sc300 died left me stranded, igniter?
05-06-15, 12:03 PM
#1
sc300 died left me stranded, igniter?
Alright so in the past 5,000 miles this car has gotten a brand new:
Starter, distributor, distributor cap, distributor rotor, alternator, battery, spark plugs, coil leads, crank pulley, and a few suspension parts that are unimportant. 12v fuel mod is done and I can hear the fuel pump on when key is in on position.
Now I was driving on the highway for a good 20 minutes and I noticed it was bogging a bit, and seemed to be running a bit rich. Figured I'd check it when I got back home but lol. Motor died while I was driving, so I pulled over and parked in a dealership on the side of the road. Popped the hood to make sure there were no loose vacuum lines, they were all in place.
Tried to crank the car and it cranks but won't turn over. I'm 99% sure its a bad ignitor, but I wanted to run it by everyone here first. Had to leave the car for now cuz I was on a way to a job interview and I'm sitting in the lobby now. When I'm done I'll have it towed and try to test the ignitor.
Is there anything else that could have caused this problem, or am I right to just address the ignitor first?
Edit: Problem resolved, Coolant Temp Sensor Was Faulty
Starter, distributor, distributor cap, distributor rotor, alternator, battery, spark plugs, coil leads, crank pulley, and a few suspension parts that are unimportant. 12v fuel mod is done and I can hear the fuel pump on when key is in on position.
Now I was driving on the highway for a good 20 minutes and I noticed it was bogging a bit, and seemed to be running a bit rich. Figured I'd check it when I got back home but lol. Motor died while I was driving, so I pulled over and parked in a dealership on the side of the road. Popped the hood to make sure there were no loose vacuum lines, they were all in place.
Tried to crank the car and it cranks but won't turn over. I'm 99% sure its a bad ignitor, but I wanted to run it by everyone here first. Had to leave the car for now cuz I was on a way to a job interview and I'm sitting in the lobby now. When I'm done I'll have it towed and try to test the ignitor.
Is there anything else that could have caused this problem, or am I right to just address the ignitor first?
Edit: Problem resolved, Coolant Temp Sensor Was Faulty
Last edited by eknine9; 07-18-16 at 04:04 PM.
05-07-15, 12:52 PM
#4
I'm not yet, I'll be testing the ignitor for spark today. If it sparks I'll tear the ECU out and peek under the cover. If it doesn't I'll replace the ignitor and see if the problem is fixed. I'd just never heard of an SC300 ignitor going out either which is why I made the thread to see if anyone else has had similar issues.
05-07-15, 03:24 PM
#5
really sounds like the cap and rotor, but you said you did those, maybe give the cap a little whack with a screwdriver handle and test for any change.
check the connector for loose pins, IGF coming loose will pretty much cause a toyota not to run all of a sudden.
could even be the distributor (usually throws rpm code). you should be getting a code to help point the way, if no code then maybe a bad ecu.
the CEL should help narrow it down.
check the connector for loose pins, IGF coming loose will pretty much cause a toyota not to run all of a sudden.
could even be the distributor (usually throws rpm code). you should be getting a code to help point the way, if no code then maybe a bad ecu.
the CEL should help narrow it down.
05-07-15, 06:20 PM
#6
It tossed code 12, for the RPM sensor. Which is a little confusing since my distributor is 5 months old from January. It threw the same code back then and replacing the distributor fixed the problem.
It's also throwing code 78 "fuel circuit relay" I'm running a 12v fuel pump mod already, is it possible that maybe I have blown fuses or something simple? I'd hate to believe my nearly new distributor is gone. Anyways, it started raining so I had to hustle back inside before I could check the fuses, but I'll check those anyways once the rain stops.
It's also throwing code 78 "fuel circuit relay" I'm running a 12v fuel pump mod already, is it possible that maybe I have blown fuses or something simple? I'd hate to believe my nearly new distributor is gone. Anyways, it started raining so I had to hustle back inside before I could check the fuses, but I'll check those anyways once the rain stops.
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05-21-15, 05:16 PM
#8
So I just got home from my trip and reconnected the battery. Cars on the curb, not in the garage.
DMM reads the battery as 12vokts, but now when trying to turn the key the dash dims and it sounds like the car battery doesn't have enough charge to push the starter which I know is not true.
I really just wanted to get it started so I could drive it up the driveway and into my parents garage to get out of the rain so I could pull the ECU, but it seems that's not going to happen with this weather being more of the same.
Does all of this still sound like an ECU problem to y'all? I checked all the distributor plugs and vacuum hoses and they're all snug and plugged in. I'm a little too low for me to get under and check the starter connection, but I doubt that's loose as my starter is about 16 months old and was just removed, reconnected, and tightened in march (maybe February) by me trying to diagnose another starting issue.
