Am I being unrealistic with my expectations when buying a used ISF?
10-23-15, 05:52 PM
#46
Lexus Fanatic
The ISF is kind of like an EVO in that its difficult to find a totally stock example. An intake is really nothing, and how do you know one of the stock cars didnt have all kind of stuff removed from it before it was traded. Many people part out their cars before sale.
10-23-15, 10:16 PM
#47
Driver
Thread Starter
I know the ISF is very robust and an intake does little harm. The issue I have with buying modded cars is that most of the "car guys" that buy performance cars don't really know much about cars and how to take care of them. I have no issue with beating on the car ONCE the oil and other fluids are warm. Thing is, most of the guys don't understand that. When I see aftermarket parts on a car I'm interested in, it's makes me wonder how many times the car was rode hard on cold fluids and put away wet. Buying an ISF with an aftermarket intake also means I've got to spend another $750-900 sourcing a new air box because none of the dealers think the intake is an issue.
I hate aftermarket intakes. Been there, done that. Tested back to back on the strip and the dyno on a few of my own personnel cars. Hot air filters on sticks don't do squat on most any late model stock or mostly stock car. Pretty much all they do is ingest lots of hot air at a stop and low speeds. In many cases, you'll be slower and throttle response in the lower rpms neutered. You'll feel faster because the additional volume screws with the butt dyno. Lexus went to great lengths tuning and making the OEM airbox perform and sound great. It's what I want.
The Carfax for ISF in Dallas posted. 3 owners and one wreck, all within 24K miles. LOL. The wife has given me the all clear to look at a 2013 gray/red ISF up in Chicago. It's got 10K miles, L-certified, one owner, and looks flawless. They're asking $55K and they've been slowly lowering the price over the past 5 weeks. I may offer $51K, not a penny more, and see what happens.
I hate aftermarket intakes. Been there, done that. Tested back to back on the strip and the dyno on a few of my own personnel cars. Hot air filters on sticks don't do squat on most any late model stock or mostly stock car. Pretty much all they do is ingest lots of hot air at a stop and low speeds. In many cases, you'll be slower and throttle response in the lower rpms neutered. You'll feel faster because the additional volume screws with the butt dyno. Lexus went to great lengths tuning and making the OEM airbox perform and sound great. It's what I want.
The Carfax for ISF in Dallas posted. 3 owners and one wreck, all within 24K miles. LOL. The wife has given me the all clear to look at a 2013 gray/red ISF up in Chicago. It's got 10K miles, L-certified, one owner, and looks flawless. They're asking $55K and they've been slowly lowering the price over the past 5 weeks. I may offer $51K, not a penny more, and see what happens.
10-24-15, 05:45 AM
#48
Originally Posted by XutvJet
I know the ISF is very robust and an intake does little harm. The issue I have with buying modded cars is that most of the "car guys" that buy performance cars don't really know much about cars and how to take care of them. I have no issue with beating on the car ONCE the oil and other fluids are warm. Thing is, most of the guys don't understand that. When I see aftermarket parts on a car I'm interested in, it's makes me wonder how many times the car was rode hard on cold fluids and put away wet. Buying an ISF with an aftermarket intake also means I've got to spend another $750-900 sourcing a new air box because none of the dealers think the intake is an issue.
I hate aftermarket intakes. Been there, done that. Tested back to back on the strip and the dyno on a few of my own personnel cars. Hot air filters on sticks don't do squat on most any late model stock or mostly stock car. Pretty much all they do is ingest lots of hot air at a stop and low speeds. In many cases, you'll be slower and throttle response in the lower rpms neutered. You'll feel faster because the additional volume screws with the butt dyno. Lexus went to great lengths tuning and making the OEM airbox perform and sound great. It's what I want.
The Carfax for ISF in Dallas posted. 3 owners and one wreck, all within 24K miles. LOL. The wife has given me the all clear to look at a 2013 gray/red ISF up in Chicago. It's got 10K miles, L-certified, one owner, and looks flawless. They're asking $55K and they've been slowly lowering the price over the past 5 weeks. I may offer $51K, not a penny more, and see what happens.
I hate aftermarket intakes. Been there, done that. Tested back to back on the strip and the dyno on a few of my own personnel cars. Hot air filters on sticks don't do squat on most any late model stock or mostly stock car. Pretty much all they do is ingest lots of hot air at a stop and low speeds. In many cases, you'll be slower and throttle response in the lower rpms neutered. You'll feel faster because the additional volume screws with the butt dyno. Lexus went to great lengths tuning and making the OEM airbox perform and sound great. It's what I want.
The Carfax for ISF in Dallas posted. 3 owners and one wreck, all within 24K miles. LOL. The wife has given me the all clear to look at a 2013 gray/red ISF up in Chicago. It's got 10K miles, L-certified, one owner, and looks flawless. They're asking $55K and they've been slowly lowering the price over the past 5 weeks. I may offer $51K, not a penny more, and see what happens.
Good luck, keep hunting, your diamond is out there.
