One week with my ES 300H
10-15-18, 08:42 PM
#31
Pole Position
We like the hybrids for the reasons pgiinc articulates. However, I believe the warranty on the hybrid components is 8 years in a non-CARB state, or 10 years in a CARB state.
In terms of the CVT, yes everyone is going to have their own preference but my wife and I like the smooth drive without any shift points. It isn’t for everybody and it isn’t particularly sporty, but that isn’t really why we buy a car like an ES. This is one of those subjective things and people just need to test drive and decide what meets their needs/preferences.
In terms of the CVT, yes everyone is going to have their own preference but my wife and I like the smooth drive without any shift points. It isn’t for everybody and it isn’t particularly sporty, but that isn’t really why we buy a car like an ES. This is one of those subjective things and people just need to test drive and decide what meets their needs/preferences.
10-16-18, 02:45 AM
#32
Driver School Candidate
Are you talking about battery failure within warranty? Outside of warranty, you are out of luck.
10-16-18, 11:19 AM
#33
Driver School Candidate
Yes, those highway mileage figures are somewhat comparable.
But look at the city driving.....568 (hybrid) vs. 350 (ES 350)
Or combined...580 (hybrid) vs. 413 (ES 350)
But look at the city driving.....568 (hybrid) vs. 350 (ES 350)
Or combined...580 (hybrid) vs. 413 (ES 350)
10-24-18, 07:56 AM
#34
That sealed it for me.
80 mile commute daily, and over the past four years, I've averaged 95 miles per day.
413/95 (more like 390 in my is350 f) 4.3
580/95 = 6.1
I'd put up with a LOT to be buying gas every six days instead of every four for the next four years. 335 stops with the 350, 239 stops with the 300h.
I realize that's theoretical, but when I consider eliminating roughly ONE HUNDRED fuel stops from my life, I get excited.
80 mile commute daily, and over the past four years, I've averaged 95 miles per day.
413/95 (more like 390 in my is350 f) 4.3
580/95 = 6.1
I'd put up with a LOT to be buying gas every six days instead of every four for the next four years. 335 stops with the 350, 239 stops with the 300h.
I realize that's theoretical, but when I consider eliminating roughly ONE HUNDRED fuel stops from my life, I get excited.
11-05-18, 10:03 AM
#36
11-05-18, 11:22 AM
#37
If you plan to keep your car beyond the warranty period, then you should consider saving up for a replacement battery just in case. I believe in California it's 10 years, 150K but you should make sure. I'm choosing not to get a hybrid because for this particular car, I'm planning to keep it for as long as I can. I don't want to have to make the replace the battery or car decision if I don't have to. Also, the battery degrades more with time than with miles. If say at year 10, you don't drive your car as much and want to keep it until year 13, your battery will keep on degrading even if you don't hit the 150K mark. I have a 13 year old Lexus RX that's over 150K which runs perfectly fine. My parents are using it now and they drive less than 5 miles a day, if they drive it at all. If I had a hybrid, I'd have to think battery replacement and most likely, I'd have them sell the car instead. When the warranty runs out, you'll be constantly worried if you should sell the car or not because if/when your battery goes, you can't sell it until you replace it or take a huge loss selling it to a mechanic, etc.,. Again, not everyone plans to be in this situation. Most people change cars every 7-10 years. If that's you, and you like the drive of the hybrid, gas savings, etc., then go for it.
Are you talking about battery failure within warranty? Outside of warranty, you are out of luck.
Are you talking about battery failure within warranty? Outside of warranty, you are out of luck.
let me know who and how much it cost I be interested .I have been driving hybrids since 2007 and and one failed Toyota replaced it no charge. I am curious how much it would cost if the customer has to pay for it since Toyota refused to.
I am betting they will replace it out of warranty otherwise they may lose customers
Philip
Last edited by pgiinc; 11-05-18 at 05:17 PM.
11-05-18, 04:25 PM
#38
Lexus Test Driver
ok take a poll! ask anyone here if they ever had to replace there Hybrid battery with out of pocket money?
let me know who and how much it cost I be interested .I have been driving hybrids since 2007 and and one failed Toyota replaced it no charge. I am curious how much it would cost if the customer has to pay for it since Toyota refused to.
