StealthFF

Where do I start…. RR Racing road & Track suspension exceeded my expectations by over 65%. As a consumer who:

1.) Has very bad buyers remorse.

2.) On average takes me 1.5 – 2 years to complete my decision for each modification.

3.) Generally, I have a very pessimistic reaction to reviews read about products I want or think I need on the market.

I cannot believe I waited and quite frankly am glad I did because the Road & Track suspension was just released and would have made a major mistake “rushing-cheaply- into and purchased BC or RSR coilovers because they were “in my price range / budget”. Though I WILL spend the extra if I KNOW the value of what I am buying 10 times out of 10.

I am taking the time to write this review, Not b/c this is a paid advertisement nor have any direct affiliations with RR Racing, but because Rafi’s exceptional customer service, provided DATA, and product met and exceeded all of my expectations that were repeatedly and overly expressed. My requirements were:

1.) I wanted to “level” ride height stance. Downfall with RSR springs found was with and without my 2 baby boys and wife the cars stance was “raked”. The front was approximately 1.125” higher than the rear. This drove me insane as stance FOR ME matters as much as ride quality. When I installed the RSR springs I was happy with ride quality and stance frustrated me more and more over time pushing me to wanting to sell the RCF and began to compare it to my ISF. (Which I wish I never sold and I became a CYNIC).

2.) I was “hoping” since I was spending money for coilovers I could get better ride quality, but didn’t really know what to expect.

3.) I wanted a high level of adjustment. I have had Tein, RSR, and KW coilovers and all have been “good” gave me the close stance I wanted and good ride quality.

To provide some understanding of My perspective on the “information”, “feelings”, and my “impressions”. I have been in the engineering environment for the last 10 years as an electrical engineering tech. III and EE in oil&gas and food industry. I don’t report feelings as in many cases they don’t have a “place”. The best sports cars that I have driven for over 8-10 hours plus each have been:

1.) 2015 Turbo S

2.) 2011 911 Carrera S

3.) 15 dodge Viper ( 2 hours of driving time)

4.) Corvette FRC coupe

5.) 15 Z06 (1 hour of driving time)

6.) 08, 11, and 17 mini cooper S works

So, to start as we installed the suspension the craftsmanship was quite different than a few of the setups. The fully threaded body was nice in comparison to Teins which had limited adjustment and lighter than KW. During install all the hardware and instructions were spot on.

Then, once coilovers and USRS were installed Rafi sent coilovers “pre-adjusted”, and they were literally almost spot on for what I requested. (Which is very nice to come as such from manufacturer to quickly dial in.) We brought the front down 3/8”from initial configuration and the stance was PERFECT!

FIRST IMPRESSIONS:

STEERING RATE / FEEL / WEIGHT:

I took the car out and immediately the steering was MUCH heavier as in memories from Viper and Porsche. The weight of the steering wheel felt as if you proportionally had a better ratio of steering wheel to managing the front end; hence you had a better direct connection. (My wife is a car nut and she even remarked, “Baby now this feeeels like a car!” hmmm)

HANDLING:

Compared to ALL the cars I have ever lowered this felt even BETTER than the Porsche and Viper.. But WAIT WAIT, before you tear me apart hear me out. Im purely talking about ride over uneven / even pavement. The reason I feel this way is because fortunately the Turbo S and Viper were a mere fraction of the weight of the RCF thus you get a different sound, thud, reciprocation of suspension feel on stiffer settings because the car is lighter it “seems” harsher and “tinnier”. Interestingly the weight of the RCF with this suspension provides an AMAZING ride even though higher spring rate coupled with dual springs provide better ride than factory, etc. There are certain areas that I always travel and the frequency of the pavement that I would feel before is gone; the road feels smooth and pure. Also there are many times with family as we would go to dinner on back roads during an on power situation to get around traffic my rear end would “wander” pretty bad. Rear end wander with new RR suspension is non-existent and I feel positive feedback in form of traction and further positive steering input. My wife remarked, “the car feels safer”, with the car fully loaded with babies and her making movement through hectic Houston traffic. She also noted after she drove to get her nails done she noted she was driving fast on the freeway and the car didn’t feel sloppy going through traffic and she felt more comfortable driving faster.

