Looking for my 1st Lexus 430...what year models are best?
06-15-18, 01:51 PM
#46
visit the Drunken Clam when in Quoahog
Last edited by JffGRY706; 03-01-21 at 05:23 PM.
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ReggieT (06-15-18)
06-15-18, 05:13 PM
#47
No, not all LS 460s have air suspension. IIRC, it was standard on all AWD models and is found on some rear wheel drive models.
06-15-18, 08:59 PM
#48
And Reggie, there's a good reason you're seeing good deals on 460s, especially the earlier model years since they were fairly more problematic than the later years... and even the later year models were not built to quite the same standard as the 430s were. Material quality also went downhill a little, namely the interior. A vast majority of components/part #s are different on the 460s and just aren't the same grade, and are a little more expensive than 430 parts. They're not as comfortable, smooth, reliable, or refined and solid feeling as the 430s. I test drove a 2012 460 about a year after buying my 430 and walked away from that dealer even more happy/confident/content with my 430 purchase. Over the last 10+ years, I've also read more than a few posts on this forum and on the Lexus Owners Club forum where members had traded their 430 for a 460, and within days went back to the dealership to get their 430 back. Frankly, the 430 is the pinnacle, plain and simple. It's the epitome of what a Lexus LS was always meant to be.
Don't get me wrong, the LS460 is no Jalopy. It's still a really good car, but it's just not quite on the same level as the 430. If you buy a 460 having never driven a 430, you very well may be happy with it. BUT, if say, one of your friends or family members buys a 430 and you get to drive it, there's a decent chance you'll be asking that friend/family member if you can trade cars with them.
Last edited by Mbodall; 06-15-18 at 10:18 PM.
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ReggieT (06-15-18)
06-15-18, 10:11 PM
#49
Driver School Candidate
Thread Starter
I'll second what TriC just said - yes, only the UL models came with the air suspension.
And Reggie, there's a good reason you're seeing good deals on 460s, especially the earlier model years since they were fairly more problematic that the later years... and even the later year models were not built to quite the same standard as the 430s were. Material quality also went downhill a little, namely the interior. A vast majority of components/part #s are different on the 460s and just aren't the same grade, and are a little more expensive than 430 parts. They're not as comfortable, smooth, reliable, or refined and solid feeling as the 430s. I test drove a 2012 460 about a year after buying my 430 and walked away from that dealer even more happy/confident/content with my 430 purchase. Over the last 10+ years, I've also read more than a few posts on this forum and on the Lexus Owners Club forum where members had traded their 430 for a 460, and within days went back to the dealership to get their 430 back. Frankly, the 430 is the pinnacle, plain and simple. It's the epitome of what a Lexus LS was always meant to be.
Don't get me wrong, the LS460 is no Jalopy. It's still a really good car, but it's just not quite on the same level as the 430. If you buy a 460 having never driven a 430, you very well may be happy with it. BUT, if say, one of your friends or family members buys a 430 and you get to drive it, there's a decent chance you'll be asking that friend/family member if you can trade cars with them.
And Reggie, there's a good reason you're seeing good deals on 460s, especially the earlier model years since they were fairly more problematic that the later years... and even the later year models were not built to quite the same standard as the 430s were. Material quality also went downhill a little, namely the interior. A vast majority of components/part #s are different on the 460s and just aren't the same grade, and are a little more expensive than 430 parts. They're not as comfortable, smooth, reliable, or refined and solid feeling as the 430s. I test drove a 2012 460 about a year after buying my 430 and walked away from that dealer even more happy/confident/content with my 430 purchase. Over the last 10+ years, I've also read more than a few posts on this forum and on the Lexus Owners Club forum where members had traded their 430 for a 460, and within days went back to the dealership to get their 430 back. Frankly, the 430 is the pinnacle, plain and simple. It's the epitome of what a Lexus LS was always meant to be.
Don't get me wrong, the LS460 is no Jalopy. It's still a really good car, but it's just not quite on the same level as the 430. If you buy a 460 having never driven a 430, you very well may be happy with it. BUT, if say, one of your friends or family members buys a 430 and you get to drive it, there's a decent chance you'll be asking that friend/family member if you can trade cars with them.
That is almost spellbinding my friend!
Reckon I'm sold for good on the LS430 for sure...if nothing else did it---THAT DID IT!!
In my circles they raise some pretty hefty "Love Offerings" for a man when he lays down truth any higher than that!!!
As my granddad use to say, "Much obliged sir!"
I got sidetracked on the 430's, because I thought I read that the Adaptive Suspension came on all the packages "except" the base.
