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I've tried searching within the forum but not easily finding what I'm looking for, so probably re-posting a bit here.
Questions:
1) Do all Sport models from '10-'12 come with the 19 inch 5 star rims?
2) Do all '10-'12 sport models have the black interior with the "brown" accents? I'm seeing conflicting pictures of the interior - some show the middle of the seat is "brown" while others just show subtle stitching around the edge of the seat. Any pics from Sport owners would be appreciated.
3) Is the sport woodgrain different than regular models? In pics it looks a little less "glossy" - I think I remember some folks posting on here that it was actually a different type of wood (maybe bamboo)?
4) Do the '10-'12 sport models all have Levinson?
5) Any drawbacks to the Sport? Ride quality? Are the brakes different (more brake dust, more expensive to repair/replace, etc)?
6) Edit: Please point out any change in the Sport model each year between '10-'12
Update: I just found a thread that answers most of my questions. My new questions are:
1) Cost to ditch the Brembo brakes for ones that don't create as much brake dust?
2) Are the 20 spoke rims the only wheels that come with the car? I would really prefer the 5 star rims. I would have to factor this cost in to buying a sport as I would switch the rims.
3) Edit: adding this question. I see certain pictures of a Sport where the steering wheel is wrapped in leather (no wood at all) - and others where the steering wheel has the wood grain. I'm also seeing Sports nationwide that have the 5 star rims. Finally, I'm seeing some that have Levinson and others that don't appear to have it. I'm confused as to what is standard and what is not on the Sport package.
Update: I just found a thread that answers most of my questions. My new questions are:
1) Cost to ditch the Brembo brakes for ones that don't create as much brake dust?
2) Are the 20 spoke rims the only wheels that come with the car? I would really prefer the 5 star rims. I would have to factor this cost in to buying a sport as I would switch the rims.
3) Edit: adding this question. I see certain pictures of a Sport where the steering wheel is wrapped in leather (no wood at all) - and others where the steering wheel has the wood grain. I'm also seeing Sports nationwide that have the 5 star rims. Finally, I'm seeing some that have Levinson and others that don't appear to have it. I'm confused as to what is standard and what is not on the Sport package.
JR, can you post a link to the thread you found that answered most of your questions? I'm starting to research the 10-12 Sports as well.
To answer your questions about the brake dust issue: you can switch to ceramic brake pads, and they will significantly reduce your brake dust. I did this on my prior BMW 335i and my current ISF - big reduction in brake dust. The best brand I've found for dust reduction is Akebono (used them on my 335, not available on my ISF). Not sure if you can get Akebono for the LS Sport brakes... I'm using Hawk ceramic on my ISF, and it's a big reduction in dust, but not as big as the Akebonos.
I think the 20 spoke wheels are standard on the Sports, but the 5 spokes are an option with the appearance package (someone correct me if I'm wrong please).
JR, can you post a link to the thread you found that answered most of your questions? I'm starting to research the 10-12 Sports as well.
To answer your questions about the brake dust issue: you can switch to ceramic brake pads, and they will significantly reduce your brake dust. I did this on my prior BMW 335i and my current ISF - big reduction in brake dust. The best brand I've found for dust reduction is Akebono (used them on my 335, not available on my ISF). Not sure if you can get Akebono for the LS Sport brakes... I'm using Hawk ceramic on my ISF, and it's a big reduction in dust, but not as big as the Akebonos.
I think the 20 spoke wheels are standard on the Sports, but the 5 spokes are an option with the appearance package (someone correct me if I'm wrong please).
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/ls-...ld-i-bite.html That's a good thread that answered most of my questions. Would be a good one for you to read because the person who started it is coming from an ISF as well. Appreciate your response- I thought the Sport was relatively rare so assumed** there wouldn't be any variation in the different models (wheels, steering wheel w/ leather only vs. wood, Levinson, etc). I'll send you a PM with a link to a car you may want to consider.
I've tried searching within the forum but not easily finding what I'm looking for, so probably re-posting a bit here.
Questions:
1) Do all Sport models from '10-'12 come with the 19 inch 5 star rims?
2) Do all '10-'12 sport models have the black interior with the "brown" accents? I'm seeing conflicting pictures of the interior - some show the middle of the seat is "brown" while others just show subtle stitching around the edge of the seat. Any pics from Sport owners would be appreciated.
