MJHSC400

Panache and sizzle-- Porsche has got--

SC's are deceptively smooth-- people can't tell if they're fast or not by looking, and there's so few of them it's prob. not common knowledge on their power output--

SC's seem to be built to fly down the interstate and rape anything there, they just need a little boost to do it-- That's where these headers come in--

c0wboy

Agreed. Many who choose to outfit they're SC can afford both a Viper and a new Z06, yet they know Toyota quality. Many of them come from a MKIV Supra background. Yes, the SC holds a "cost savvy" reputation in the industry, but there are some out there that love the car and give it all they've got.

Also as a caveat, from what Kevin@MVP has told me the group buy will be going up tomorrow at the $2500 level

Eric

c0wboy

Ye'sir, up until now if an SC guy wanted perforamance, it was the 3.0L or nothing. Now at least the SC400 guy has options for a resonable price. Granted we're not talking about 300 or even 400 rwhp. We're talking about HP levels on par with what the 2jz puts out on a regular basis.

For reference, here's the link to the group buy. It's only going on for 4 weeks, so let's get these rolling.

http://sr1.clublexus.com/forums/showthread.php?t=282931

Eric

Pheonix

Supraforums:

• Take the header wrap off.
• That particular log style of manifold is not the best design possible in a turbo manifold. It's the cheap & quick way. For much less money, someone could have modified the OEM manifold to accomplish the same thing. Food for thought...
• THAT IS NOT "thick wall pipe". It looks like typical t304 16-gauge. When you build a header & claim you're using thick wall... That means you've broke out the Schedule-40. 16-gauge = .08", schedule 10 = .106", schedule 40 = .145"
• The amount of material cost, work done VS the price is completely outrageous. The price is simply rediculous for those turbo manifolds

Header wrap is stupid. It's destructive, and DOES NOT save money VS cermaic coatings when building & selling a product over time. I would seriously suggest buying youself a powder coating gun, and buying, or making an oven. Powder is much cheaper than wrap. It also won't retain moisture & cause your stainless to rust.



I do like the flanges. I preffer mild flanges greatly on turbo manifolds, but it's a personal prefferance, not an issue of right/wrong. I like you flanges.









Those manifolds typically would run roughly $600 a pop for a descently good home fabricator to make. Which there are dozens, hundreds floating around the net. So that'd be the $1200 range, give or a take afew hundred. Now that that's a blind guess, and I don't like blind. So let's break it down!

4x 1.5" 16-gauge 180* mandrel bends with legs = $80usd
6' 1/5" 16-gauge staight pipe = $50usd
Not sure what size V-band you're using but for example purposes:
2x 2.5" v-band kit $110usd
Custom waterjet/CNC milled flanges typicall run from free to $100 a pop. I'll spot ya & say $100 a pop. Flanges = $200
We're up to $440usd. In raw materials for both manifolds.

Any welder/fabricator worth knows that raw material cost x3 is *generally* going to be very,very close to the quoted price. $440usd x3 = $1320.















So $1320usd worth of work suddenly equals $2500usd how?




















At any rate. Your product does not seem to be bad. But at the price you are listing them at. My opinion of them changes from, "I'm glad someone is finally selling them", to "wow those manif's are POS's for the money, and are meant to separate people from their money just for monitary gain".





ps, I am not being insultive, simply stating what I think of them & should be obvious to anyone else that dabbles in any kind of exhaust / manifold / turbo manifold creation. The price / product ratio is horrible. Ya gotta recoupe some cost of down-time on the guy's car, but I honestly don't see why the price would, for any reason, everbe more than $1750usd shipped to anywhere in North America.

Pheonix

I like eric's top-secrit style intake manifolds lol!

MJHSC400

My reasoning for the comments on the EK's headers only being $1000, and they're just turned in the opposite direction, yet have much more equal length runners-

I think LS400 manifolds turned backwards with some very mild modification/fabrication have a larger primary and would flow better if done properly-- And MIGHT cost you $450 after modding--

c0wboy

• [*]
• [*]

I chose to heat wrap my own manifolds for my own purposes, not yours. I've wrapped my entire turbo system stem to stern on my 2jz GT47 88mm, and it's still in tact 3 years later. If the customer chooses ceramic coating or even polished finish we can accomodate that easily. I only offer the heat wrapping free of charge. What else you got for me, Alice?


I like the flanges as well, also the staineless V-bands


If you don't like the price, or can't afford the price, then keep on moving sir. I'm not in any way forcing anyone to buy these, so if it's a bit out of the range of folks looking to go FI, the only thing I can suggest to save a bit more money or to call me directly so that possibly we can work something out.


You seem to contradict yourself in your own arguement. You're entitled to your opinion, however if you think they're a POS mani, you can go pound chocolate right back where you came from. There's been nothing but garbage coming from your camp out on the brand X forum all all of your guys judge merit by final cost alone. Well sir, I will say that cheaper is hardly ever better and you have to pay for quality. If you've got something better for the 1uz as far as turbo manifolds go, I'd like to see it.


You are being insulting, and I feel that you know you're being insulting. That's why you copied your post on brand X's forum to wave it around like a little rainbow flag. I remember when Kirk from ClubNa-T linked me to your IM's as you were spouting off about TTC Performance. As I remember Kirk also told you what was what as well. The shame of it all is that we come out with/ release new and innovative parts for the community left and right, yet because I'm not brand X's go boy, we get put down for it. Point blank, if you don't like our products for the Lexus V8TT, then don't by them. I don't know how to make it any more clear than that.