Glad you brought correction to my errorful thought/recollection process! LOL
Last edited by ReggieT; 06-15-18 at 10:29 PM.
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Mbodall (06-15-18)
06-15-18, 11:44 PM
#51
And just to drive the point home further, check out the recalls on a 2007 & 2008 LS460s:
SummaryToyota Motor Engineering & Manufacturing (Toyota) is recalling certain model year 2007-2010 Lexus LS vehicles manufactured May 9, 2006, to July 20, 2010, 2006-2011 Lexus GS vehicles manufactured January 6, 2005, to September 10, 2010, and 2006-2011 Lexus IS vehicles manufactured August 30, 2005, to September 10, 2010. Due to anti-corrosion plating remnants, fuel may leak from where the fuel pressure sensor is attached to the fuel delivery pipe.
SummaryTOYOTA IS RECALLING 214,570 MY 2006-2008 LEXUS IS, MY 2006-2007 GS AND MY 2007-2008 LS PASSENGER VEHICLES EQUIPPED WITH ALUMINUM FUEL DELIVERY PIPES (FUEL RAILS). ETHANOL FUELS WITH A LOW MOISTURE CONTENT WILL CORRODE THE INTERNAL SURFACE OF THE FUEL RAILS. AS THIS CONDITION PROGRESSES, THE ENGINE MALFUNCTION INDICATOR LIGHT MAY ILLUMINATE.
Some 430s have a few recalls... the 2001, 2002, and 2003 don't have any recalls. The 2004 being the one with the most recalls at 3, the first pertaining to a transmission that Toyota didn't even build (and wouldn't make your car catch on fire while driving or crash while driving like the 460 lol), and was remedied and not a recall in the later 2004 models, nor the 2005 or 2006 models. Another recall that only affected only the 2004 models is for the fuel pump, due to the impeller being improperly molded (worst case the fuel pump fails and you just have to get it replaced). The only other recall that affected the 2004 - 2006 models is for the side and knee air bag inflators possibly not having enough heating agents to deploy with quite enough oomph (another component not made by Toyota). Basically, the only recall that is Toyota's fault and responsibility is the fuel pump, and worse case it just stops working. Meanwhile, all 3 recalls for the 2007 & 2008 LS460 are directly the fault of Toyota and have some pretty serious consequences... seized engine causing a crash, fuel leak causing a fire, and fuel leak causing a fire, respectively. The 2009 LS460 has the same fuel line leak/fire recall, and adds a way more serious recall with dire consequences...
Lexus finally got all that straightened out for the 2010+ model years. In my opinion, those pretty serious recalls are telling, and speak to the sub-par engineering and lack of component vetting in general in the LS460.
Recall Number Recall Date ComponentSummaryTOYOTA IS RECALLING CERTAIN MODEL YEAR 2006 THROUGH 2008 LEXUS PASSENGER CARS MANUFACTURED FROM AUGUST 26, 2005 THROUGH AUGUST 4, 2008. MICRO-FOREIGN OBJECTS IN THE MATERIAL OF THE VALVE SPRING MAY DEGRADE THE STRENGTH OF THE VALVE SPRING, POSSIBLY CAUSING THE SPRING TO BREAK.
10V309000 07/06/2010 ENGINE AND ENGINE COOLING:ENGINE
Consequence
THE ENGINE COULD FAIL AND STOP SUDDENLY WHILE THE VEHICLE IS IN MOTION, INCREASING THE RISK OF A CRASH.Recall Number Recall Date Component14V647000 10/15/2014 FUEL SYSTEM, GASOLINE
ELIVERY:HOSES, LINES/PIPING, AND FITTINGS
ELIVERY:HOSES, LINES/PIPING, AND FITTINGS Consequence
A fuel leak in the presence of an ignition source increases the risk of a fire.Recall Number Recall Date Component09V020000 01/16/2009 ENGINE AND ENGINE COOLING
Consequence
OVER TIME, THE CORROSION MAY CREATE A PINHOLE RESULTING IN FUEL LEAKAGE. FUEL LEAKAGE, IN THE PRESENCE OF AN IGNITION SOURCE, COULD RESULT IN A FIRE.Some 430s have a few recalls... the 2001, 2002, and 2003 don't have any recalls. The 2004 being the one with the most recalls at 3, the first pertaining to a transmission that Toyota didn't even build (and wouldn't make your car catch on fire while driving or crash while driving like the 460 lol), and was remedied and not a recall in the later 2004 models, nor the 2005 or 2006 models. Another recall that only affected only the 2004 models is for the fuel pump, due to the impeller being improperly molded (worst case the fuel pump fails and you just have to get it replaced). The only other recall that affected the 2004 - 2006 models is for the side and knee air bag inflators possibly not having enough heating agents to deploy with quite enough oomph (another component not made by Toyota). Basically, the only recall that is Toyota's fault and responsibility is the fuel pump, and worse case it just stops working. Meanwhile, all 3 recalls for the 2007 & 2008 LS460 are directly the fault of Toyota and have some pretty serious consequences... seized engine causing a crash, fuel leak causing a fire, and fuel leak causing a fire, respectively. The 2009 LS460 has the same fuel line leak/fire recall, and adds a way more serious recall with dire consequences...