Anyways just looking for any other possible suggestions while I wait for the rain to end.
DMM reads the battery as 12vokts, but now when trying to turn the key the dash dims and it sounds like the car battery doesn't have enough charge to push the starter which I know is not true.
I really just wanted to get it started so I could drive it up the driveway and into my parents garage to get out of the rain so I could pull the ECU, but it seems that's not going to happen with this weather being more of the same.
Does all of this still sound like an ECU problem to y'all? I checked all the distributor plugs and vacuum hoses and they're all snug and plugged in. I'm a little too low for me to get under and check the starter connection, but I doubt that's loose as my starter is about 16 months old and was just removed, reconnected, and tightened in march (maybe February) by me trying to diagnose another starting issue.
Anyways just looking for any other possible suggestions while I wait for the rain to end.
05-23-15, 12:42 PM
#11
Moderator
It may not hurt to turn the crankshaft by socket to confirm that the engine can spin if the starter tries to spin it.
Once we cross that bridge [engine spinning at or around normal starting] and it fails to catch then we can explore what else is going on. I do understand that the car died while it was running, but first things first.
Hope your interview went well.
Salim
Once we cross that bridge [engine spinning at or around normal starting] and it fails to catch then we can explore what else is going on. I do understand that the car died while it was running, but first things first.
Hope your interview went well.
Salim
06-09-15, 05:30 PM
#12
I had problems with mine shutting off after few minutes and then not starting for a few hours. Turns out the brand new rotor I had gotten from rockauto had a slight cover of plastic or nylon over it Got the same exact brand etc from autozone and fired right up no problems.
06-10-15, 10:32 AM
#13
these motors are non inteference so if you can't turn the crank by hand (use a 22mm socket) it usually means you have a leaky injector filling up the cylinder on shut down. if that is the case pull the plugs and try again and see if it spits out a bunch of gas.
this does not sound like your problem though.
a bad ecu can also cause overfueling and cause a similar condition where the injector driver is shorted and on key on it will just start filling the cylinder with fuel. its more rare but I have helped someone figure out that issue on here before.
this does not sound like your problem though.
as I said earlier with the RPM code, its likely a distributor issues or a rotor and cap issue. I can say that when mine failed I replaced it with a generic, and it worked for a little bit then started misfiring and didn't work also, when I then replaced that one with a toyota unit I was all good for a very long time. I don't think the specs on those caps and rotors are as tight as the original specification, and since 100% of your spark goes through it, its essential for it to be in tip top shape.
This sounds like your problem, what kind of distributor did you replace it with, used or new, generic or oem?
I would probably go with a good used one vs a generic on the distributor if possible to find a good low mileage one, and then replace the cap and rotor before they go bad to ensure your distributor doesn't go bad again, as that is what messes up the crank sensor and throws a code 12.
if you are not firing on a given cylinder and you probably aren't if its throwing a code 12, it could also fill up with fuel and cause the starter not to be able to crank the motor, but would have to be a pretty bad case as in that cylinder is never getting spark.
But right now you aren't even getting that far, I would say even though your battery says 12V, it might have a bad cell from being discharged too far (every time a battery is discharged below 12V there is a chance it will drop a cell, once it drops a few, its toast) and what happens is as soon as its loaded, that voltage it said it has all of a sudden drops. this is common with older batteries, but I have personally ruined a few new batteries myself and observed this also. the dim lights on the dash is basically a low battery sign, there is not much else that does that. I would suggest jumping it off another car if the lights are coming on at all it has nothing to do with the ecu as the main relay is on at that point.
you can also take them to places like autozone etc.. and they can load test your battery for you. it takes like an hour.
this does not sound like your problem though.
a bad ecu can also cause overfueling and cause a similar condition where the injector driver is shorted and on key on it will just start filling the cylinder with fuel. its more rare but I have helped someone figure out that issue on here before.
this does not sound like your problem though.
as I said earlier with the RPM code, its likely a distributor issues or a rotor and cap issue. I can say that when mine failed I replaced it with a generic, and it worked for a little bit then started misfiring and didn't work also, when I then replaced that one with a toyota unit I was all good for a very long time. I don't think the specs on those caps and rotors are as tight as the original specification, and since 100% of your spark goes through it, its essential for it to be in tip top shape.
This sounds like your problem, what kind of distributor did you replace it with, used or new, generic or oem?
I would probably go with a good used one vs a generic on the distributor if possible to find a good low mileage one, and then replace the cap and rotor before they go bad to ensure your distributor doesn't go bad again, as that is what messes up the crank sensor and throws a code 12.
if you are not firing on a given cylinder and you probably aren't if its throwing a code 12, it could also fill up with fuel and cause the starter not to be able to crank the motor, but would have to be a pretty bad case as in that cylinder is never getting spark.