Eric

c0wboy

I have used the header type manifolds flipped backwards to find if we could modify them, and it was a no go. It's a real pain to do. Again, if you guys wan to go make your own manifolds, no one will stop you. Please post up your pics when done. But as far as these manifolds go, they are set in at the $2500 level, and will stay there as long as the GB is up. I'm not forcing anyone to buy these manfolds, and if they're too much money, then I encourage the customer to either look elsewhere, save more money, or call me to talk about some sort of payment plan.

Eric

MJHSC400

I'm sure it's a pain to make look beautiful, but I'm willing to bet you can do it with great results for those that don't mind having a homebrew setup--

For those that want a show quality setup, they'll end up buying yours or building some like them-

c0wboy

It's really up to what the customer wants, honestly. Some want to do it in their garage for better or worse an save the dollar. It may not make big HP, but that may not be what they're after. Then there is the guys that I deal with that want to step up from the 800-1200 rwhp 2jzgte they've been working with for some, and step into a V8TT that will make just as much peak power, but with a completely usable powerband. The garage builts have always been in play, but now the other side of the fence has a viable option as well. We're making 3 sets for my customers as of today, so that tells me there is a need.

Thanks again,

Eric

SC400TT

iTrader: (4)

Dude (Phoenix):

You may know a lot more about manifold building than me, but your statements are, in some cases, erroneous, and in others, quite insulting...

What do you mean take the stock manifolds and turn them around???They will not even fit. Did you ever even take the time to measure the space available between the engine and the frame rails of the SC? Not only will they not fit, but the design on the stock mani's are at best horribly restrictive. For you to compare these manifolds to the stockers is insulting and misleading. To all the guys on this forum who do not have the level of experience and knowledge to know this, you are being irresponsible to post up such a ludicrous statement as you have. Let me make it clear. The stock manifolds cannot be reversed and used to build a turbo system on the SC. Just as a low mount turbo system on the SC is not possible unless you actually modify and reshape part of the floor board of the car.

I would think that you would also know that when anyone takes on a stock car to turbo it, or modify it, compromises have to be engineered into the equation. We are not talking about building a car from scratch where we are building the frame and all...We are talking about having to deal with the built in limitations that were built inot the car from the factory. The factory also does not build their cars to allow fro aftermarket modifications.

So, if you disagree with Erics price for the manifolds, you have the right to state that, and just state that. But stop dissing a fantastic piece of workmanship, which these headers are...And I want to state that I do not make a dime off the sale of these headers....BTW, Eric has the right to charge whatever he wants to for the headers....It's up to the buyer if he wants them.

I just want accurate statements made here.

Until Frank designed and made these headers, there was not a viable option for anybody to TT their SC400.

Ryan

MJHSC400

Naah-- The design is very close to the same as stockers regarding flow--

SC400TT

iTrader: (4)

Dude, you must have X Ray vision...I guess you can just look at the headers and determine what their flow is??? Give it a rest. This design is not even close to the stockers...

Here are some pics for you to "Eyeball"

Stock Headers:




New headers:



Even by eyeballing, you can see the huge difference betwen the merges...

Ryan

Blizzy

iTrader: (-1)

Every business has a right to offer their product at a certain price. If you don't like it, go elsewhere. If there is nowhere else to go, make them cheaper. At the moment, there is no one else making turbo manifolds specifically designed for the UZ family of engines. If you can't make your own and want to go FI, this is the way to go. If you can't afford it, swap a JZ engine and make similar power.

This is probably true, but few people have the skill and tools required for such a job. Having never welded, I give myself no chance of making anything close to these manifolds. Nevertheless, I have no doubt that someone could make something that is effectively the same for only a portion of the cost. This homemade mentality is able to be applied at every level from baking a cake to turboing a V8.

Take a look at the stock engine bay. While it is true that the stock manifolds or even an aftermarket manifold turned backwards would be able to bolt up to the exhaust ports, there is no way you are going to fit one inside the frame on the driver's side. This set up would make sense only in a car with a larger engine bay capable of fitting a bulky manifold. Look at the extreme bends in the driver's side manifold and then look how close it is to barely fitting over the frame of the car. Having had this exact thought as you, I have come to the conclusion that this "trick" is unable to be exploited in our small engine bay.



Having had the chance to talk with Eric many times via PM, I am confident that he is only out for the best in the Lexus/Toyota V8 community. In no way is he trying to rip off anyone. This product might as well be custom.

Unfortunately for most (me included), while going FI would be amazing, it would be too expensive:
- stock motor and tranny can only hold ~400whp safely before rebuild
- v160 swap is upwards of $5k cover to cover for a tranny to handle the power
- building up the motor with forged insternals is $2k+ just for pistons and rods as you would need eight of each
- manifolds cost $2500
- two nice turbos cost $2500
- fuel management, intercooler, exhaust, BOV, wastegate, etc, etc is thousands.

No one ever said modifying a V8 was cheap. This V8 is no exception since it was not built to hold extreme power.

For cheap power, the JZ engine are still the way to go. But, for something truly unique and special with a power band from 1500-6500, the UZ engines are worth the price...if you are willing and able to fork over the dough.

c0wboy

Thanks Blizzy,

Again, just to be clear, we're offering the ONLY readily available option for twin/single turbo systems for the SC400. These manifolds are as one off as they come, and are very labor intensive. We are even offering a 1 year warrantee against cracking. These are aimed towards the DIY crowd that can handle the rest of the kit. For a full kit, PM me and I'm sure we can work something out.

In my opinion, there's always some armchair quarterbacks out there, and those folks are neither here nor there. The Lexus V8 crowd has been asking for these manifolds for years, and now there here. It's time to move on them and get the 1uz out of the mud performance wise.

Eric