3) Is the sport woodgrain different than regular models? In pics it looks a little less "glossy" - I think I remember some folks posting on here that it was actually a different type of wood (maybe bamboo)?
4) Do the '10-'12 sport models all have Levinson?
5) Any drawbacks to the Sport? Ride quality? Are the brakes different (more brake dust, more expensive to repair/replace, etc)?
6) Edit: Please point out any change in the Sport model each year between '10-'12
Thank you for any help.
2010 sport
Black seats with brown stitching. Also you can see a brown layer through the perforations on the seating areas. Kinda nice looking.
Multi spoke wheels (20?) look nice but are a pain to clean. The 5 spokes look like old man ES tho
Wood grain looks more like real wood. Matte look and not like the overly glossy plastic wood on other cars. I hate glossy plastic wood with a passion
It does have the mark levinson. I dont have my cut sheet in front of me so I dont know if it is an added package. You should be able to tell if you have an interior photo of the center console as its usually noted.
Ride quality is a bit rough with the 19 inch wheels. Kinda ruins the LS feel a bit if you have been in a 400 or 430. Toyota appears like they are trying to shed the old man image and go for a market that is still able to have most bodily functions unassisted. I cant really tell a difference in the adjustable suspension although other people have said its a subtle difference. Comfort is a bit more bouncy. Sport turns more flat. All modes clomp over bumps but thats more to do with the short rubber. Feels like it sits low but my other vehicle is a truck.
The best difference is the ECT power mode which wakes up the engine. The throttle is more sensitive, it hangs on to a lower gear, and shifts at a higher RPM.
The engine sound is disappointing and unrefined. It doesn't wound like a +$70K motor. Direct injection makes the car sound agricultural, like a tractor at idle. I have another direct injection V8 which also sounds clicky from the injectors but its more muted and masked a bit more by the intake/exhaust. Under light power the LS is more of a 'whir' instead of a V8 growl. WOT starts to sound like there is an engine under the hood. Its not really as big of a deal as i am making it though as it is quiet.
Paddle shifters are kinda disappointing. Shifting takes way too long up and especially down but thats coming from someone who drove manual for 15+ years. I personally never use it and see it as a novelty.
Sport uses air bladder for the shock's springs and its an integrated unit. This is what gives you the ability to raise the vehicle via the height button. The shocks are more expensive as a total unit about 1000 per wheel and you may have to replace a controller too. There are aftermarket conversions for 800-2000 USD for all corners to coilovers or standard spring/shock though. You will lose the function of the height button and the sport, normal, comfort button as well.
The brembo pads are grabby, dusty, and noisy at least for my 2010. You can replace these as noted easily with ceramic pads. Despite changing the pads and getting better rotors I still sing a song most mornings but at least its done after the first full stop and quiet under operation. The brembos would bark and whail frequently but not all the time. I bought the high carbon centric rotors which are supposed to be harder/better than the OE and barely cracked 100 a wheel from RockAuto. Pads are also about 50 a pair from memory. Probably 400-500 all in for all wheels. More than a standard car but nothing really to freak out about. Im sure lexus would ram you for triple though. The manual states that the rotors typically last 50K and the pads 25K miles.
Im not aware of any other differences other than the outside appearance between the 2010 sport and base LS.
Black seats with brown stitching. Also you can see a brown layer through the perforations on the seating areas. Kinda nice looking.
Multi spoke wheels (20?) look nice but are a pain to clean. The 5 spokes look like old man ES tho
Wood grain looks more like real wood. Matte look and not like the overly glossy plastic wood on other cars. I hate glossy plastic wood with a passion
It does have the mark levinson. I dont have my cut sheet in front of me so I dont know if it is an added package. You should be able to tell if you have an interior photo of the center console as its usually noted.
Ride quality is a bit rough with the 19 inch wheels. Kinda ruins the LS feel a bit if you have been in a 400 or 430. Toyota appears like they are trying to shed the old man image and go for a market that is still able to have most bodily functions unassisted. I cant really tell a difference in the adjustable suspension although other people have said its a subtle difference. Comfort is a bit more bouncy. Sport turns more flat. All modes clomp over bumps but thats more to do with the short rubber. Feels like it sits low but my other vehicle is a truck.
The best difference is the ECT power mode which wakes up the engine. The throttle is more sensitive, it hangs on to a lower gear, and shifts at a higher RPM.
