2013 ISF Vs 2012 E92 Video
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 1,512
Likes: 77
From: On a sand dune
Thanks for the feedback, I understand what you mean.
I do agree with you my car wheel spins like crazy when i'm driving around the city very easily, esp if I hammer it suddenly from low speed.
BUT the road where we race I am always shocked at how the car just refuses to spin, from a stand still or even from a roll. Because in city driving it always spins.
I don't know but maybe the tarmac in this area is rough and in turn gives good traction.
Personally I believe my car needs more miles on the clock for the ISF to fully shine.
The difference between when I raced him when I first got the car and now is big and I believe it'll only get better from here.
His car has been driven very very hard over 38,000km so his V8 seems to be pulling strong possibly due to the way it's been driven.
From a standstill I cruise ahead easily and he slowly catches up but that's why we didn't race from a standstill.
We tried 1 race from standstill and it just wasn't worth it because I'd get ahead and he would have a hard time catching up.
Now we need to do a few more runs from standstill and see how things go.
I do agree with you my car wheel spins like crazy when i'm driving around the city very easily, esp if I hammer it suddenly from low speed.
BUT the road where we race I am always shocked at how the car just refuses to spin, from a stand still or even from a roll. Because in city driving it always spins.
I don't know but maybe the tarmac in this area is rough and in turn gives good traction.
Personally I believe my car needs more miles on the clock for the ISF to fully shine.
The difference between when I raced him when I first got the car and now is big and I believe it'll only get better from here.
His car has been driven very very hard over 38,000km so his V8 seems to be pulling strong possibly due to the way it's been driven.
From a standstill I cruise ahead easily and he slowly catches up but that's why we didn't race from a standstill.
We tried 1 race from standstill and it just wasn't worth it because I'd get ahead and he would have a hard time catching up.
Now we need to do a few more runs from standstill and see how things go.
Pole Position
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 2,084
Likes: 4
From: PA
Pole Position
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 2,084
Likes: 4
From: PA
Thanks, I'll check it out and see if it makes a difference.
Why would I be offended? I agree with your statement at the end of the day every M3 and ISF is difference which is why I'm using the same M3 as a comparison while owning the ISF.
Coming back to the video though I believe mine is a fairer comparison if you look at the facts.
Firstly the M3 in your video had a passenger and the ISF seems to have only the driver (so weight is not apple to apple comparison than just reach 100mph)
Secondly and more importantly the M3 in your video has a manual transmission, the driver seems to be shifting well for a manual but the M3 I am going against has a M-DCT Transmission which let me tell you is pretty much faster than the ISF transmission if not the same.
The F and M3 are virtually equal in performance. My point is the best driver will win the race. There are two exceptions: F will win on the push to 60 and will say adios when the stock bimmer shuts down at 155 mph.
Thirdly what speeds did these guys even reach? because its no where near the 140mph~150mph we reached. (Which gives even more room for a fair comparison)
So the M3 you posted has those two disadvantages and yet still manages to pull against the ISF even with the ISF jumping.
Also the M3 I'm racing is not stock and has a cat-back exhaust which gives it more power.
Now when I compare my video I'm actually quiet happy with the outcome, if you compare both videos my ISF is doing a much better job against the M3 than the one you posted.
So I don't really understand what your point is.
Why would I be offended? I agree with your statement at the end of the day every M3 and ISF is difference which is why I'm using the same M3 as a comparison while owning the ISF.
Coming back to the video though I believe mine is a fairer comparison if you look at the facts.
Firstly the M3 in your video had a passenger and the ISF seems to have only the driver (so weight is not apple to apple comparison than just reach 100mph)
Secondly and more importantly the M3 in your video has a manual transmission, the driver seems to be shifting well for a manual but the M3 I am going against has a M-DCT Transmission which let me tell you is pretty much faster than the ISF transmission if not the same.
The F and M3 are virtually equal in performance. My point is the best driver will win the race. There are two exceptions: F will win on the push to 60 and will say adios when the stock bimmer shuts down at 155 mph.
