ES Redesign
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Joined: Mar 2019
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From: USA
, I'm pretty sure it won't, we'll see how the new Camry looks very soon and we can at least know the dimensions and form of the new ES, other than engine and the dash, it won't be too much changes vs the current model is what I believe, of course it will look better.
Pole Position
Joined: May 2021
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From: IL
As for the others, the back looks very much like the current car except for the full-width taillight schtick. The rest look to me like a typical show-car exaggeration of a production car—specifically the lack of enough height for production headlights, the extreme concave scallop in the rear doors, and the almost complete lack of wheelwell clearance for a non-sporty car.
Pole Position
Joined: Jun 2010
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From: NC
What are these "shortcomings"? Yes, I know you've made multiple posts with sweeping indictments of TNGA's safety based solely on its "acceptable" rating in the side impact test. But "ride and NVH shortcomings"?
Independent reviewers have heaped praise on the ES as one of the quietest, best-riding cars of any type below $60,000. (Motor Trend titled its review "Reveling in the Sound of Silence." Savagegeese, en route to naming the ES the best entry-luxury sedan for 2022, said it "rides amazing over every pavement type." Highway sound testing rated it 1 dB louder than a Mercedes S Class.)
You have criticized and downplayed each of these findings in various posts, but they all exist. And given your stated prejudice against the two (you bought two!) lemons you claim to have owned, and your stated allegiance to a competing automaker, I see no reason to discard the findings of all these professionals and my own personal experience to embrace your conflicting view instead.
Independent reviewers have heaped praise on the ES as one of the quietest, best-riding cars of any type below $60,000. (Motor Trend titled its review "Reveling in the Sound of Silence." Savagegeese, en route to naming the ES the best entry-luxury sedan for 2022, said it "rides amazing over every pavement type." Highway sound testing rated it 1 dB louder than a Mercedes S Class.)
You have criticized and downplayed each of these findings in various posts, but they all exist. And given your stated prejudice against the two (you bought two!) lemons you claim to have owned, and your stated allegiance to a competing automaker, I see no reason to discard the findings of all these professionals and my own personal experience to embrace your conflicting view instead.
Lead Lap
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 4,687
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From: Ca
So you know, the 2023 ES (not even 2022) did not even outperform the Corolla crush wise on the side impact. Torso, pelvis, side structure got battered. (again 23 ES, not even 22 and older, which would be worse) 23 contains updates.
anyway.. you'd think that would be true (quoted/bolded your post) however the new Toyota Crown gets only an "Acceptable structure" in the new test... even though it's a new car... because they recycled the old platform. like i said in my original post. Yes I hope for the new Camry to improve.. but if it follows the Crown.. i doubt it. It will still be a generally safe car but I like to see big improvements like the New Accord. The New Accord -- Honda engineers did geat. That structure got a Green "Good" Score. Beefy. Well done Honda!
anyway.. you'd think that would be true (quoted/bolded your post) however the new Toyota Crown gets only an "Acceptable structure" in the new test... even though it's a new car... because they recycled the old platform. like i said in my original post. Yes I hope for the new Camry to improve.. but if it follows the Crown.. i doubt it. It will still be a generally safe car but I like to see big improvements like the New Accord. The New Accord -- Honda engineers did geat. That structure got a Green "Good" Score. Beefy. Well done Honda!
I also have both 3.5GS and 4GS.
In both instances, I notice that the longer wheelbase 3.5GS and 4GS are not as stiff as their smaller brethren in 2IS and 3.5IS.
Naturally, on the same platform, the longer the wheelbase and the wider the track, the more compromized the torsional rigidity and bending stiffness.
Hence, I wouldn't be surprized if ES is not as stiff as Camry.
It's the same with TMC's 2.5/3.0/3.5 V6's.
I find the 2.5 V6 the smoothest.
The 3.0 V6 is middle ground.
While the 3.5 V6 is coarsest.
Lead Lap
Joined: Aug 2011
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From: Ca
Instructor
Joined: Jan 2023
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From: TX
Instructor
Joined: Dec 2019
Posts: 1,242
Likes: 624
From: Kentucky
Why deny yourself the guilty pleasure of indulging in some good old train-wreck entertainment? I totally understand where you're coming from, but as someone who's a glutton for punishment, I just can't resist the urge to watch. It's like a magnetic force that pulls me in, no matter how hard I try to look away😜
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