NINEZeRO

QFT, well said. If you're buying a 50k+ car with one of the main reasons being that you want to enjoy your performance car then you really shouldn't be looking at a couple thousand dollars difference as the deciding factor. If it does then there's something wrong with your judgment.

LexFather

From a performance standpoint, the M3 and IS-F are pretty much equals. The performance times are nearly identical all around. Reviews for the M3 coupe and IS-F have been spectacular. Each is a representation from each company.

I think the IS-F brings a different look and a Techno feel to the field. It also will be a "Lexus" high quality, great dealer service, great reliablity.

Also, while I would love either car, the M3 continues to lose its rareness as BMW makes more and more. They will make over 100,000 M3s this generation. We might get 20,000 IS-Fs. So it will be the more rare car.

I can't really dislike either, they are both incredible and the choice is down to personal preference.

abuzzl23p

IS-F is still cheaper...

to get the same amenities you would be paying much much more in terms of options...not to mention the DSG price has yet to be announced...also, with lexus i've never had a problem getting under sticker...way under...with bmw you have to pretty much pin them into submission to move away from msrp even with a regular old 3 series...

4TehNguyen

iTrader: (1)

i priced a M3 sedan with features to equal an ISF with Nav/ML, it was already 62.5k thats not even including the DCT transmission whos price is unknown, make it 65-66k with DCT as an estimate, 68-69k if you want the coupe. Sorry thats GTR territory

Badman Forever

bmw pulled a marketing trick w/ their m3 pricing. if you subtract the 19" wheels, moonroof, leather, paint, ipod jack, electronic stability and of course leave the auto tranny.. you are looking at a possible $49-$50k starting price on the is-f. i also can't imagine anyone that would want to order a stripped down m3 unless it was for pure track purposes. so in reality, you are still saving $10k+ with the is-f along w/ the added reliability and faster performance!

n8236

Why I would go M3:
Newer (by 3 years)
German
Coupe (nice to have 2 or 4 door(s) options)
The Gold Standard
Manual tranny

Why I would go IS-F:
Comfort (by a noticeable amount)
Reliability (proven)
More amenities

-------------------

Like someone else said, if I'm going to be spending $60k anyways, I'm not even going to worry about the itsy bitsy options BMW tacks on, but look at the bigger picture. The fact that getting a M coupe w/ a manual tranny is enough reason for most.

While the IS-F may be more comfortable w/ more amenities, it's going to get hammered by reviews that it's being too controlled by the computer and its dating interior. The "fun" factor is gonna play such a huge part with cars in this price range that, with whatever the IS-F has going for it is going to get overshadowed quite a bit by the new kid on the block. Most importantly, where's thhe manual!?!?!?!?!?!?

4TehNguyen

iTrader: (1)

when a 8 speed tranny that comes standard has better shift times (.1 sec, throttle blips) than an enzo why would you want a manual. Ive driven manual for a good number of years and I dont really see the point anymore if you are concerned about true performance. One can calculate derivatives by hand but in the end you still use a calculator

Did you even look at the review sticky to see what mags/sites think, if you think a IS-F interior is dated id suggest you dont look at a 3 interior. BTW you can totally disable the traction control in the F.

Dont forget 1700 for gas guzzler most mags are predicting, base price is going to be irrelevant for some time because of "market adjustment fees"

Da Hapa

Because for many of us, there's a lot more to driving that times in a magazine or time slips at the track.

To me, executing a good rev matched, heal/toe downshift is one of the greatest thrills of driving a good sports car. I am not Schuie and I never will be. I don't race at stop lights. So I couldn't care less that the guy next to me with his flappy gear box/tiptronic/DSC/whatchamanamit gearbox is 0.2 seconds quicker to 60 without any effort than I am. I care that driving well with a proper manual gearbox takes skill and effort.

To paraphrase a well known bumper sticker: "They can take my manual tranny from my cold, dead hands"

newr

words from a true enthusiast and a real man.

A manual driver has to work his 2 feet with 3 pedals all at the same time while 1 hand on steering wheel and the other for shifting yet perfecting the entry and exit... that takes skill.

an auto driver... 2 hands firmly on the steering wheel, blip paddle to downshift.. how exicting is that? that is like NASCAR drivers turning left all day long.

GSteg

iTrader: (15)

I personally think $15k more than the IS350 is a bargain. The transmission and engine alone is worth that price. You get a 5.0L V8 instead of a 3.5L V6. That spells out more torque all across the board. The transmission is a gem though, with it's quick blimp of the throttle and shifting. You wont get that in an IS350.

gengar

I wanted to quote this for perpetuity, just because I love how people have to invent artificial hardship in order to attempt to distinguish themselves from others or look down on them. I mean, gosh, real men and skilled drivers use cars that don't have power steering, leather seats, speakers, A/C, or windshields. Obviously.

CrazyMPG

iTrader: (4)

heh lol i agree!

newr

you clearly missed my and I no not look down on anyone for whatever reasons.

btw, there is a name for those real men/women who drive cars that don't have power steering, leather seats, speakers, A/C, or windshields... it's called RACERS.

4TehNguyen

iTrader: (1)

the funny thing is people wont complain when they utilize launch control, ABS, traction control, some advanced power splitting AWD system, yet people get all bent out of shape on the topic of being a real man and driving manuals. Its all the same damn thing utilizing a piece of technology to gain an advantage

gengar

There was none from what I quoted.

All of whom, notably, also use clutchless transmissions in the highest levels of professional racing. What was your point again?


Exactly my point. These are all simply technological advances, many of which improve performance. I have no problem with people who prefer manuals; in fact, I give and have always given tremendous respect to BMW for offering manual transmissions across their product line. However, artificially inducing technologically-inferior equipment in order to distinguish one's own skill is laughable.

This is not even getting into the fact that one of the people I quoted above said in another thread that the M3 EDC is a "must-have" option and would get it on his vehicle.