Thirdly what speeds did these guys even reach? because its no where near the 140mph~150mph we reached. (Which gives even more room for a fair comparison)
So the M3 you posted has those two disadvantages and yet still manages to pull against the ISF even with the ISF jumping.
Also the M3 I'm racing is not stock and has a cat-back exhaust which gives it more power.
Now when I compare my video I'm actually quiet happy with the outcome, if you compare both videos my ISF is doing a much better job against the M3 than the one you posted.
So I don't really understand what your point is.
11 Second Club
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 963
Likes: 4
From: IL
The DCT M3 has an advantage starting third gear and up. They have a closer ratio 7 speed than our 8 speed. Our first 2 gears give more torque to the wheels than the M3 (hence why we win 0-60 most of the time unless launch control is used by the M3). After third gear, a DCT M3 should theoretically start to pull - very slowly. Of course, I think our exhaust is more restrictive and it seems that the F gets much more HP out of headers/exhaust than an M3. It's true that the car does get faster with age - up to a point. Maybe 10K miles? My drag #s were quite slow the first year out. Traps were like 108/109 mph only. By the second year I was getting 112 and by the third year I got up to 115 (on a good day) with minimal/no mods.
Racer
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 1,664
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From: NY
Some of my past experience with M3's my mods at time of these races were Joe-Z Intake and Exhaust with secondary cats removed.
I have two friends with M3's and have raced both of them I've also come across various M3 on road but let talk about my friends M's.
The first Danny's 2010 E92 6 speed with Intake, Akrapovic cat back exhaust. Raced four times. the first two twice from dig I beat him each time from 0mph to 100mph I would alway pull out in front of him but he would start to catch up as we approached 100mph. Third and fourth races from roll on Highway with similar outcome. I would pull on him by 120 he would start to catch up but could not over over take me. Our sportdirect auto is faster than manual trans in M3 and it showed.
Second race with franks 2011 E90 M3 with DCT trans, Intake, Meisterschft GT2 exhaust with cat's removed. First race from dig just barely beat him to 100mph on second race from roll on highway starting at 35mph I lost traction going into third gear and that was wrap he got me. On third race I edged him out . Frank is great driver and at the time our cars were pretty well matched. Between us it came down to reaction times, proper shifting and traction so two well matched cars.
I get what they're saying about different driving styles some driver are more aggressive than others and when driving ISF if you don't fully commit shift right after beep and have gas pedal pinned to floor you may lose to M3 or other similarly powered car,
I have two friends with M3's and have raced both of them I've also come across various M3 on road but let talk about my friends M's.
The first Danny's 2010 E92 6 speed with Intake, Akrapovic cat back exhaust. Raced four times. the first two twice from dig I beat him each time from 0mph to 100mph I would alway pull out in front of him but he would start to catch up as we approached 100mph. Third and fourth races from roll on Highway with similar outcome. I would pull on him by 120 he would start to catch up but could not over over take me. Our sportdirect auto is faster than manual trans in M3 and it showed.
Second race with franks 2011 E90 M3 with DCT trans, Intake, Meisterschft GT2 exhaust with cat's removed. First race from dig just barely beat him to 100mph on second race from roll on highway starting at 35mph I lost traction going into third gear and that was wrap he got me. On third race I edged him out . Frank is great driver and at the time our cars were pretty well matched. Between us it came down to reaction times, proper shifting and traction so two well matched cars.
I get what they're saying about different driving styles some driver are more aggressive than others and when driving ISF if you don't fully commit shift right after beep and have gas pedal pinned to floor you may lose to M3 or other similarly powered car,
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 1,512
Likes: 77
From: On a sand dune
Agree with with most of you guys are saying.
When I race him from a dig I always pull ahead and he would start pulling on me around 120 and since we can go up to 150 it seems to be the sweet spot for the M3 for now.
I honestly believe with a just a bit of time a little more driving and more miles on the ISF it'll make a significant change.
Now I'm itching to install the PPE headers but with newborn kids around I'm having a hard time lol.
