Yes, but if I was in the market for a Model Y and they announced a refresh was coming out, I would either cancel my existing order or wait it out. Then you will have a bunch of inventory sitting they would have to discount

'better' is subjective, but it's certainly DIFFERENT, and i think a lot of bmw owners like to own the 'latest' trendy thing and that clear is an EV.

'shortly' in elon time is 2 years. :D

like what goodies?

I agree it's subjective. I was only using BMW as one example. There is also Mercedes, Audi and Lexus customers Tesla is pilfering. What I was trying to say is that IMO I don't think people are moving to Tesla because it's the latest trend, but because of the high customer satisfaction ratings which means it's a premium product that is delivering to drivers the premium driving experience. Otherwise why would people like my boss (the companies CFO) trade up his 5 series for a model X (2017), than buy one for his wife (2023)? Or my coworker who's been leasing BMW for the last 20 years suddenly test drive a Model Y than order one? It can't be explained away as someone trying to save some money or that they are following the latest trend. Just doesn't cut it, at least in mind. But who knows, maybe I'm wrong and I'm missing something

I think clearly Tesla has an appeal to these customers that some people don't understand.

I know many people who have gone from traditional luxury cars to Teslas and not one of them would go back. Its not just the EV thing either, because now MB and BMW and Audi etc have good EVs and none of them have interest in going back...

for most tesla owners it's their first ev, and obviously a radical departure from anything they've driven or owned/leased before. because of this radical shift, most tesla owners are very disinterested in going back to 'traditional' brands, like you say, even those with ev models now, because a) why? b) they're satisfied with their teslas. but i believe the main reasons they're smitten with their teslas are a) they never have to go to a gas station again, b) very little maintenance, c) smooth fast drivetrain, d) packaging efficiency, e) cool factor. i believe tech matters to techies but not to hoards of new tesla owners. i AM surprised though that tesla owners don't care about not having better phone integration but it obviously is at least 'good enough'.

on a personal note, before i decide what's next when my santa fe lease is up in feb, i will go test drive a model y.

I think I would be considered a traditional luxury car buyer and I bought a Tesla because they have the most experience with EVs, performance is off the charts, they look decent and the price was right for the performance.

Now let’s say a Taycan Turbo S or a Lucid Air Performance were the same price and they had more experience with EVs/ironed out the kinks, I would take those in a heartbeat because of how much more luxurious they are. Of course that’s the reason why they are so much more expensive.

As for BMW and Merc, I think their EVs look terrible so I wouldn’t consider either of those.

makes sense so you wanted an EV, went with who had the most experience and bang for the buck with great performance. luxury not part of the equation.

a part of 'luxury' though is exclusivity, having what others don't or can't have. obviously now with the 3/Y a bigger chunk of the 'masses' are getting them, but your model S is still pretty rare (great car, except for the yoke lol).

I don't think the Model 3 is goofy like someone said, it doesn't make my heart go pitter patter but it's clean and functional and attractive.

I do rather like the new headlights as well.

I agree for most part the styling of BMW / MB is really hurting the sales #s.
The iX, EQS etc are terrible looking cars.
i4 would look decent if it wasn’t for pig nose grill.

I didn't like the current 3 because I didn't like the weird front end. Ended up with 2. I also didn't like the goofy front of the Rivian. Ended up with one of those too :p

I really like the Highland leaks thus far though. My wife has no desire to switch out her 3 and I have no more car money to spend for a few years so we won't be getting one of those

If this is not a goofy design, not sure what is. Its not ugly just a bit strange.
Camry or even Prius look better to me.

https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.clu...888c312fdf.jpg

https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.clu...e2f2d8cf98.jpg

Those wouldn't be my choice of rims but that's a clean, even somewhat slick looking car. I'd get better rims and red, Tesla knows how to do red really well.

This is what the rims look like if you take off the Aero covers on the Model 3 Performance

https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.clu...a9ad3e3505.jpg

Also forgot to mention, those are Aero covers for the older Model 3. This is what the newer model looks like (my brother in law's base rwd):

https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.clu...b02f7f9368.jpg

i feel the current 3 exterior is beginning to look dated, so the highland timing is good.

with used tesla prices having dropped like a rock i doubt there will be tons of people trading in to get a highland any time soon.

Still can't see what's wrong with Tesla's exteriors. Not striking or anything - correct... or, well, you could say that they're strikingly non-striking. Just like a normal "car" (or what a normal car used to be :D ). Looks good without a fake grille. Still don't like the interior, don't worry :P