I am betting the will replace it out of warranty otherwise they may lose customers
Philip
let me know who and how much it cost I be interested .I have been driving hybrids since 2007 and and one failed Toyota replaced it no charge. I am curious how much it would cost if the customer has to pay for it since Toyota refused to.
I am betting the will replace it out of warranty otherwise they may lose customers
Philip
11-05-18, 05:48 PM
#39
This thread kind of reminds me of an episode on South Park. When people of South Park get hybrid cars and think their farts smell better. Lol. Don't mind me. Off topic here. Lol.
11-08-18, 11:55 AM
#40
Lexus Champion
But before we start, most of Toyota's and Lexus' hybrids use nickel-metal hydride (NiMH), not the nickel cadmium (NiCd) battery; I know of no hybrid vehicles that use the NiCd battery. There is a difference. Compared to NiCd batteries, NiMH batteries have greater capacity and have no memory effect. Those who remember old cellular phones with a NiCd battery will know the memory effect: The battery had to be completely drained before recharging, otherwise the unused charge would be lost forever, reducing the charge capacity of the battery.
This type of battery would not work on hybrid vehicles, especially Toyota hybrid vehicles, that are constantly being recharged.
As to why Toyota is still using the NiMH battery rather than the lithium ion (LiIon) battery in its hybrid vehicles, the reason is likely factory capacity to build LiIon batteries. Toyota only recently became confident that they had a LiIon battery that they could trust to be safe and reliable.
The thermal runaway problem of LiIon batteries (exploding Samsung Note 7 smartphones and LiIon battery fire problems in early Boeing 787 Dreamliner aircraft) is now familiar to us. Toyota has had this concern for many years and only 2 years ago announced that it had developed a safer, more reliable LiIon battery. But it has been using NiMH batteries in its hybrid vehicles for 20 years now. Toyota has a much greater capacity to build NiMH batteries than LiIon batteries.
11-08-18, 04:44 PM
#41
Lexus Test Driver
Thermal runaway is a very real issue, especially with the Li-ion 18650 cells that Tesla and others use. Breach the cell in a hard crash and the whole battery pack goes up in flames.
Li-ion cells also need proper thermal regulation to perform properly. Older Nissan Leafs had terrible capacity drops in hot climates because the battery pack was passively cooled and always got hot during charging. Teslas don't have this problem because they have a coolant loop for the battery pack.Toyota hybrids, on the other hand, rely on passive cooling for the underseat or seatback packs - there's a fan that sucks in cabin air to keep the whole thing cooled. The funny thing is that the Prius Prime and Camry Hybrid LE models use Li-ion packs but with the same fan cooling system as NiMH models. I guess Toyota is super conservative when it comes to engineering so they tend to take incremental steps. That also explains why they haven't come up with an EV yet when Hyundai and Honda are leaping ahead.
11-09-18, 09:36 AM
#42
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I completely agree. I traded my 2013 300h in at 70,000 miles for a 2015 and still did not need brake pads. 5 days ago I traded in the 2015 for a 2019 300h that had 9 miles. Had it a week and in a word, WOW! And I got it for 3400 off the sticker and got 21000 on trade (1000 less than kelly would have bought it but I only paid the diff in taxes between trade and price of the car).
11-09-18, 09:42 AM
#43
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Battery warrantee is for 8 years 100,000 miles. I let my cars go before 100,000 and cant for the life of me see having a car for over 4 years let alone 8. But the replacement (especially good after market is about 1500-2000)
11-10-18, 06:15 AM
#44
Lexus Fanatic
As to why Toyota is still using the NiMH battery rather than the lithium ion (LiIon) battery in its hybrid vehicles, the reason is likely factory capacity to build LiIon batteries. Toyota only recently became confident that they had a LiIon battery that they could trust to be safe and reliable.
Last edited by Toys4RJill; 11-10-18 at 06:19 AM.
11-10-18, 06:27 AM
#45
Pole Position
Why is it that you always misrepresent or conveniently not reveal all of the details of the that facts when it comes to Toyota hybrids? The current Camry hybrid has both a lithium battery and a sealed nickel-metal hydride battery, depending on what model you buy. The regular Prius is a nickel-metal hydride battery. The Prius Prime is only available with a lithium battery.