10-24-15, 10:19 AM
#49
Likewise with others have stated. I personally wouldn't want a car that was beat up on, raced hard, or anything of the such. Yes, the car is performance-oriented, but that's why for this example, you need to really dig into the details and have more patience. What looks like a great deal is only part of the equation- it's how you connect with the car after knowing how those miles were accumulated. Sometimes ignorance is bliss, and not knowing can be better. I helped a few friends get into an IS F, an M3, an C63. All are known to be driven hard, but give the potential owners enough time, and gems do appear. But it is definitely a waiting game and checking out what is available in the market.
Keep on the lookout, and you'll find your F soon enough.
Keep on the lookout, and you'll find your F soon enough.
10-24-15, 11:18 AM
#50
Driver
Thread Starter
Well I'm starting the process with the dealer up in Chicago. The car sounds cherry. Now we just need to settle on a price. It's the most expensive ISF for sale in the country at the moment, They're asking $55K. I feel that's a bit steep and the car has been there since 9/9.
10-24-15, 02:04 PM
#51
Well I'm starting the process with the dealer up in Chicago. The car sounds cherry. Now we just need to settle on a price. It's the most expensive ISF for sale in the country at the moment, They're asking $55K. I feel that's a bit steep and the car has been there since 9/9.
10-24-15, 05:55 PM
#52
Tech Info Resource
iTrader: (2)
This thread is why I am completely willing to buy new and take the depreciation hit. I know everything that has happened to my car.
10-24-15, 06:07 PM
#54
Tech Info Resource
iTrader: (2)
All too true. That's why I bought one in 2008. Having owned Supras, I already knew I wanted one.
Buying any used car is a crap shoot. Anyone else remember the poor soul who bought the orange one? The diff blew up on it. There's only one way that happens - severe, and I mean really severe abuse. There's no way to tell how the car has lived its life, and clean paint and empty Carfax mean nothing.
Good luck with your search. I hope you find what you want.
Buying any used car is a crap shoot. Anyone else remember the poor soul who bought the orange one? The diff blew up on it. There's only one way that happens - severe, and I mean really severe abuse. There's no way to tell how the car has lived its life, and clean paint and empty Carfax mean nothing.
Good luck with your search. I hope you find what you want.
10-24-15, 06:18 PM
#55
Pole Position
All too true. That's why I bought one in 2008. Having owned Supras, I already knew I wanted one.
Buying any used car is a crap shoot. Anyone else remember the poor soul who bought the orange one? The diff blew up on it. There's only one way that happens - severe, and I mean really severe abuse. There's no way to tell how the car has lived its life, and clean paint and empty Carfax mean nothing.
Good luck with your search. I hope you find what you want.
Buying any used car is a crap shoot. Anyone else remember the poor soul who bought the orange one? The diff blew up on it. There's only one way that happens - severe, and I mean really severe abuse. There's no way to tell how the car has lived its life, and clean paint and empty Carfax mean nothing.
Good luck with your search. I hope you find what you want.
Find a good ISF that you feel comfortable with and roll with it.. As long as you are happy and its what you want, then its a good deal..
Man 55K ... That's some serious cheese... Good luck..
10-25-15, 12:03 AM
#56
I feel this thread has gone way left field. Lobuxracer hit a good point.. Anything you buy that you didn't physically own before, you have no idea how it was driven, maintained, or what mods were put on and later removed, before the sale. I honestly would not even trip over it.
Find a good ISF that you feel comfortable with and roll with it.. As long as you are happy and its what you want, then its a good deal..
Man 55K ... That's some serious cheese... Good luck..
Find a good ISF that you feel comfortable with and roll with it.. As long as you are happy and its what you want, then its a good deal..
Man 55K ... That's some serious cheese... Good luck..
10-25-15, 10:28 AM
#57
Driver
Thread Starter
I offered $50K last night and they said we were way too far a part. I have a friend at a dealer that pulled the Manheim auction info on the ISF up in Chicago. They paid $45,500 at Manheim Ohio on 8/31/15, before auction fees, transport, CPO. Figure $3k for all the additional charges they have added to that purchase price. A $2k profit would still meet what they should be wanting at about this point. I think offering $51K and not a penny more would be more than fair enough.
10-25-15, 11:06 AM
#58
Too much
I'm looking at buying a used 2012-2014 ISF (white, silver, blue or gray only). I'm willing to spend up to $50K if it's an extremely low mileage 2014. I'm in Kansas City and there aren't any ISFs within 200 miles of here. There's an L-certified 2012 in Tulsa for $41K, but it has two reported minor wrecks and the dealership won't respond to inquires about the wreck details. There's another L-certified 2013 in Oklahoma City for $49K, but it has a KN intake and they don't have the stock intake. I told them I'm interested if they reinstall the intake, which with parts, would amount to at least $800. They're not interested in doing that. There's a silver 2012 at CarMax in Chicago for $44K that I could have transferred for $300, but I had them send me pictures and the front bumper cover has a nice vertical 4" gash that they touched up with paint. It's clear the car hit something, not a rock. If it were a $30K car, I wouldn't think twice about buying, but for $44K, I don't want that. I inquired to them about dropping the price $1,000 so that I could respray the cover, but they're not interested.
