l1n1234

If the 2013+ ever turn out to be more reliable it may be due to the 3000 parts out 6000 that lexus claimed for the refresh
2013 ls460 refresh
The 2013s are 6yr old now and some must be getting over 100K miles. I wonder what problems they are experiencing.

bass911

I bought a 2007 LS460l with 92k miles a year ago for 10k cash. It is silver with the light tan interior, but I think Lexus calls it light gray. It doesn't burn any oil. It doesn't have rear reclining seats or air suspension. This is my third LS, but I don't even drive it that much. It isn't the best looking car imo, but people give me compliments all the time. It just passed inspection. I have no intention on selling it anytime soon.

fwhomeboy

I noticed you're in TEXAS. People there will compliment you just because. That's they way we were raised.

bass911

I'm in Texas but in the Dallas area where people have plenty of money. People in Dallas buy Tesla like they're cheap. It is harder to get a compliment in the DFW area than you think.

fwhomeboy

I'm biased. I was born and raised in Fort Worth. I also lived in Arlington, Euless, and Irving. Everyone back in the day were mostly very nice folks. Tesla wasn't invented yet.

bass911

I've lived in all of those areas for long periods of time and it is different now. It was so much better back in the day. It is so bad now I almost don't want to live here anymore.

fwhomeboy

Man, that's sad to hear. I can't wait to move back home. Theres No Place like home.

abs

So, I am also in the market for an LS460. I have had my LS430 for many years, it still runs great, but showing a lot of signs of wear from 185k miles of use. I would love to know how I can get an LS460 without having to pay retail prices. The fact that a dealer can simply go to an auction because they have an ID card that gives them access, then buy a vehicle at a huge discount where the auction already evaluated, inspected and rated the car and where they have a guaranteed return within 30 days if needed, and then turn around and sell it with a 30-50% mark up is super frustrating. What value is the dealer adding in this scenario that justifies the markup? They have very little risk and make huge profits. How can I get myself into the auction or find someone who isn't so greedy and willing to get me the car I want without the huge mark up? The issue with private sellers is that the selection of vehicles is far more limited than the auction, I'd rather get a newer car with lower miles from the auction at wholesale pricing. If I can't do what I'm describing, then the discussion about dealer wholesale prices is largely moot since all that really matters in that instance is the retail price.

TriC

Wholesale price knowledge is far from moot as it gives some idea of what a dealer may have in a car and thus how much mark-up there is. It is not unusual for a dealer to initially price an LS 460 WAY above what they paid and then come down over time. Example: there's one here locally that has been on the lot of a Nissan store for months. In that time the asking price has dropped by $7000, so it's now probably priced close to what they paid for it. So, they are stuck as wholesaling it now would result in a significant loss.

Further, why be frustrated? Surely one does not expect to buy a new suit for Macy's wholesale or a dishwasher from Lowe's at their cost.

1WILLY1

iTrader: (9)

No one is able to consistently get 30% off market value even at auctions, 50% is unheard of and would only be possible on a damaged vehicle.

The car market is flooded with dealers , for any deal at any auction there will be tons of others bidding on it driving the prices up.

Forget the auctions and the dealers, deal with people, you can get better prices.

abs

From what I am seeing, and from calls I'm making to dealers, older LS460's are selling close to asking price. The dealers know that they can get the price they want. Some of the LS460L's I'm looking at have an asking price of $19-$20k. Based on information shared here, the dealer probably paid $12-$13k at the auction for these vehicles, translating to a 50% markup. Can the dealer always get that kind of return? I'm not sure. My point is that the dealer is not adding value in this equation. The auction is taking the risk, not the dealer. As a consumer, I'd prefer to be able to bid on those vehicles at auction myself, I'm not sure how the dealer model helps anyone other than driving prices up and supporting a retail industry that delivers no real societal value aside from insulating the auction companies from the public. With respect to purchasing a vehicle from a "person" and not a "company," I would be open to that, but those opportunities are not as common and I'm not sure how many people are willing to wait months or years to find the car they want. Aside from that, I'm not saying that I do not want to know wholesale pricing, the point I'm making is that the used car retailers are able to generate substantial markup, with very limited risk and basically get substantial profits for little to no added value. Further, I am asking for feedback on how I can short-circuit that rigged system and get direct access to the auctions which will have a greater assortment of available vehicles and at substantially reduced prices. Seems to me that this is an industry ripe for disruption, Amazon should begin offering it's own automotive auction platform, direct to consumer . . .

dblock05

You need to find someone or ask a small independent dealership saying you will pay them a finder fee such as 500$ for them to bid/buy a car for you.

I do not have access to the auction either but I can tell you that you're overestimating their profit at times. Not every car that they get is ready to go to be sold. The dealership has to spend time doing minor work, detailing it, and other things can pop up.

I agree with you though....the system that we live in with dealerships is messed up. Same thing with real estate agents...

DedBirdDog

I sent you a DM. Hopefully, that will help you out some. Margins are nowhere near 30 to 50%. I'd say somewhere around 10%, which is entirely reasonable. The DM explains this better. Good luck!

abs

Thank you DedBirdDog! As always, I appreciate your insights.

1WILLY1

iTrader: (9)

The one thing we have to remember is for the most part "the good cars" don't make it to auction.

Dealers dump their cars into auctions after a while of not selling on the lot, or when they cant get book value for them for some reason.(mechanical issues, cosmetic issues, history issues etc...)

A recent car I almost bought 2012 XJL supercharged was priced under market value, when I got there for a test drive I seen quickly the bumper was resprayed (not professionally ) , dings on some body panels, rocker had scrapes, wheels were badly curb rashed (all fairly minor stuff to me) but he could not sell it for even under retail because of these issues and didn't want to pay a body shop to do it, because his profit margin was probably already pretty low......so it went to auction AGAIN and became someone elses problem.

The auctions also have fees that the buyers and sellers must pay as well as taxes of course. (makes a quick flip that much harder)

But yes there are dealers who will allow you to buy a car through them for a fee of a few hundred dollars.

Im not trying to change your mind though, im sure if you gain access too the auctions you can score a deal , but there is a risk involved as well, (at least in my opinion)

Good luck