The engine sound is disappointing and unrefined. It doesn't wound like a +$70K motor. Direct injection makes the car sound agricultural, like a tractor at idle. I have another direct injection V8 which also sounds clicky from the injectors but its more muted and masked a bit more by the intake/exhaust. Under light power the LS is more of a 'whir' instead of a V8 growl. WOT starts to sound like there is an engine under the hood. Its not really as big of a deal as i am making it though as it is quiet.
Paddle shifters are kinda disappointing. Shifting takes way too long up and especially down but thats coming from someone who drove manual for 15+ years. I personally never use it and see it as a novelty.
Sport uses air bladder for the shock's springs and its an integrated unit. This is what gives you the ability to raise the vehicle via the height button. The shocks are more expensive as a total unit about 1000 per wheel and you may have to replace a controller too. There are aftermarket conversions for 800-2000 USD for all corners to coilovers or standard spring/shock though. You will lose the function of the height button and the sport, normal, comfort button as well.
The brembo pads are grabby, dusty, and noisy at least for my 2010. You can replace these as noted easily with ceramic pads. Despite changing the pads and getting better rotors I still sing a song most mornings but at least its done after the first full stop and quiet under operation. The brembos would bark and whail frequently but not all the time. I bought the high carbon centric rotors which are supposed to be harder/better than the OE and barely cracked 100 a wheel from RockAuto. Pads are also about 50 a pair from memory. Probably 400-500 all in for all wheels. More than a standard car but nothing really to freak out about. Im sure lexus would ram you for triple though. The manual states that the rotors typically last 50K and the pads 25K miles.
Im not aware of any other differences other than the outside appearance between the 2010 sport and base LS.
This is awesome; thank you. Very helpful. I have a LX570 where the hydraulic height control went bad at around 80k miles- it was covered under CPO but would've run me about $2k or slightly more at Lexus if not covered. I don't know if I want another car with hydraulic/air suspension. I also appreciate what you mentioned about the difference in ride quality- I currently own an '04 430 and prior to that had a '96 400. If given the choice in ride quality options in an LS460, 99% of the time I would drive the car in the 'comfort' mode to try to get as close to the ride I have come accustomed to over the last 12 years of LS ownership.
I love the brown stitching and accents in the Sport from photos and will be seeing one in-person for the first time tomorrow. I'll take it for a test drive and if the ride feels too rough compared to the other 460's I have driven then I will just hold off and keep waiting for my perfect LS to show up. I do like some of the exterior styling cues of the Sport, especially the honeycomb grille, but I could easily add that to a non-sport LS.
I recently picked up a 11' Mercury Metallic Sport. Being a LS fanatic I've since then done extensive searching to see what sets them apart from other LS's. Some information isn't as detailed as it should be. It was tough to find all the specifications but I think I've tracked it all down.
Only six exterior colours and one interior trim were offered. The 2012 also offered a Special Edition with Obsidian Black exterior and 'Topaz Beige' interior. It seems all Sport models came with the 'Comfort Package'. Few options on this specific model were available. 'Luxury Value Edition' package included Navigation, Lexus Enform and ML Audio and you could get it with or without the Parking Guidance System. The only other option was the Pre-Collision System (PCS) with Dynamic Radar Cruise Control which seems to be rare. I'm not sure if the Sport could be had with the 'Cold Weather Package'.
Known in Japan as the LS460 Version SZ
Sport Package Includes (LS 460 RWD model only)
-19x8 split 10-spoke forged alloy wheels made by BBS. 245/45/19 tires.
-5 piece Aero kit includes front lower spoilers, side rocker panels and rear lower spoiler with blacked out air diffuser. Unique front sport grille (Also available as a RWD stand alone option part of the 'Apperance Package' which featured different 19 inch 5 spoke wheels)
-Black/Saddle Brown unique interior trim with additional leather on doors over 'base' models. Ecsaine headliner.
-Sport front seats with additional side bolsters and support
-Dark Brown Ash Burl trim with matte finish
-Perforated leather-trimmed and heated steering wheel
-Brembo 6 piston front brakes used in the ISF with 380mm rotors and high friction pads -Custom 2mm larger stabilizer bars and absorber. 21mm total
-Quicker shifting Lexus’ Sport Direct Shift transmission used in the ISF with rev matching down shifts. Upshifts are 0.3 seconds while downshifts are 0.2 seconds. Aluminum Paddle shifters
-Sport-tuned air suspension
-Sport-tuned steering with Variable Gear Ratio Steering (VGRS) -Driving Response and Acceleration Management System (DRAMS) have been exclusively tuned for the Sports version
One feature that I could not find listed which is found on 13'+ F Sport models is the Torsen differential. I've had this car sideways it sure seems that it does have some form of LSD.