IMPROPER ACTIVATION OF THE STEERING SYSTEM PROTECTION LOGIC CAN CAUSE THE STEERING WHEEL TO BECOME OFF-CENTERED UP TO 90 DEGREES. THIS MAY OCCUR AFTER THE DRIVER HAS FULLY TURNED THE STEERING WHEEL IN ONE DIRECTION THEN QUICKLY ATTEMPTS TO TURN IT BACK TO THE CENTER POSITION. SHOULD THIS OCCUR WHILE DRIVING, THE RISK OF A CRASH IS INCREASED.
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ReggieT (06-16-18)
06-16-18, 03:42 AM
#52
And Reggie, there's a good reason you're seeing good deals on 460s, especially the earlier model years since they were fairly more problematic than the later years... and even the later year models were not built to quite the same standard as the 430s were. Material quality also went downhill a little, namely the interior. A vast majority of components/part #s are different on the 460s and just aren't the same grade, and are a little more expensive than 430 parts. They're not as comfortable, smooth, reliable, or refined and solid feeling as the 430s. I test drove a 2012 460 about a year after buying my 430 and walked away from that dealer even more happy/confident/content with my 430 purchase. Over the last 10+ years, I've also read more than a few posts on this forum and on the Lexus Owners Club forum where members had traded their 430 for a 460, and within days went back to the dealership to get their 430 back. Frankly, the 430 is the pinnacle, plain and simple. It's the epitome of what a Lexus LS was always meant to be.
Don't get me wrong, the LS460 is no Jalopy. It's still a really good car, but it's just not quite on the same level as the 430. If you buy a 460 having never driven a 430, you very well may be happy with it. BUT, if say, one of your friends or family members buys a 430 and you get to drive it, there's a decent chance you'll be asking that friend/family member if you can trade cars with them.
Don't get me wrong, the LS460 is no Jalopy. It's still a really good car, but it's just not quite on the same level as the 430. If you buy a 460 having never driven a 430, you very well may be happy with it. BUT, if say, one of your friends or family members buys a 430 and you get to drive it, there's a decent chance you'll be asking that friend/family member if you can trade cars with them.
The LS430 is no sports car but it rides as if it is floating/gliding over the road. In my opinion there is really no such thing as a "Sporty Luxury Car" or "Luxurious Sports Car". If a luxury car tries to cross over to a sports car or a sports car tries to cross over to a luxury car it is nothing more than a compromise and many things have got to be sacrificed. The LS430 is purely a luxury car and it is a pinnacle in that respect by every measure. I've had my fill of Hi-Po Go-Fast cars in my life so the LS430 suits me perfectly.
My "new" 2002 LS430 seems just as well built as my old 1995 LS400. In fact the suspension components appear to be way stronger though much of it is now aluminum, thus reducing unsprung weight. More cabin space... More trunk space... More power... Better tranny... Better ride... Miss the leather door handle finish but that's about it...
Wonderful vehicle...
Last edited by VortecCPI; 06-16-18 at 03:57 AM.
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ReggieT (06-16-18)
06-16-18, 06:54 AM
#53
Lexus Fanatic
Think the long story short is as long as I've been on this forum, any of the cars that faced a premature ending were due to accident...and I think there was one that had a bad timing belt job done on it. Other than that, you don't hear about LS430's "dying"....and yes I did see one post where someone went to a 460 and said he should have kept his 7 series it was pretty expensive to repair..it probably was a 2007....this car is a very reasonable bet that you can buy, and drive uninterrupted, with minimal repairs...my .02
06-16-18, 11:23 AM
#54
My Master Certified Lexus guy (Lextec) says LS460 is good to about 60-80K miles and then reaches into your pockets for money. In his opinion late LS400 the most reliable/dependable LS ever built and LS430 best compromise between quiet comfort and reliability/dependability. He says Lexus has become more like BMW, Merc, etc. in that the days of 250K+ miles without failure are long gone.