Later that day I began turning / aggressively rocking the car, “right-left, right-left, etc” and the steering was very very responsive compared to before. I realized now before I would turn into a long sharp right, the car would continue going straight/left for a fraction of a second then finally correct to the right where I wanted it. After the USRS and suspension when I turned right, it plain and simply did what I input through the steering wheel much like the Viper and Porsche. Also, I wasn’t utilizing my core to maintain seat position because there was perceptively zero body roll. After installing suspension I cannot believe how much body roll we had before. All momentum was maintained in chassis and the car is soo much more composed through the corners. The car is “thrilling to drive” because of this. I do not feel like im driving a large overweight sedan as many reviewers say. (I would bet money that if the car came with this suspension weight wouldn’t even come up except for in pure straight line speed times.) It feels as if I have consistant downforce rather than weight. Let me explain. I remember going to a driving school at Texas Speedway with a good friend and he showed me how poorly his ACR viper handled through certain sections at too low of speeds. Then he explained the necessity to maintain such a rate of speed through the same corners to the aerodynamic downforce could function and increase traction so the car did not become lose as before. This is the same experience I feel with suspension. It has greatly improved functional traction. So much to the effect when I turn of traction control I can manage rear end about 20% better pushing it than before if I can quantify.

Plain and simply the car is not just “different” it has been transformed. Honestly I wanted to sell the RCF soon after I had because it didn’t thrill me and made me wish I kept ISF… I even told Rafi during purchase I was going to sell RCF shortly after I bought suspension but this was my last try to “figure out” the RCF. Well long story short the new stance has revitalized the look of the RCF and has made body lines pop even more, and handling exceptional. As before with my ISF in Houston I had over 5 people honk, take pictures; ask me what it was etc, in ONE DAY. I am not a hype man just telling as it is. My wife was with me the whole day and can vouch and she was like..”WOW” I miss people doing that. This setup is worth more than it is marketed for. Unfortunately the market is saturated with crap at low prices and people are mis-informed or have budgets like me and are scared to spend money because they don’t understand what they are getting because previous experiences of purchasing mediocre suspension has tainted their perceptions as mine has been. Long story short I will keep the RCF it is soooo different and pleased to continue modding. Now, the RCF for “ME” is a step above the ISF and now for more power mods. Thank you RR Racing for the experience and time to share information.

StealthFF

Pictures of rcf after

StealthFF

Peerfect stance

GetKinetic

Great write up. It.looks super low. Any rubbing upfront?

konichiwa3

Excellent!! Thanks for sharing. Was this installed at a Toyota dealership?

StealthFF

absolutely ZERO rubbing lock-to-lock.

StealthFF

yes sir..Vu is our Houston 2F2F installer haha..inside joke

lobuxracer

iTrader: (2)

Glad it "feels" better. Did you put a watch on it to see if it actually performed better from a mechanical perspective? Lowering is a mixed bag. More often than not, the car's mechanical performance after arbitrary lowering is worse, not better.

FWIW, I don't care how the car feels because feel has nothing to do with performance. Only a watch and a timed course will tell you the modification you made was an improvement.

isfvss

Hey Lowbux don't be to harsh sometimes when you modify your car it can feel faster, eg a louder exhaust always goes faster

StealthFF

lobux, my goals for what "I" wanted was stated above as a spirited street driver and possibly a track day... hence why I used so many quotations so I could avoid such feedback, even though it's respected. But, especially one with your expertise should acknowledge the suspension if setup correctly "for the track" would be a great improvement over stock bc from "what I feel" it's drastic... just providing knowledge the best I can from my perspective. No data or insight was provided except from a "street experience".

FWIW, it would be awesome if you purchased for your car and gave us some professional feedback ����

StealthFF

Lobux does normally state some direct points in respect to performance.
Me personally without knowing any suspension design info, having utilized many different brands of coilovers and springs hopefully to "maintain" some ride quality lowering the car to a desired extreme many have failed to accomplish that purpose which I really sought and many others that literally want stance and possibly gain performance.
I will say this much I can turn into many turns, long freeway ramps, merge through traffic at much higher rates of speed safely than before. Also I can brake quite hard with no hand on steering without drift, there is also no more pulling and less trimlining of steering wheel. Yes yes yes the the USRS make another large difference in what we feel as feedback. I believe it is quite fair for the "general" user, high percentage of us that enjoy stance and want performance, and providing a review as many car reviewers provide based on their "feel" and perception without a stop watch which can be arbitrary as well to say this suspension feels damn good. Let's say the car is slower on the track but it feels this good as you can ask Clyde and a few others... At such a rate what it does on the track becomes arbitrary and the feel takes priority respectfuly..... is that fair to say? I "feel" too many forget that a large percentage of drivers buy, drive, mod, and continue because of the exhilaration of the "feel / perception" not because the numbers said so... I know that sounds retarded but unfortunately it's true in many instances with the ISF,RCF,etc. especially due to the limitations weight, tuning, etc.

