Brakes 101 - Class is in session!
11-02-13, 07:50 AM
#46
Based on a weekend of use (not much, I know) I really think the BFG R1S can last ya a whole season unlike the A6's. Not sure if the autox guys have jumped on these tires much yet.
I'm gonna keep you in mind for the spring!!! Tirerack discount would be awesome since I don't get contingency money these days
11-02-13, 08:30 AM
#47
Murco,
A brake master cylinder stopper is a simple little device usually seen in Japanese tuning media, nearly all their cars have them, and even some shock tower bars have them built into them such as carbing. It's basically a device that prevents the bmc from deflecting forwards, supposedly it provides better feel.
It seems like some kind of old school trick from when japanese cars didn't have power assisted brakes, Idk what do you think
A brake master cylinder stopper is a simple little device usually seen in Japanese tuning media, nearly all their cars have them, and even some shock tower bars have them built into them such as carbing. It's basically a device that prevents the bmc from deflecting forwards, supposedly it provides better feel.
It seems like some kind of old school trick from when japanese cars didn't have power assisted brakes, Idk what do you think
11-04-13, 11:12 AM
#49
Murco,
A brake master cylinder stopper is a simple little device usually seen in Japanese tuning media, nearly all their cars have them, and even some shock tower bars have them built into them such as carbing. It's basically a device that prevents the bmc from deflecting forwards, supposedly it provides better feel.
It seems like some kind of old school trick from when japanese cars didn't have power assisted brakes, Idk what do you think
A brake master cylinder stopper is a simple little device usually seen in Japanese tuning media, nearly all their cars have them, and even some shock tower bars have them built into them such as carbing. It's basically a device that prevents the bmc from deflecting forwards, supposedly it provides better feel.
It seems like some kind of old school trick from when japanese cars didn't have power assisted brakes, Idk what do you think
On a street driven car I don't know how useful it would be but it certainly couldn't hurt and wouldn't hurt daily usability.
11-04-13, 11:22 AM
#50
Nope have not seen the Rivals yet. I've been out of the autox scene a couple of years. My Z used to be a BS car in SCCA then went halfheartedly into BSP where Evos and S2000's ran the class before they got reshuffled. Was thinking about picking up a BRZ for potential CS use.
Based on a weekend of use (not much, I know) I really think the BFG R1S can last ya a whole season unlike the A6's. Not sure if the autox guys have jumped on these tires much yet.
Based on a weekend of use (not much, I know) I really think the BFG R1S can last ya a whole season unlike the A6's. Not sure if the autox guys have jumped on these tires much yet.
11-13-13, 08:58 AM
#52
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What say you about all these LS/Supra monoblock caliper conversions to our cars? Most end up with the spongey feeling, and they end up feeling worse than OE brakes. I've always wondered why more don't go with brand new rotors, a more aggressive pad, fresh high temp fluid, braided brake lines and a brake master cylinder stopper of some sort to make the brakes feel better.
11-13-13, 11:16 AM
#53
I have the ls brakes in the front and they help the brake feel massively, I reused the stock lines and the pedal feels mostly like stock but the car actually stops much much better. I am sure if you used stainless lines you will get a more performance feeling, but nothing is worse than the OE brakes, especially not the 4 piston LS or supra brakes which is a massive upgrade. Before you couldn't stop from high speeds a few times in a row before you get large brake fade, I wouldn't want to brake too fast and get them hot, but with the LS brakes you can keep braking time and time again and it just clamps down, I am sure the supra ones fade even less as its cast vs aluminum but they both give you upgraded stopping power, I also prefer how much lighter the LS brakes are than the supra units but it depends on how far you plan on pushing your brakes.
I did new rotors, pads and ls brakes, stock lines, and topped off the fluid. stainless lines for a performance car, stock lines are fine for a street car.
I did new rotors, pads and ls brakes, stock lines, and topped off the fluid. stainless lines for a performance car, stock lines are fine for a street car.
Last edited by Ali SC3; 11-13-13 at 11:21 AM.
