First 2016 ES Refresh teaser pic released!
Pole Position
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 3,172
Likes: 1,716
From: NC
I love my new 2013 ES300h which I have had for a month. I came from a 2010 RL. My 2010 had white exterior and the same parchment interior that my ES has, The only thing I miss is my brown dash and door trims. You are right that everyone has gone to black dashes and door trims except Mercedes. My old dash never showed any lint and matched the tan interior much better. If nothing else I will be buying this color combo on a 2016 in three years.
Rookie
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 49
Likes: 2
From: IL
Obsidian vs. Caviar
Just curious to ask if anyone knows of the difference between Obsidian black and what looks to be another black finish - Caviar.....
I just came from a 186k mile 2003 Honda Pilot and with nothing currently on the market to my liking I took a 2 year, 15k mile lease on a 2015 Camry SE ($129/month is what did it for me). With so many new models expected for 2017 (MB E350, BMW 5 Series, Lexus GS350), I thought this would buy me some time. I am however very much liking the pics of the facelift on the 2016 ES350.
We bought my wife a 2014 Highlander Limited last year and love the vehicle. I may wait to see if Lexus comes through with the mentioned TX, but not sure if I really need two SUVs in the garage. For the price, I justdon't think one can lose on the upcoming ES.
Sorry for the rant - Obsidian vs. Caviar thoughts and comments would be greatly appreciated.....
I just came from a 186k mile 2003 Honda Pilot and with nothing currently on the market to my liking I took a 2 year, 15k mile lease on a 2015 Camry SE ($129/month is what did it for me). With so many new models expected for 2017 (MB E350, BMW 5 Series, Lexus GS350), I thought this would buy me some time. I am however very much liking the pics of the facelift on the 2016 ES350.
We bought my wife a 2014 Highlander Limited last year and love the vehicle. I may wait to see if Lexus comes through with the mentioned TX, but not sure if I really need two SUVs in the garage. For the price, I justdon't think one can lose on the upcoming ES.
Sorry for the rant - Obsidian vs. Caviar thoughts and comments would be greatly appreciated.....
Lead Lap
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 4,279
Likes: 1,034
From: Illinois
Thus, since, for the 2016 ES, it appears that both the obsidian and the caviar are available, my guess would be that the caviar is a metallic black, or, perhaps, a 3-stage pearl finish. .
As a side note, non-metallic blacks are, without question, the easiest colors to match if paint work should ever become necessary. My guess is that caviar, if it is a metallic or pearl finish, would present significantly greater challenges to achieve a satisfactory match should paint work be needed.
Last edited by lesz; Aug 4, 2015 at 05:44 AM.
Intermediate
Joined: Mar 2015
Posts: 288
Likes: 11
From: MA
I also have the Michelin 17" and keep cold psi at recommended pressure as stated on label on door. I feel every imperfection on the roadway. My brother's Buick Lacrosse rides better than this. I wish Lexus would address this issue before my lease is up in 2017. I'd definitely replace my 2014 if they did. I understand that Lexus added more soundproofing on the 2016 which may have helped with road noise.
The quote below from Motor Trend might help to explain the harsh ride. Perhaps it IS the tires as they elude to. I have the hybrid ES300h which must have these "brick" tires. I wonder if changing to the all-seasons would drop my MPG significantly. Do you have the ES300h, or the ES350?
Quote from Motor Trend on 2013 ES:
"Not so the new ES. Amazingly, neither version rides particularly well. The ES 300h has a semblance of a defense: for maximum mpg -- its raison d'etre -- it sits on hard, low-rolling-resistance Michelins. Curiously, though, our ES 350 test car wore the same 17-inch rubber bricks. An 18-inch all-season tire is optional on the ES 350 and might soften the ride a tad, but it's hard to imagine anyone describing this sedan as "plush." Tire noise intruding on the cockpit is an issue, too. That's the really unpardonable sin here: no DNA from the LFA, but not enough from the LS 460 either."
Read more: http://www.motortrend.com/new_cars/0...#ixzz3h6TMVr00
The quote below from Motor Trend might help to explain the harsh ride. Perhaps it IS the tires as they elude to. I have the hybrid ES300h which must have these "brick" tires. I wonder if changing to the all-seasons would drop my MPG significantly. Do you have the ES300h, or the ES350?
Quote from Motor Trend on 2013 ES:
"Not so the new ES. Amazingly, neither version rides particularly well. The ES 300h has a semblance of a defense: for maximum mpg -- its raison d'etre -- it sits on hard, low-rolling-resistance Michelins. Curiously, though, our ES 350 test car wore the same 17-inch rubber bricks. An 18-inch all-season tire is optional on the ES 350 and might soften the ride a tad, but it's hard to imagine anyone describing this sedan as "plush." Tire noise intruding on the cockpit is an issue, too. That's the really unpardonable sin here: no DNA from the LFA, but not enough from the LS 460 either."
Read more: http://www.motortrend.com/new_cars/0...#ixzz3h6TMVr00
I hear the last generation ES that ended in '12 had a quieter and softer ride than this generation.
Lead Lap
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 4,279
Likes: 1,034
From: Illinois
Is this a review of the current ES, certainly not the '16 (I would hope)? A smaller tire, 17 vs 18 will be quieter and have a softer ride, the larger tire will contribute a bit to noise, don't be fooled.
I hear the last generation ES that ended in '12 had a quieter and softer ride than this generation.