I really wanted a BMW E39 M5 but from my research I see that they have all sorts of issues long before 100K miles. My 1995 LS400 with 269,000 miles still drove quiet and tight and my 2002 LS430 with 126,000 miles drives like new.
If you only keep a car for a few years I guess it matters very little. Research of TSBs should shed some light on the subject...
I really wanted a BMW E39 M5 but from my research I see that they have all sorts of issues long before 100K miles. My 1995 LS400 with 269,000 miles still drove quiet and tight and my 2002 LS430 with 126,000 miles drives like new.
If you only keep a car for a few years I guess it matters very little. Research of TSBs should shed some light on the subject...
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ReggieT (06-16-18)
06-16-18, 02:25 PM
#55
Lexus Fanatic
My Master Certified Lexus guy (Lextec) says LS460 is good to about 60-80K miles and then reaches into your pockets for money. In his opinion late LS400 the most reliable/dependable LS ever built and LS430 best compromise between quiet comfort and reliability/dependability. He says Lexus has become more like BMW, Merc, etc. in that the days of 250K+ miles without failure are long gone.
I really wanted a BMW E39 M5 but from my research I see that they have all sorts of issues long before 100K miles. My 1995 LS400 with 269,000 miles still drove quiet and tight and my 2002 LS430 with 126,000 miles drives like new.
If you only keep a car for a few years I guess it matters very little. Research of TSBs should shed some light on the subject...
I really wanted a BMW E39 M5 but from my research I see that they have all sorts of issues long before 100K miles. My 1995 LS400 with 269,000 miles still drove quiet and tight and my 2002 LS430 with 126,000 miles drives like new.
If you only keep a car for a few years I guess it matters very little. Research of TSBs should shed some light on the subject...
My cousin bought a 2003 M5 stick. I remember when the car was new it was about $80k then. 400 HP was not a joke. Anyway he has had it about 8 years now, and he only started an oil leak last fall...not the OFHG nor valve covers, there's some other device on it that eventually leaks. His policy is to never spend $30,000.00 on a car, so he got this one for $28'ish when it was I think 6.5 y.o. He's the type that will extract value out of items then sell them for a fair price. He wanted $3k for a 1995 M3 in 2010. I wanted to buy it but he refused to sell it to me (haha wouldn't want to rip off his cousin, rather a stranger--it looked mint, needed major engine work at 250k)...
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ReggieT (06-16-18)
06-16-18, 08:40 PM
#58
As for leather, they're both great, and I don't think there is a difference in quality between perforated vs non. Perforated leather is only in the models that have the cooled seats I believe.
Last edited by Mbodall; 06-17-18 at 09:59 PM.
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ReggieT (06-17-18)
06-17-18, 04:13 AM
#59
This makes a lot of sense. then it would seem a 3rd gen is a compromise of at least from today, being able to last the longest (given same odometer)...
My cousin bought a 2003 M5 stick. I remember when the car was new it was about $80k then. 400 HP was not a joke. Anyway he has had it about 8 years now, and he only started an oil leak last fall...not the OFHG nor valve covers, there's some other device on it that eventually leaks. His policy is to never spend $30,000.00 on a car, so he got this one for $28'ish when it was I think 6.5 y.o. He's the type that will extract value out of items then sell them for a fair price. He wanted $3k for a 1995 M3 in 2010. I wanted to buy it but he refused to sell it to me (haha wouldn't want to rip off his cousin, rather a stranger--it looked mint, needed major engine work at 250k)...
My cousin bought a 2003 M5 stick. I remember when the car was new it was about $80k then. 400 HP was not a joke. Anyway he has had it about 8 years now, and he only started an oil leak last fall...not the OFHG nor valve covers, there's some other device on it that eventually leaks. His policy is to never spend $30,000.00 on a car, so he got this one for $28'ish when it was I think 6.5 y.o. He's the type that will extract value out of items then sell them for a fair price. He wanted $3k for a 1995 M3 in 2010. I wanted to buy it but he refused to sell it to me (haha wouldn't want to rip off his cousin, rather a stranger--it looked mint, needed major engine work at 250k)...
06-17-18, 05:02 AM
#60
Lexus Fanatic
I decided to look online yesterday and it seems the number of 60-80k miles cars has dwindled. I saw one that had 61k, but it was in a rust belt state and wanted 14k.....that is a lot of money today....
p.s. does this pic have a VSC OFF button maybe because it's an older model?
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/ls-...ml#post5084944
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ReggieT (06-17-18)