Back story: My used car buying experience hasn't been pleasant. A 1996 Maxima I bought years ago looked to be mint, but after a month of owning it, it was clear to me that the two passenger doors had filler and had been resprayed. No reported wrecks on that car. Same goes for the 2003 G35 I bought after that. The rear bumper cover, rear quarter, and rear passenger door had all been reshot. No reported wrecks. I got the dealer to repaint those portions of the car for free, but it still pissed me off. Last year, my buddy and I went to Tulsa to buy a "mint" 2012 G37 for him at an Infiniti dealer. The dealer reported the car as perfect, no flaws. Pictures showed a very clean car. When we got there, the paint was terrible. Scratches, pits, dents, etc. I couldn't believe a 2012 could get so beat up. We got the deposit back and drove the 5 hours back home without the car. He ended up buying another G37 (Infiniti certified) in Iowa. He got it home and noticed a huge, but perfectly round and shallow dent in the lower portion of a front passenger door and you could only see it in certain lighting conditions due to the angle and position of the dent. At certain angles, it looked like factory body work, but on closer look and feel, it was a dent (likely from a basketball). The dealer wouldn't do a thing about it. He spent $2,000 fixing it because it couldn't be pulled.
So yeah, I'm picky and also a bit shell shocked. I'm a stickler for taking care of my cars and really look over cars before buying them, but a lot of respray work is not obvious until you get a car is certain lighting conditions. I now know what to look for now including using magnets to detect filler, but man, it seems like every ISF that's remotely local has issues. Given prior experience, I'm reluctant to travel to Texas or Chicago where are a lot of clean appearing ISFs for sale. So frustrating....
Back story: My used car buying experience hasn't been pleasant. A 1996 Maxima I bought years ago looked to be mint, but after a month of owning it, it was clear to me that the two passenger doors had filler and had been resprayed. No reported wrecks on that car. Same goes for the 2003 G35 I bought after that. The rear bumper cover, rear quarter, and rear passenger door had all been reshot. No reported wrecks. I got the dealer to repaint those portions of the car for free, but it still pissed me off. Last year, my buddy and I went to Tulsa to buy a "mint" 2012 G37 for him at an Infiniti dealer. The dealer reported the car as perfect, no flaws. Pictures showed a very clean car. When we got there, the paint was terrible. Scratches, pits, dents, etc. I couldn't believe a 2012 could get so beat up. We got the deposit back and drove the 5 hours back home without the car. He ended up buying another G37 (Infiniti certified) in Iowa. He got it home and noticed a huge, but perfectly round and shallow dent in the lower portion of a front passenger door and you could only see it in certain lighting conditions due to the angle and position of the dent. At certain angles, it looked like factory body work, but on closer look and feel, it was a dent (likely from a basketball). The dealer wouldn't do a thing about it. He spent $2,000 fixing it because it couldn't be pulled.
So yeah, I'm picky and also a bit shell shocked. I'm a stickler for taking care of my cars and really look over cars before buying them, but a lot of respray work is not obvious until you get a car is certain lighting conditions. I now know what to look for now including using magnets to detect filler, but man, it seems like every ISF that's remotely local has issues. Given prior experience, I'm reluctant to travel to Texas or Chicago where are a lot of clean appearing ISFs for sale. So frustrating....
10-25-15, 02:25 PM
#59
Pole Position
He liked that iw as as **** about my cars as he was.. easy transaction..
10-25-15, 06:46 PM
#60
From experience, either buy a 2014 or look for a clean 2012/2013 that's not modded with low miles.
Get ready for hardball play on the price and also for some travel since your dream car may be in another state.
There are some good finds out there, don't settle.
Most of the 2012's are in the low to mid 40's, unless the mileage is low, then the price will be roughly 50K.
The 2013's are in the mid 50's, there is one in Chicago, basically same as my car (Nebula Gray with black interior, but it's going for 55K)
You may find an Ultrasonic Blue (if that's your thing; rare color and looks beautiful in the sun) but it may have the red interior.
There is a white 2012 with black interior out here in RTP (North Carolina) with roughly 40,000 miles for 39K.
Get ready for hardball play on the price and also for some travel since your dream car may be in another state.
There are some good finds out there, don't settle.
Most of the 2012's are in the low to mid 40's, unless the mileage is low, then the price will be roughly 50K.
The 2013's are in the mid 50's, there is one in Chicago, basically same as my car (Nebula Gray with black interior, but it's going for 55K)
You may find an Ultrasonic Blue (if that's your thing; rare color and looks beautiful in the sun) but it may have the red interior.
There is a white 2012 with black interior out here in RTP (North Carolina) with roughly 40,000 miles for 39K.
Last edited by 2URGSE; 10-25-15 at 06:52 PM.