I hear the last generation ES that ended in '12 had a quieter and softer ride than this generation.
My previous ES was a 2006 (Generation 4) ES. Not only did it have higher profile tires, but the recommended tire pressure was 29 psi, compared to 33 psi with my generation 6 ES. Even with the higher tire pressure, my 2013 ES is every bit as quiet as was that older ES, and, when I've experimented with running the tires at 29 psi, the ride firmness of the 2013 is as soft and, perhaps, softer than that of my previous ES. I'm confident that, if those who think that the Generation 6 has firmer fide than did the Generation 5 ES ran tires at, say, 30 psi, they wouldn't be able to tell the difference in ride firmness between the two generations.
Driver School Candidate
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 9
Likes: 0
From: FL
Lesz, I agree completely with your post. I did drive an ES300h before I bought and did notice what I felt was a harsh ride. But I decided to lease it for 3 yrs. because I liked everything else about the car. After reading the Motor Trend article, I agree with them that it must be due to the "brick" tires. Now if Motor Trend thinks the car has a poor ride, there must be something wrong because they lean toward liking good performance over ride. I watched a video from Cnet a few years ago reviewing the 2013 ES and they were highly critical of the ride. I really do wonder if I would lose much efficiency (MPG) if I replaced tires with all-seasons. Anyone out there have any ideas about this?
Thread Starter
Lexus Fanatic
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 68,918
Likes: 4,121
From: Maryland
I think the misconception here is that a hard ride = good handling. My issue with them firming up the ride on cars like the ES, or the Avalon...is that there is no improvement in handling. So what you get is a hard riding car that still handles poorly. Not a good combination.
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Driver
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 84
Likes: 17
From: RI
Lesz, I agree completely with your post. I did drive an ES300h before I bought and did notice what I felt was a harsh ride. But I decided to lease it for 3 yrs. because I liked everything else about the car. After reading the Motor Trend article, I agree with them that it must be due to the "brick" tires. Now if Motor Trend thinks the car has a poor ride, there must be something wrong because they lean toward liking good performance over ride. I watched a video from Cnet a few years ago reviewing the 2013 ES and they were highly critical of the ride. I really do wonder if I would lose much efficiency (MPG) if I replaced tires with all-seasons. Anyone out there have any ideas about this?
I really want to want the ES, but I can't go through this again. I hate getting in my car every day, and I can't afford to make the same mistake twice.
Intermediate
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 378
Likes: 94
From: CT
I have to admit that I agree with you, and all these posts have pretty much talked me out of getting the ES. This is exactly why I am getting rid of my Accord, because I can't stand the ride. BUT...I did like everything else about the car, and the harsh ride was somewhat evident during the test drive but didn't really get to be a problem until I had owned the car for a month or so.
I really want to want the ES, but I can't go through this again. I hate getting in my car every day, and I can't afford to make the same mistake twice.
I really want to want the ES, but I can't go through this again. I hate getting in my car every day, and I can't afford to make the same mistake twice.
They both commented on how nice it rode, and that's our car with the 18" wheels. They did get swapped to have the Michelin tires on them which made some difference.
But I understand how it feels like a crapshoot.....anything mass produced will have good and bad examples produced alongside each other.
I owned two ES350s and found the '13/'14 ES350 loaners to have a pleasant ride but not as smooth as the previous generation but handling was better.
Oh and yes the loaners had 17's and I purposely checked and adjusted the air pressure if necessary.
Oh and yes the loaners had 17's and I purposely checked and adjusted the air pressure if necessary.
Thread Starter
Lexus Fanatic
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 68,918
Likes: 4,121
From: Maryland
I have to admit that I agree with you, and all these posts have pretty much talked me out of getting the ES. This is exactly why I am getting rid of my Accord, because I can't stand the ride. BUT...I did like everything else about the car, and the harsh ride was somewhat evident during the test drive but didn't really get to be a problem until I had owned the car for a month or so.
I really want to want the ES, but I can't go through this again. I hate getting in my car every day, and I can't afford to make the same mistake twice.
I really want to want the ES, but I can't go through this again. I hate getting in my car every day, and I can't afford to make the same mistake twice.
Intermediate
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 319
Likes: 30
From: Nevada
The 2016 ES likely got some of the same structural rigidity, suspension tuning, weatherstripping and interior insulation refinements that made the 2015 Camrys ride a little smoother and quieter than the 2012-14 models did.
Driver
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 84
Likes: 17
From: RI
That was one of a few other options I thought about. I hate to say it but I think the Chrysler 300 would be perfect for me, IF it were made by Toyota. I don't want to be bringing my car in for repairs for the next 3 years either. Another car that has gotten good reviews is the Chevy Impala, but again, I can't bring myself to even drive a GM product after what they did (or didn't do) to their customers.
I'm just impossible to please. I want the perfect car, and it doesn't exist.
I'm just impossible to please. I want the perfect car, and it doesn't exist.
Lexus Champion
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 12,589
Likes: 285
From: Illinois
That was one of a few other options I thought about. I hate to say it but I think the Chrysler 300 would be perfect for me, IF it were made by Toyota. I don't want to be bringing my car in for repairs for the next 3 years either. Another car that has gotten good reviews is the Chevy Impala, but again, I can't bring myself to even drive a GM product after what they did (or didn't do) to their customers.
I'm just impossible to please. I want the perfect car, and it doesn't exist.
I'm just impossible to please. I want the perfect car, and it doesn't exist.