But right now you aren't even getting that far, I would say even though your battery says 12V, it might have a bad cell from being discharged too far (every time a battery is discharged below 12V there is a chance it will drop a cell, once it drops a few, its toast) and what happens is as soon as its loaded, that voltage it said it has all of a sudden drops. this is common with older batteries, but I have personally ruined a few new batteries myself and observed this also. the dim lights on the dash is basically a low battery sign, there is not much else that does that. I would suggest jumping it off another car if the lights are coming on at all it has nothing to do with the ecu as the main relay is on at that point.
you can also take them to places like autozone etc.. and they can load test your battery for you. it takes like an hour.
06-10-15, 10:50 AM
#14
autozone can test your igniter as well as your battery and alternator and starter. I would say take your igniter to get tested. but honestly best thing to do is take it step by step. is the body of the igniter grounded properly. I tried relocating my igniter and used Velcro, I was wondering so hard why it wouldn't turn on until the third time I took the igniter to get tested at autozone. they let me hook up the tester cause the guy didn't know what he was doing, (I new how because I used to work at autozone so I showed him how to,) one of the connections on the tester is to place the ground wire on the body of the igniter then something clicked in my head and told me that's why my car didn't turn on. haha.
but also, the connections on my igniter are loose on the connector. if the car is running and the connections come loose, it'll shut the car off and throw a code 12. I did the fuel pump ecu mod also and have a code 78 only when the car doesn't want to start and it doesn't see the fuel pump ecu. but when it runs, code 78 never shows up. im guessing the ecu just goes into full test mode when the car doesn't turn on and is trying to help in every way it can, which is why it only shows code 78 when the engine is having a hard time starting.
first step though is check for spark, if its not getting spark, follow the diagnostic tree from there. if it is getting spark, try giving it some starting fluid after the maf sensor. if it turns on, its a fuel problem, if it doesn't, then check for timing or possible ecu. that's the best I can help with as of now.
but also, the connections on my igniter are loose on the connector. if the car is running and the connections come loose, it'll shut the car off and throw a code 12. I did the fuel pump ecu mod also and have a code 78 only when the car doesn't want to start and it doesn't see the fuel pump ecu. but when it runs, code 78 never shows up. im guessing the ecu just goes into full test mode when the car doesn't turn on and is trying to help in every way it can, which is why it only shows code 78 when the engine is having a hard time starting.
first step though is check for spark, if its not getting spark, follow the diagnostic tree from there. if it is getting spark, try giving it some starting fluid after the maf sensor. if it turns on, its a fuel problem, if it doesn't, then check for timing or possible ecu. that's the best I can help with as of now.
06-10-15, 12:41 PM
#15
Well I never updated this thread lol.
I removed the ECU about two weeks ago, and pulled off the inspection cover. Two of the capacitors in the corner had leaked all over the board, so I assumed that was my problem and sent it off to be repaired by Tanin. It shipped back to me on Monday but has not arrived yet, so I dunno if that will fix the problem or not.
The distributor I installed was purchased brand new but it was from Autozone, and not the Lexus/Toyota OEM brand. When I did that I also installed a brand new cap and rotor. If it is a distributor issue I'd rather just bite the bullet and go with a new OEM one if thats going to be what it takes. Just kind of disappointing that the Auozone one didn't last very long at all as it wasn't very fun replacing the distributor.
Also I have noticed the car has been overfueling for a long while, especially on start-up and it was an issue that I was never really ever able to diagnose, don't know if it's related or not, it would be nice if that issue clears up as well with the refinished ECU from Tanin, but we'll see once the ECU arrives. I'm hoping it comes today.
I removed the ECU about two weeks ago, and pulled off the inspection cover. Two of the capacitors in the corner had leaked all over the board, so I assumed that was my problem and sent it off to be repaired by Tanin. It shipped back to me on Monday but has not arrived yet, so I dunno if that will fix the problem or not.
The distributor I installed was purchased brand new but it was from Autozone, and not the Lexus/Toyota OEM brand. When I did that I also installed a brand new cap and rotor. If it is a distributor issue I'd rather just bite the bullet and go with a new OEM one if thats going to be what it takes. Just kind of disappointing that the Auozone one didn't last very long at all as it wasn't very fun replacing the distributor.
Also I have noticed the car has been overfueling for a long while, especially on start-up and it was an issue that I was never really ever able to diagnose, don't know if it's related or not, it would be nice if that issue clears up as well with the refinished ECU from Tanin, but we'll see once the ECU arrives. I'm hoping it comes today.