Thanks for the comments guys, I'm glad we didn't get into a pissing contest
When I race him from a dig I always pull ahead and he would start pulling on me around 120 and since we can go up to 150 it seems to be the sweet spot for the M3 for now.
I honestly believe with a just a bit of time a little more driving and more miles on the ISF it'll make a significant change.
Now I'm itching to install the PPE headers but with newborn kids around I'm having a hard time lol.
Thanks for the comments guys, I'm glad we didn't get into a pissing contest
Pole Position
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 2,084
Likes: 4
From: PA
On my phone so I may be a little direct.
Stock to stock I have never come close to losing to an m3. I honestly don't know any local isf that has ever had any problems with m3s either. I honestly give the m3 the credit that it deserves based on my experience racing them. I'm also a bit confused how you don't spin from a 30km. My car has been going sideways from 20mph the day it left the showroom floor. We have 115F summers where I live and the heat does nothing from a standstill.
Your race with the m3 was a good run, but based on my experiences, you should pull without a problem. Apologies if I came off negative.
Stock to stock I have never come close to losing to an m3. I honestly don't know any local isf that has ever had any problems with m3s either. I honestly give the m3 the credit that it deserves based on my experience racing them. I'm also a bit confused how you don't spin from a 30km. My car has been going sideways from 20mph the day it left the showroom floor. We have 115F summers where I live and the heat does nothing from a standstill.
Your race with the m3 was a good run, but based on my experiences, you should pull without a problem. Apologies if I came off negative.
This is an interesting comparison of two different M3s running our F.
I pwned a e92 with my bone stock 08 by multiple car lengths. I guess he didn't know how to shift properly. Also beat an M6, only mod I had is 2nd cat delete + straight pipes. I used my throttle controller both times, may have helped me get the jump going from a roll.
Defratos I agree, as the engine gets broken in the car should be faster. ALso did you use Manual mode + Sport mode and shift after the beep?
Defratos I agree, as the engine gets broken in the car should be faster. ALso did you use Manual mode + Sport mode and shift after the beep?
11 Second Club
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 963
Likes: 4
From: IL
With headers installed, you'll easily walk him starting at low speeds. Between my F and and a Borla only F, I'm about 2-3 car lengths ahead at the 1/4 miles and I'm pulling away. The difference will only get bigger and bigger as the speed goes up. Headers and Exhaust really is a legit 50 HP!
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 1,512
Likes: 77
From: On a sand dune
I pwned a e92 with my bone stock 08 by multiple car lengths. I guess he didn't know how to shift properly. Also beat an M6, only mod I had is 2nd cat delete + straight pipes. I used my throttle controller both times, may have helped me get the jump going from a roll.
Defratos I agree, as the engine gets broken in the car should be faster. ALso did you use Manual mode + Sport mode and shift after the beep?
Defratos I agree, as the engine gets broken in the car should be faster. ALso did you use Manual mode + Sport mode and shift after the beep?
Yes I was using manual mode + Sport mode but was not shifting after the beep in all gears.
I usually drive fast and have taken my ISFs up to about 160mph, the hood has been so stable that I have never paid attention to it.
Racing an M3 is always fun... heck, racing any BMW is always fun! I've had probably around 10 clean races with M3s and have never lost to them, either being stock, intake/cat/muffler delete, or I/E/H.
Racing an M3 is always fun... heck, racing any BMW is always fun! I've had probably around 10 clean races with M3s and have never lost to them, either being stock, intake/cat/muffler delete, or I/E/H.
Thread Starter
Racer
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 1,512
Likes: 77
From: On a sand dune
You know the hood isn't noticeable at all unless you pay really close attention to it.
If you're looking ahead (which is what most of us usually do) then you don't notice it.
As for racing M3's there are so many factors that change with every car and every race that, I believe what u say, only time and a few more miles will tell on my car.
I'll post up a re-match at 10k just for comparison
If you're looking ahead (which is what most of us usually do) then you don't notice it.
As for racing M3's there are so many factors that change with every car and every race that, I believe what u say, only time and a few more miles will tell on my car.
I'll post up a re-match at 10k just for comparison