11-13-13, 11:51 AM
#55
My new SC will probably get a Covette 6/4-piston set-up with DRM stainless steel pistons next spring and I'll add the Supra master cylinder. I'm willing to bet those will offer similar performance to the Brembo GTR system, until about 175 mph! lol
Last edited by Murco; 11-13-13 at 11:56 AM.
11-14-13, 07:00 PM
#59
Of course they're looking to increase braking power, I'm sure a lot do it for the aesthetics as well. However I meant that some not everybody go about their brakes wrong and end up with a spongey pedal, could just be that they didn't bleed them properly. And yes the things I listed are almost always done at the same time as the brake swap -- however, those things could make stock brakes feel better, as well as leave you all prepared for if and when you do decide to upgrade to Supra or LS brakes. Also, don't call them a BBK, they're oem brakes off another car, not a Big Brake Kit, that shiny brembo goodness posted above is a BBK.
01-18-14, 12:25 PM
#60
Driver School Candidate
quote: "What say you about all these LS/Supra monoblock caliper conversions to our cars? Most end up with the spongey feeling, and they end up feeling worse than OE brakes. I've always wondered why more don't go with brand new rotors, a more aggressive pad, fresh high temp fluid, braided brake lines and a brake master cylinder stopper of some sort to make the brakes feel better."
I recently did this conversion, and my resulting brakes are NOT spongy feeling at all, and in fact are very progressive and linear in feel Higher pedal than originally also. They are much better feeling than when I started (stock SC400 setup). This is with used stock LS rotors, calipers and pads. Things looked so good I just stuck them in (after dismantling one caliper and finding it like new inside.)
However, I did bleed the brakes a second time as after the first vacuum bleeding the brakes were spongy. I bled them the traditional way and found an air bubble in the passenger front. I never touched or bled the rears, as I clamped off the lines during the job and didn't drip any fluid out.
If you have spongy brakes after the upgrade, you didn't bleed them completely. The original brakes were rather sloppy feeling (although not as bad as some suggest they are), why I decided to do the upgrade. Maybe they had a little air in them, or maybe it was just flexing of the floating caliper design.
Since the original 2-piston calipers and the LS 4-piston calipers use similar (identical I believe) piston sizes, they both require the same fluid displacement to operate (the pistons on the 2-piston setup move twice as far as they clamp both pads to the rotor). If anything, the 4-piston may require a little less fluid as the pads don't have to retract as far to avoid rubbing on the rotors. The stock SC400 master cylinder is perfectly adequate.
I intend to replace the lines with SS, but don't expect a lot of improvement as there isn't much I can find wrong with the stock lines. However, SS lines are almost as cheap as stock, so why not? Can't hurt, unless I don't bleed them correctly.
Gerry
I recently did this conversion, and my resulting brakes are NOT spongy feeling at all, and in fact are very progressive and linear in feel Higher pedal than originally also. They are much better feeling than when I started (stock SC400 setup). This is with used stock LS rotors, calipers and pads. Things looked so good I just stuck them in (after dismantling one caliper and finding it like new inside.)
However, I did bleed the brakes a second time as after the first vacuum bleeding the brakes were spongy. I bled them the traditional way and found an air bubble in the passenger front. I never touched or bled the rears, as I clamped off the lines during the job and didn't drip any fluid out.
If you have spongy brakes after the upgrade, you didn't bleed them completely. The original brakes were rather sloppy feeling (although not as bad as some suggest they are), why I decided to do the upgrade. Maybe they had a little air in them, or maybe it was just flexing of the floating caliper design.
Since the original 2-piston calipers and the LS 4-piston calipers use similar (identical I believe) piston sizes, they both require the same fluid displacement to operate (the pistons on the 2-piston setup move twice as far as they clamp both pads to the rotor). If anything, the 4-piston may require a little less fluid as the pads don't have to retract as far to avoid rubbing on the rotors. The stock SC400 master cylinder is perfectly adequate.
I intend to replace the lines with SS, but don't expect a lot of improvement as there isn't much I can find wrong with the stock lines. However, SS lines are almost as cheap as stock, so why not? Can't hurt, unless I don't bleed them correctly.
Gerry