*Edit- I verified by translating some Japanese articles that it has the 'Electronic LSD' also found in 08-09 ISFs.
My 2011 Mercury Metallic Sport has the cold weather package, along with comfort package and ML audio. And it does have the Torsen diff - I recently corrected a slight tire edge feathering issue with the help of this handy item by reducing rear tire pressure to 25psi, turning TRAC off, and doing a few gigantic burnouts. Presto, no more edge feathering! Rotate fronts to rear, repeat, and now all tires are good.
Its all been answered well here, but I had the same questions and followed it all the way through. Here are my results:
I had a 2007 SWB and I went to a 2012 Sport
1) Mine came with the multi-spoke wheels.
2) For 2012s I've seen, anyway, silver exterior got Black/Chocolate inserts and stitching, black exteriors got the more butterscotch inserts and stitching.
3) The wood does have a matte finish, and it is wonderful from the traditional shiny style, you can really see the grain. Its closer to a fine furniture finish.
4) I have seen some without Levinson, or at least the listings skipped it
5) The ride is a bit firmer, but not terrible, and if you stick with the stock pads rotors = by far best performance. I will have my car at Mid Ohio for the second time later this year. Even though it's heavier, it handles better than the 2007 regular one. And amazing brakes!
BUT noise and dust are out of control. Pads are $400 at dealer, just for the front. After track day, It would have been $1200 to replace all 4 corners at dealer. I ordered everything from Rock Auto for $400.
It's hard to find wheels and tires and brakes and such for the 10 - 12 sport because of the weird special edition it was.. . it's a lot easier to search on 2013 F-Sport (which shares the same hardware.)
UPGRADE You can get 2 piece semi or fully floating 380mm rotors from Ceika, racingbrake.com and others and really cut down on the front rotor weight by almost half.
This car (with the door and trunk closers, along with the air suspension and giant rotors) weighs a bit more than the 2007 I had before, and gets about 1 mpg less. Even the forged wheels that ship with it weigh more. . like 50 lbs with the tire mounted! My Lumarais Morros with 275s mounted weigh less!
Im still undecided as to what I will replace my front brakes with when it comes time. I do have the ocassional squeal which is annoying despite the nice stopping power. I can see why Lexus changed the shade of the 13'+ F Sport wheels to gunmetal to hide the brake dust.
Here is the 2012 Special Edition 'Topaz Beige' interior for reference.
Van, that special edition interior is sharp. As far as the brakes, RocketSlug is right that the stock pads will give you the best initial bite and ultimate stopping power. The cost is the dust and some noise. I wouldn't run ceramic pads on the track, but on the street, they are more than adequate. You will give up that initial hard "bite" of the stock pads, and they do require a bit more pedal pressure. But this is something that I adjusted to within a few drives. On the street, the lack of dust and noise with ceramics is a very worthwhile trade for me. I run ceramics in the 6-piston Brembos on my ISF and it will stop right NOW (caveat: I've not tracked this car). They are also very easy to modulate, with a very linear brake feel. It really just depends on how you use your car and whether you are willing to give up ultimate braking performance and fade-resistance with a lot of dust and some noise for very good street braking with minimal dust and no noise.
For Brembo front 6-piston calipers, use the Power Stop 16-1440 pads. End of story. They make almost zero dust, even less than Akebonos I put on the rear. They are even available on Amazon now:
Wow. Tracking a 460. That is not something that ever came to mind to me. Obviously with the Sports having Brembos and the more responsive IS-F variant of the 8 Speed from the standard 460s, it certainly makes it more plausible to me.
Gents: If you join the Lexus Driver's Club [I think it's called] on the Lexus USA website you can see the entire service history of your LS, the specfic build data for your particular car, and extensive details of the extensive changes Lexus made to the LS when they built the 2010 LS Sport. Oh, yes, and you can download a quite detailed new car brochure specific to your year and model. I was quite impressed with the extensive information available if you are a "tech head" or just curious
02-15-17, 11:17 AM
'10-'12 Sport - questions/advice
