TF109B

You reiterate the same statement over and over. I get it, the tires on the other cars are better. That's great and all, but using tires to make your car lap faster is only one technique. No street tire is a slick race tire. No matter the tread rate. The bridgestones the LFA uses may not be as grippy, but if the car was developed with those tires it should make the best use of them. I get the information from Lexus Europe, go to their twitter page and you can read all of their PR and links. You can't judge how fast a car will go or say "this is the best we can hope for" because of tires.

05RollaXRS

Well, then wait and see. I know very well that the best Nurburgring edition can do is 7:18 and nothing quicker than that. "Under 7:20" is what Lexus said and that is what I see as plausible.

TF109B

You don't know, you think. Its a guess like mine. We'll have to wait and see. If you look at previous tests the regular LFA already has higher cornering speeds than all of its competitors, with even 'lesser tires' than the Nurb edition. Combine that with better tires on the Nurb edition and obviously higher top speeds on the straight than the sport auto test, I believe its faster than the competitors we see in the sub 7:20 range.

TRDFantasy

In any case, if the 'Ring Edition gets under 7:20 on the "regular street" Bridgestone Potenza tires that will be a VERY VERY impressive feat. With the same tires, the GT-R wouldn't come anywhere close, nor would a ZR-1, nor would even a GT2 RS.

Put semi-slick tires on the LFA 'Ring edition, and I think it could possibly hit the 7:08-7:12 range on the 'Ring.

TF109B

The LFA had higher cornering speeds in the sport auto test than even the 458 with it's special Pirelli tires. Higher than the GTR, the 911, every car. The thing that held it back was it's 'low top speed'. That was key. The Nurb edition seems to have none of that issue, so why not be faster than everything else? That's my take.

05RollaXRS

I think you should really stop speculating already.

The answer is power, which is the other part of the equation. Even working with the speculation that LFA can corner quicker and gains ground in the corners, the GT2 RS still makes more power with more top end acceleration and on a very high speed race track like Nurburgring where top end acceleration also matters other than cornering speeds where GT2 RS. Then factor in the super-slicks on the GT2 RS that afford it the stickiness that no other type of tires can.

p.s. 458 Italia tires were Michelins.

TF109B

Speculating is all any of us have, so you gotta be doing the same thing. The Italia has optional Pirelli's not just michellin's. Ferrarichat can give you that info. As far as speculating, there's no proof the gt2rs even did 7:18 besides their word, unless you have the video.

BlDynamite

This is incredibly simple deduction.

The GT2 RS and the Vettes have posted times with the Sport Cup tires, and times without the Sport Cups. They gained 6-7 seconds with the Sports Cups.

Do the math. 7:15 is this car's max potential.
BD

07grIS350

There is still hope that it was only a test lap. Real lap time minus 6-7 seconds,

05RollaXRS

That is plausible.

However, LFA will do its official Nurburgring lap on the stock RE70 tires. Not the cup tires. That will put it somewhere "under 7:20".

BlDynamite

I think the LFA can beat the ZR1's time, on it's street tires, but not by much.
With slicks on, it'd break 7:15 no problem
BD

05RollaXRS

Don't know when they will do it. However, I hope they do it soon for the 'ring edition.

Already, the standard LFA image/sales has suffered due to Lexus' marketing blunders of not putting an official lap time out, allowing only a handful of the testers to use launch control system to get off the line quick with a proper launch and also fitting the standard LFA with the craptastic Potenza S001 tires that do not grip under heavy load at all unless it is a compound prep'ed grippy surface like a drag strip.

Though, Lexus says it was not a priority in development, one simply cannot ignore the significance in the success of a performance car otherwise, there would be no objective measure for performance at all and there would be no racing at all since performance is about competition.

Funny how LFA, which is by and large the most performance oriented car Lexus/Toyota have ever produced is the only car in the Lexus line up ever that testers have had difficulty matching or exceeeding the official 0 - 60 mph times. It makes LFA unfairly look less than competitive with similar performance cars that cost less. Never heard that in any other Lexus.

The Potenza RE70 semi-slick tires on the Nurburgring edition (also, were OEM tires for the pre-2010 Nissan GTR) should have been the standard LFA tires to allow it to properly put down that massive power to the rear wheels.

TF109B

^REALLY? Because the cars that aren't sold are available because the lack of some mystical lap time on a track that only super elite or manufacturers have the time and money to rent? I get they should brag about their performance more, but lack of sales? Because of a lack of lap times on some track in 1 country? I don't think so. Not the 0-60 thing either. Not when they're skipping launch control while others use it.

05RollaXRS

My intention is not to provoke an argument. Just my own personal frustrations with a few fundamental and basic things.

If you look at the lexus LFA webpage, Lexus claims the 3.6 seconds 0 - 60 mph was achieved without launch control system and also with two people on board.

In real life, there is not one instance where 3.6 seconds 0 - 60 mph was achieved without 1-foot roll out, let alone exceeding it, which generally other cars do. (For example, 458 Italia has been running 3.3 seconds 0 - 60 mph without 1-foot roll outs).

If you look at the IS-F, despite the advetised 0 - 60 mph in 4.8 seconds, it has consistently surpassed it in tests with and without 1-foot roll outs (vary from 4.1 - 4.3 seconds with 1-foot roll outs).

A show piece "boutique" launch control system means nothing, if it could not be used.

Ofcourse, this could all be denied or downplayed. However, after 3 years of criticisms, if you have been following the impressions, the importance of these figures cannot be ignored. It was rendered anew when I saw that pathetic MotorTrend review with those poor statistics. I firmly believe these flimsy LFA marketing strategy have cost a lot of sales to Lexus for the LFA.

TF109B

MT also complained the car was noisy, owners seem to 'show off' that noise. Perception from some snobbish magazine complaining about one of the best things about the car isn't the masses. The facts are the thing is basically sold out, so it's a success in that area. It's gained Lexus a LOT of attention, so it's a success in that area as well. They're going to race it, obviously, so there's more attention. If it does well, there's even more attention. You get it? It's not a veyron, or a Koenigsegg, it's not made to be the fastest or quickest, but around a track it's as good as anything. We'll see more soon, I bet on it.