bits for that as well.
See if this may be the case and please let us know what you come up with?
This is tricky and I don't have a good answer for you. As far as I know the early tripod and late model tripod R154's are externally identical. Unless you know what type of engine it came from (the big revision, to the best of my knowledge, went onto R154's that came bolted to 1JZ-GTE VVT-i engines from JDM 1996+ cars) you probably need to crack open the case as CatMan did and inspect the bearing design and synchronizer shapes. CatMan, does this sound correct to you?
And to CatMan-- excellent work on the rebuild! Looks great!
https://www.speedforsale.com/suprapa...on-p-3930.html
Last edited by KahnBB6; 11-08-15 at 01:37 PM.
11-08-15, 03:42 PM
#13
SCFactory,
It depends on how critical you want to get. And also what your initial and long term power goals are.
First off, is this an early Soarer R154 from a 1991-1993 model with the classic toploader extension housing? Or is this a 1994-1995 early Tripod or 1996-2000 Tripod R154 from one of the 1996+ VVT-i models?
As Studiogeek said above, definitely go ahead and replace your rear output shaft seal and inspect the condition of the shifter: For a Tripod, maybe replace the rubber bushings in the exterior cage.... and for an early extension housing model, inspect the condition of the shift housing main gasket (Driftmotion sells the new OEM gaskets-- I don't remember the P/N, sorry) and replace the shifter seat bushing and lever bushing.
Beyond that you *can* get into internal reconditioning if you want to. I don't think it's a bad idea if you plan for a lot of power.
The main thing that affects people pushing a lot of power is that 1st gear thrust washer which would require a rebuild to replace with a Marlin Crawler Chromoly unit. Second to that, Marlin's chromoly front bearing retainer plate. Those are the two known weak areas in this already stout transmission.
If you do have a 1991-1993 early type or 1994-1995 early tripod type you should be able to use the heavy duty bearing rebuild kit from Driftmotion to cure any excess wear-- if applicable.
Last thing you can do is replace all the shift forks with Marlin Crawler and Driftmotion billet aluminum aftermarket examples. While the gears and shafts are strong in an R154, the shift forks are all cast from the factory. Still strong stuff but if you're already in there you might as well. I did when I had my MKIII R154 rebuilt and at the time only the DM billet aftermarket 5th & Reverse fork wasn't available.
But note that those replacement forks and possibly the standard rebuild kit may not be compatible with 1996+ Tripod R154's. If you're interested I'd call Driftmotion and get Aaron on the phone and double check with him to be certain of compatibility.
Of course, I'm covering all the bases and you don't necessarily need a rebuild. But just be aware of the 1st gear thrust washer depending on your use of the gearbox and that you usually have these additional parts available to you as an option.
And since you're in Florida, you're close to a very reputable rebuilder for these. Again, IF this applies to your case.
Lastly, always run only Redline MT-90 transmission oil every 15k and your R154 will be happy for years of use
It depends on how critical you want to get. And also what your initial and long term power goals are.
First off, is this an early Soarer R154 from a 1991-1993 model with the classic toploader extension housing? Or is this a 1994-1995 early Tripod or 1996-2000 Tripod R154 from one of the 1996+ VVT-i models?
As Studiogeek said above, definitely go ahead and replace your rear output shaft seal and inspect the condition of the shifter: For a Tripod, maybe replace the rubber bushings in the exterior cage.... and for an early extension housing model, inspect the condition of the shift housing main gasket (Driftmotion sells the new OEM gaskets-- I don't remember the P/N, sorry) and replace the shifter seat bushing and lever bushing.
Beyond that you *can* get into internal reconditioning if you want to. I don't think it's a bad idea if you plan for a lot of power.
The main thing that affects people pushing a lot of power is that 1st gear thrust washer which would require a rebuild to replace with a Marlin Crawler Chromoly unit. Second to that, Marlin's chromoly front bearing retainer plate. Those are the two known weak areas in this already stout transmission.
If you do have a 1991-1993 early type or 1994-1995 early tripod type you should be able to use the heavy duty bearing rebuild kit from Driftmotion to cure any excess wear-- if applicable.
Last thing you can do is replace all the shift forks with Marlin Crawler and Driftmotion billet aluminum aftermarket examples. While the gears and shafts are strong in an R154, the shift forks are all cast from the factory. Still strong stuff but if you're already in there you might as well. I did when I had my MKIII R154 rebuilt and at the time only the DM billet aftermarket 5th & Reverse fork wasn't available.
But note that those replacement forks and possibly the standard rebuild kit may not be compatible with 1996+ Tripod R154's. If you're interested I'd call Driftmotion and get Aaron on the phone and double check with him to be certain of compatibility.
Of course, I'm covering all the bases and you don't necessarily need a rebuild. But just be aware of the 1st gear thrust washer depending on your use of the gearbox and that you usually have these additional parts available to you as an option.
And since you're in Florida, you're close to a very reputable rebuilder for these. Again, IF this applies to your case.
Lastly, always run only Redline MT-90 transmission oil every 15k and your R154 will be happy for years of use
I bought a clutch from a friend it's a high performance clutch but he lost the throw out bearing and pilot bearing... where can I buy these?
11-08-15, 03:55 PM
#14
^^ Welcome!
Without doing a rebuild on a non-tripod R154:
-OEM Output shaft seal
-Throwout bearing, Pilot bearing
-Top gasket for extension housing
-Marlin Crawler heavy duty shifter seat + shift lever bushing
-Clutch fork can be replaced too but I can't see that being needed unless it's obviously broken. Not needed.
-clutch Slave cylinder
The pilot bearing and throwout bearing, as well as almost all the parts above can be sourced from any Toyota dealer by referencing a 1986-92 Supra Turbo 5-speed. Driftmotion also carries all of the above parts.
Without doing a rebuild on a non-tripod R154:
-OEM Output shaft seal
-Throwout bearing, Pilot bearing
-Top gasket for extension housing
-Marlin Crawler heavy duty shifter seat + shift lever bushing
-Clutch fork can be replaced too but I can't see that being needed unless it's obviously broken. Not needed.
-clutch Slave cylinder
The pilot bearing and throwout bearing, as well as almost all the parts above can be sourced from any Toyota dealer by referencing a 1986-92 Supra Turbo 5-speed. Driftmotion also carries all of the above parts.