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No one is comparing IS and GS to any Toyota sedans over the years, because they were built on different platforms and drivetrains. IMO, the new ES is just too close in every way to the new Avalon and even the top trim Camry.
Sorry, but thats just BIZARRE to say...
The Rolls-Royce Phantom is built on the same platform as the BMW 7 series.......But no Rolls-Royce is anything like a "cheap crappy" 7 series (When you compare prices at-least)..
Same goes for the Bentley Continental GT that shares platforms with Audi vehicles. Or the steering wheel on that car is reminiscent to the VW Golf...Just please...
No one is comparing IS and GS to any Toyota sedans over the years, because they were built on different platforms and drivetrains. IMO, the new ES is just too close in every way to the new Avalon and even the top trim Camry.
They say its a noticeable difference in softness. They did not wait to test drive the new ES and I think you are right, it would be a harder in the ES.
They say its a noticeable difference in softness. They did not wait to test drive the new ES and I think you are right, it would be a harder in the ES.
Thats interesting that the Avalon would be softer than the ES! But what makes you think the ES would be harder?? As far as I understand, the ES is the more luxury oriented vehicle. Which should offer a better ride quality.
No one is comparing IS and GS to any Toyota sedans over the years, because they were built on different platforms and drivetrains. IMO, the new ES is just too close in every way to the new Avalon and even the top trim Camry.
The ES/Avalon comparisons are inevitable and have been going on a long time. No doubt many shoppers for both models look at the other one and decide which is best for them based on their budget, needs and preferences. Most reviews will mention the two models etc. They both sell in good numbers so there isn't any right or wrong between the two. As mentioned earlier, if you are shopping the two be sure to post your question on an Avalon forum to get both sides of the pros and cons.
The ES/Avalon comparisons are inevitable and have been going on a long time. No doubt many shoppers for both models look at the other one and decide which is best for them based on their budget, needs and preferences. Most reviews will mention the two models etc. They both sell in good numbers so there isn't any right or wrong between the two. As mentioned earlier, if you are shopping the two be sure to post your question on an Avalon forum to get both sides of the pros and cons.
I can totally agree with comparing them based on budget, features and needs like you said. But judging them based on Platform and drivetrain is just not appropriate...Lexus sharing things with its parent company Toyota is fine. Doesn't make them the same in ANYWAY though. Again, like I mentioned in my Rolls-Royce and Bentley comparisons above.
Thats interesting that the Avalon would be softer than the ES! But what makes you think the ES would be harder?? As far as I understand, the ES is the more luxury oriented vehicle. Which should offer a better ride quality.
Their outgoing ES was a tad too firm, but it sold well. So I assume Toyota would not change what worked in the past. But there is an F-sport model, so who knows. Maybe it would be softer.
The Lexus ES shares the (TN)GA-K platform with the Toyota Avalon and the Toyota Camry.
In current terms, a car platform describes the unseen, shared components (including engines, transmissions, suspension) and some necessary, hard points and dimensions (such as how and where engines, suspension, pedals, etc. are attached) between similar cars.
A platform may be stretched or shrunk, which allows the ES to have a longer wheelbase and length, and greater width than the Camry. A platform does not dictate an exact floorpan, so although the ES and Avalon share the same wheelbase, the floorpans may be different and one may have greater rear legroom than the other, for example.
Sharing a platform allows different cars to be built on the same assembly line, allowing the automaker some flexibility. If, for instance demand for the Camry drops but demand for the Avalon increases, Toyota could quickly decrease Camry production and replace those spots with the Avalon. The reason that the ES and the Avalon are built on different assembly lines (in Georgetown, Kentucky) is NOT because they are different platforms, but because of the extra care that is put into Lexus assembly (Lexus line workers are specially trained).
BTW, Avalons sell very, very poorly in Canada, so poorly that we do not get the Avalon Hybrid. But the ES does sell (and, of course, Camry sells).
I think I will drive both to see for myself. It's so hard to compare on paper or video. The LS looks "meh" to me in videos, but when I sat in one in the dealership I was completely blown away. I also sat in an LC 500 and it didn't feel all that special to me. If the ES makes me feel like I'm sitting in something special and the Avalon doesn't, the choice will be easy!
I also love a good stereo. My current car has so much road/tire noise the radio is just background noise to the background noise lol. I like the ES 1800 Levinson over the 1200 JBL in the Avalon. I do want to hear both, though.
I actually think Lexus does a fine job of differentiating from Toyota - unlike Acura and Honda or Infiniti and Nissan as examples.
I beg to differ.
Nissan is the one among the big three Japanese automakers (Toyota, Honda, Nissan) that makes the most objective distinction between its luxury and non-luxury lineup. The Nissan lineup has been primarily FWD (except the sports cars) while the Infiniti lineup used to be primarily RWD until they introduced the QX60 and now based on the success of the QX60, changed the EX37/QX50 from RWD to FWD. Perhaps they realized, potential buyers of the EX (or any CUV/SUV for that matter) care less about driving dynamics which was the EX's strong point.
In particular, the Nissan Maxima and Infiniti G35/G37/Q50 start at around the same price ($33k vs. $35k) but the former is a FWD sedan with CVT while the latter is a RWD (optional AWD) sedan with a 7-speed A/T. Also, the Q50 has many more engine options (2.0T, 3.0T, hybrid) than a Maxima (V6). The Q50 is much more of a driver's car with many more options and longer warranty than a Maxima. Note that I am not comparing the looks, quality, prestige, etc. which are subjective.
Unfortunately, the distinction between a Toyota Avalon and Lexus ES (or Honda Accord V6/2.0T and Acura TLX) is not so objective but is more subjective.
When you compare cars with the same equipment, the difference in price is more like $3000 than $10,000. For that difference, my local Lexus dealer service is worth the difference. The difference is not even that large when you trade, since you get most of it back in resale. For me, the Avalon is the worst choice for near luxury cars.
I don’t know if the comparison is really appropriate or not. The Avalon is a nice car but you couldn’t give me one with that enormous grill. The one thing I will say as a previous Avalon owner is that the Avalon was really noisy for a car in that price range, especially in the back seat. They may well have improved the sound deadening in the last couple of generations but I just couldn’t get past the look of the current gen. On the other hand, I love the look of the new Camry (but ONLY with the sport grill) and the ES. The ES is well worth the price difference to me but everyone will have different preferences and budgets so this is extremely subjective.
08-30-18, 01:55 PM
