bturnbaugh

After the 15,000 mile check up I will go with the good stuff doing it myself

LexusNut13

I know some of the german auto makers are now using synthetic oil standard, and therefor they can go longer between oil changes. My question is then why does Lexus not use synthetic oil. Also, do they make oil filters that last longer specificly for synthetic oil?

Gernby

iTrader: (1)

You really can't do much to make a filter last longer other than to make the filter larger (more surface area of filter media). Well, I guess you could get a much more effective air filter to reduce load on the oil filter...

sirkfc

Is there a definitive answer on this? I changed my service garage for a 97 BMW 7 series. I didn't like the work the previous guy did, but on one oil change, he used synthetic. On the next oil service, the new shop said that the engine didn't need synthetic, and recommended regular oil every 7500. So now i'm running regular, and plan on doing so... bad?

If it matters, it's a 1997 with less than 70K miles... rarely driven, mostly highway.

and of course for my IS350, it'd be nice if it was possible to experiement between oils to see what's the best... 15K synthetic or 5K regular.

Gernby

iTrader: (1)

My understanding is that changing from synth to dyno and back is about like switching brands of the same type. The oils are all "compatable" with each other, but they are all slightly different (base stocks, additives, detergents, etc.). In your case, I think conventional oil is the best choice, since your OCI will probably be based more on the calendar than mileage (ie change it every 6 months even if you've only driven 3K miles).

cdeslandes

It's a modern engine developing 87Hp/liter at almost 7,000 RPMs.

I wouldn't think of pouring anything but synthetic oil in it.

So far I've stuck to ole faithful Mobil 1.

SportyStar

Currently using Amsoil 5/30. I'd prefer 5/20, but unfortunately Amsoil's only 5/20 is the XL (7,500 mile) version.

Lobuxracer, or other oil experts on this board, what in theory would be the result of mixing say 3 quarts of Amsoil 0/30 with 3 quarts of Amsoil 5/20? A custom-viscosity of 2.5/25? Or would the blended oils completely upset the molecular stability to the point where the viscosity couldn't be defined?

SportyStar

I just learned recently that there is such a filter, introduced by Mann+Hummel for Mercedes vehicles. Here's a brief excerpt from a March 2006 press release from thomas.net:

"The world's first fleece oil filter, utilizing the two-layer MULTIGRADE O_SYN medium, was developed by MANN+HUMMEL for Mercedes-Benz. The company also is supplying a fleece air filter with the high-performance gradient media MICROGRADE N for the Audi A8."

MANN+HUMMEL significantly increased diesel fuel filter performance by using melt-blown, superfine fibers combined with a compressed cellulose substrate layer. This multi-layer filter media (also called a "fleece") was optimized to greatly increase oil performance and air filter elements.

As the automotive industry changes from using paper to high-performance fleece filter media, there will be opportunities to increase engine-oil wear protection in the future and create more compact filter designs."

So basically, this advanced filter media allows for extended service intervals with better filter efficiency, especially when using synthetic oils. I wonder whether Toyota/Lexus will be adopting this "fleece" filter in the near future ... or if its use will be pretty much limited to European vehicles for which Mann+Hummel supplies their filters.

lobuxracer

iTrader: (2)

I'm not a tribeologist; I can't say what will happen with the viscosity. That would be a great question for bitog.

lobuxracer

iTrader: (2)

Toyota has had fleece type filters for JDM applications for quite awhile now (at least 10 years). Whether they perform as well as the German media, I don't know. I'm still a big fan of the bypass oil filtration methodology. It's relatively cheap, and extremely effective. Amsoil has been selling this technology for years with many millions of miles in commercial applications to prove its success. It just adds a bit of weight and is impractical in automotive applications unless you are reworking your oiling system. As always, the biggest issues with any media are filtration, flow, and pressure drop. If they can do this in a smaller package with equal performance, it will be a plus. If it can be retrofitted to other platforms, it will be huge.

lobuxracer

iTrader: (2)

That's nothing special for specific output. Ferrari have 125 hp/litre engines, and 750cc bike engines are making nearly 150 hp these days. The 2007 Yamaha R1 engine makes 178 hp out of 1 litre. 20 years ago, 87 hp per litre was really something in a streetable engine. Now, it's nothing special.

LexusNut13

So Lobuxracer, Even if I switched to a full synthetic oil, I would still have to change my oil filter at ther regular intervals? Is there any downfall to using synthetic. I am just wondering why Toyota, and other carm manufactureres are not using it stock.

lobuxracer

iTrader: (2)

I do. Some don't. There are as many holy wars about filters as there are about oil. The only downfall of using synthetic is the cost. IME, every engine I've torn down using sythetic was markedly easier to clean (step one of the rebuild process) and far easier to inspect (step two of the rebuild process) because they don't have the brown death (varnish) all over them.

Scion/Toyota/Lexus do not specify synthetics because conventional oil is adequate for the designs they've given us. Some would argue the sludging issue would be a non-issue if they specified synthetic, and I think they have a good point. GM started putting Mobil 1 in the Corvette because they needed an oil cooler and didn't want to spend the money for one, so they decided to specify Mobil 1 synthetic as the factory fill. The other brands have chosen Mobil 1 for any of a number of reasons, and if you go to bitog you'll see plenty of speculation, fact, and fiction about it.

I just know it's worked exceptionally well in every engine I've had since 1989 and every customer engine I've used it in for street and competition.

sirkfc

Cynical side of me says that the Germans switched to synthetic and the longer oil change interval when they started paying for the oil changes.

Using the same logic, Lexus loves it that you come in for the $180 "oil service" they do every 5000 miles.

DropTopGal

JM Lexus in South Florida uses synthetic blend. Regardless of what the dealer uses, our rule of thumb is to use either dino or synthetic blend for the first 15k miles or so, then switch over to full synthetic Mobil 1. It probably doesn't even matter as long as the oil is changed regularly, but from what I've read, dino or blend for the first 10k to 20k allows the internals to set in then the switch to full synthetic protects the engine. Just my .02