RRRacing

iTrader: (1)

FYI Lance.... no one does more track testing than us when it comes to suspension. Our development car gets tracked more than any other RCF. It has been driven by the owner Pete, myself, and most importantly we get feedback from one of HOD's top instructors, Eugene. And yes, we keep track of improvements to cornering speeds and make changes accordingly.

in fact, this weekend we are at Watkins Glen with the Supercharged RCF "Red Devil" for its 8th track day with the supercharger and I think 15th track day with the suspension.

The biggest problem with the RCF is that it is simply undersprung for a car of it's mass and grip. There is no issue with mucking up the camber curve when lowering the RCF, the issue is limited front suspension travel, which is mitigated by the significantly higher spring rates we use versus stock. Of course, our instruction manual specifies an optimal lowered height, which our customers sometimes choose to go below for aesthetic reasons.

Further, we have several other RCFs owners who seriously track their cars. One of whom is Ricky who competes in (I think) redline time attack. He has independently confirmed a 3+ sec improvement in lap times through suspension alone, independent of tire choice.

Lastly, "feel" is a big part of driving and enjoying a car. If your stock RCF is under steering and rolling that certainly takes away from the fun of driving it. Having that direct connected feel is actually a big part of enjoying the car, not to mention that reducing weight transfer motions gives most drivers the confidence to go faster.

Rafi

lobuxracer

iTrader: (2)

The RC F, GS F, and IS F (even the '08s) are all undersprung from the factory for track duty. No surprise, they're selling a street car.

Camber curve is just one element of what might or might not get mucked when lowering. Roll couple and roll axis are actually just as important as hitting the sweet spot in the camber curve, but without measuring the chassis and modeling the suspension, you're just guessing and testing. I think we've had this discussion a long time ago about the IS F.

Feel...yeah...I had a conversation with an IRL chassis tuner once when I was flying from the west coast. He told me he doesn't care how the car feels as long as it is fast. If' it's hard to drive, that's the driver's job, that's why he get paid, so "I don't care how it feels." He was pretty adamant and animated about this statement. When a guy at that level tells me feel is no indicator of success, I'm more than willing to listen. I am sure is is reassuring to those who are newer at track driving when it feels good, and certainly BMW has made a lot of design decisions based on feel so they can market their cars, but in the end, it has little to do with measured mechanical performance in the hands of a skilled driver. Riley and Scott have built some notoriously difficult to drive cars that won championships.

Finally, yes indeed you guys go to the track and test and it has been instrumental to your success, but you don't race. Hopefully the GT version of this chassis isn't so different from the street going version that there is at least SOME trickle down.

13FSPORT

iTrader: (1)

How are these compared to the Ohlins coilovers by Fig? Just trying to decide which kit I should buy.

RRRacing

iTrader: (1)

Compared to Ohlins:

(1) We use solid spherical bushings bushings for top and bottom mounts. This resutls in a more direct feel and less piston drag during articulation of the shock. This results in a bit of noise over very bumpy roads, but based on feedback we get, its a minor or non-issue. Lets put it this way, most folks with aftermarket exhaust wont hear it.
(2) We use articulating upper spring perches, rather than mounting the springs to the top mounting plate of the suspension. Articulating upper spring perches means that the spring is kept axial with respect to the shock absorber, reducing spring bending and therefore improving shock response by reducing piston drag on the shock. In the long run, this also improves shock life.
(3) We use Afco Racing Shocks, custom valved to our specification. These are very high quality shocks that are 100% made in USA.
(4) Support: In case it is every necessary to service or rebuild, these shocks can either be sent to us for "same day" rebuild, or to any number of dozens of local Afco dealers across the country.
(5) Like Ohlins setup, we do custom spring rates per our customer requirement. Instead of Swift springs from Japan, we use Hypercoil springs from USA. Every bit as good.
(5) *significant cost savings* vs. Ohlins. We actually sell our Penske setup for same price as Ohlins... but lets not compare apples and oranges: Penske 7500 shocks are double independently adjustable USA made shock, and Ohlins R&T is an Asian made consumer oriented shock, not the high end race stuff coming out of their Swedish facility.

Having said all that, I am not saying Ohlins setup is not good, I have to believe it is, but we worked hard on our R&T setup to make sure that the value for what you are paying is unsurpassed.

Rafi