Keyless Access Security Threat
Pole Position
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 2,241
Likes: 63
From: MO
Well said, RockyDog! If anyone has doubts, here's how quickly a brand-new LX570 disappeared, without a trace ... while under security camera surveillance:
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/lx5...carjacked.html
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/lx5...carjacked.html
Moderator
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,752
Likes: 28
From: Utah
Be careful where you park (I ALWAYS park at the furthest/isolated parking spot). Only use the (inside) lock button on the door to lock your vehicle (not remote). If the area is in question (mall, etc.), use a "Club".
Koz
Koz
Lead Lap
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,957
Likes: 501
From: Maryland
Our local Lexus dealer sent an email out to customers during the holidays that some cars at the local mall were getting broken into by thieves getting the codes to cars. Not sure how true it is but if a thief wants something they will get it. I would also rather have my truck stolen and never recovered than to get it back not knowing if anything is messed up or worse that it was wrecked and that I have to get it fixed. I don't keep valuables in my cars and I get tired of driving the same thing after a couple years so as long as my insurance covers the theft I am not too worried about it.
Lead Lap
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 636
Likes: 3
From: ON
1. The BMW alarm has a dead zone which allows thief to break the glass in a special place without triggering the security system. Oversight by BMW.
2. Once the glass is broken they use a service port to upload new keys, another oversight by BMW. It looks like this got fixed in the latest sw updates.
3. The car is quietly pushed off of driveway and then started.
Lead Lap
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 636
Likes: 3
From: ON
Last edited by Quadro; Apr 10, 2013 at 07:54 AM.
Pole Position
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 2,241
Likes: 63
From: MO
In theory the system can be made robust enough since similar approaches used in cryptography all over the place. Diffie–Hellman key exchange (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diffie-...n_key_exchange) is a good example of negotiating the key over unsecured channel (which is what a car and a keyfob initially have to talk over). Once the key has been negotiated the rest of communication happens over encrypted channel. I guess the question then becomes for the automaker to decide how far they want to go. I'm sure they can put a secret-level key nogitiation and encryption in place but at what costs?
Driver School Candidate
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 24
Likes: 0
From: OR
Excluding dochusar's experience (which wasn't technically a theft since they had the keys) some major things you have to look for with the keyless stuff:
1. The rolling codes for Toyota got cracked from time to time. Every time you open your car the signal from a keyfob can be intercepted (nearby parked car, someone standing next to you with a briefcase, etc.) and the next sequence can then be generated tricking the car into thinking the legitimate keyfob is being used. For this method I believe it's actually safer to open your car using door handles because the signal gets transmitted over a shorter distance.
2. Your keyfob signal can be relayed over long distances. Basically a guy standing next to you will have a receiver/amplifier in his briefcase which will transmit the signal of your keyfob over hundreds of feet to a guy standing next to your car. Again, the car will think as if legitimate keyfob was next to it.
3. Service centers can upload additional keys into your car's brains using special equipment. A couple weeks later a guy will just drive your car as he was the owner.
1. The rolling codes for Toyota got cracked from time to time. Every time you open your car the signal from a keyfob can be intercepted (nearby parked car, someone standing next to you with a briefcase, etc.) and the next sequence can then be generated tricking the car into thinking the legitimate keyfob is being used. For this method I believe it's actually safer to open your car using door handles because the signal gets transmitted over a shorter distance.
2. Your keyfob signal can be relayed over long distances. Basically a guy standing next to you will have a receiver/amplifier in his briefcase which will transmit the signal of your keyfob over hundreds of feet to a guy standing next to your car. Again, the car will think as if legitimate keyfob was next to it.
3. Service centers can upload additional keys into your car's brains using special equipment. A couple weeks later a guy will just drive your car as he was the owner.
Lead Lap
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 636
Likes: 3
From: ON
The common answer in this thread appears to be insurance... Some insurance companies even have "depreciation waver" in case the vehicle is stolen, which means you get a brand new one!
Lead Lap
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 636
Likes: 3
From: ON
Also the easiest way to get over the club is to cut out the steering wheel instead...
Racer
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,669
Likes: 4
From: Palos Verdes, California
~ Cap
Last edited by Capirato; Apr 11, 2013 at 08:54 PM.
Moderator
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,752
Likes: 28
From: Utah
LoJack vs Enform
LoJack uses RF for its signal with an independent power source and has a higher recovery rate (90% within the first 48 hours). From what I have researched the Enform (using GPS/Cell signals) can be disabled simply by disconnecting the battery (not confirmed). I would find out for sure before depending on the Enform.
Also LoJack is a one time fee/cost!
Koz
LoJack uses RF for its signal with an independent power source and has a higher recovery rate (90% within the first 48 hours). From what I have researched the Enform (using GPS/Cell signals) can be disabled simply by disconnecting the battery (not confirmed). I would find out for sure before depending on the Enform.
Also LoJack is a one time fee/cost!
Koz