Got pulled over by the cops in West Co....
02-16-10, 12:48 PM
#1
Got pulled over by the cops in West Co....
So last night me, my gf and my 2 homies were leaving the driving range and we stopped by Wendy's to eat. (off Azusa/Amar area in West Covina) As we were rolling up to the intersection in the plaza in my homies uncles GS430, we saw a cop, and he saw us making a right turn. ( we saw the cop, and made sure they were no stop signs). We go through the drive thru, and I saw the cop posting up by the exit.
As we exit the drive thru, go to the Wells Fargo drive thru, the cop pulls behind us and instructs us to pull over. He starts asking my homie if he knew why he pulled us over, and he said no. Then the cop says its because we didn't stop at the intersection. (BUT there are no stop signs on our side, we have the right of way). So we were like there is no stop sign.
So then hes giving us **** about that right turn, and he asks us if we have illegal items in the car, and we say no. He keeps asking the same question. Then he asks us if we are on parole or probation, and we say NO because we aren't; at least not anymore. Then he pulls out my homie thats driving, then pulls me out, then my other homie. They searched all of us. They call back up, now theres 3 cop cars. They call a female cop to come and search my gf. Then he searches the WHOLE CAR, we were there for about 45 minutes at least.
While he is searching, I guess he finds my friend uncle's friend's Inglewood police badge, and he kept asking my friend that was driving, "Your uncle is a cop??" and he had this worried look on his face because this is after he pulled us out, searched us, and searched the car for no reason; no probable cause. He kept asking that question if my homies uncle is a cop, and my homie said NO. And the cop was like, "Are you sure he isn't a cop??"
Then at the end, he was like, "I'm just doing my job, trying to find dope, I'm sorry for wasting your time" And he lets us go.
IS THIS RIGHT?? Can a police officer do this without any probable cause? We didn't do anything wrong AT ALL! Is there anything we can do?
As we exit the drive thru, go to the Wells Fargo drive thru, the cop pulls behind us and instructs us to pull over. He starts asking my homie if he knew why he pulled us over, and he said no. Then the cop says its because we didn't stop at the intersection. (BUT there are no stop signs on our side, we have the right of way). So we were like there is no stop sign.
So then hes giving us **** about that right turn, and he asks us if we have illegal items in the car, and we say no. He keeps asking the same question. Then he asks us if we are on parole or probation, and we say NO because we aren't; at least not anymore. Then he pulls out my homie thats driving, then pulls me out, then my other homie. They searched all of us. They call back up, now theres 3 cop cars. They call a female cop to come and search my gf. Then he searches the WHOLE CAR, we were there for about 45 minutes at least.
While he is searching, I guess he finds my friend uncle's friend's Inglewood police badge, and he kept asking my friend that was driving, "Your uncle is a cop??" and he had this worried look on his face because this is after he pulled us out, searched us, and searched the car for no reason; no probable cause. He kept asking that question if my homies uncle is a cop, and my homie said NO. And the cop was like, "Are you sure he isn't a cop??"
Then at the end, he was like, "I'm just doing my job, trying to find dope, I'm sorry for wasting your time" And he lets us go.
IS THIS RIGHT?? Can a police officer do this without any probable cause? We didn't do anything wrong AT ALL! Is there anything we can do?
Last edited by boostedGS; 02-16-10 at 07:43 PM.
02-16-10, 01:29 PM
#5
i'm in law school and i'm currently taking constitutional criminal procedure. that my friend, was an illegal search and violated your 4th Amendment privacy right to illegal search & seizure.
B/c the original stop was premised as a traffic violation, the only reason to search the car had to be linked to the traffic violation (Arizona v. Gants [2009]).
They had a right to search the driver and any passenger as a search incident to seizure to only check for weapons.
They could have justified a cursory safety search of the car if they had reasonable suspicion that you were dangerous/threat. (policy rationale: officer safety)
But basically, the police can justify a search for any number of reasons, including the subjective suspicion that you posed "an imminent threat or suspicion of danger."
But in theory, the search of the car was unlawful and they needed a search warrant.
Additionally, if they did not secure you (handcuff and put you all in the patrol car) they could have justified a cursory search of the car under the 2nd prong of Gants b/c you were unsecure and theoretically had possible control of your immediate surroundings, aka could have reached into the passenger compartment for a gun.
So the general rule is that w/out a warrant, the police need PC (probable cause) to search your car B/c they had no PC, they had no right to search the vehicle, b/c they had no cause to look for anything illegal. Hypothetically, even if they had a warrant for say, driving with a suspended license, and they found a gram of yay on u, they couldn't search the car for additional drugs. B/c the warrant is premised on the traffic violation, they had no PC to search your car for drugs. All they could do is book u for the traffic violation and possession of coke.
Basically, if you can file a complaint but its probably a losing battle. But just file a general grievance to the police station and call it a day. Hope this info helps.
B/c the original stop was premised as a traffic violation, the only reason to search the car had to be linked to the traffic violation (Arizona v. Gants [2009]).
They had a right to search the driver and any passenger as a search incident to seizure to only check for weapons.
They could have justified a cursory safety search of the car if they had reasonable suspicion that you were dangerous/threat. (policy rationale: officer safety)
But basically, the police can justify a search for any number of reasons, including the subjective suspicion that you posed "an imminent threat or suspicion of danger."
But in theory, the search of the car was unlawful and they needed a search warrant.
Additionally, if they did not secure you (handcuff and put you all in the patrol car) they could have justified a cursory search of the car under the 2nd prong of Gants b/c you were unsecure and theoretically had possible control of your immediate surroundings, aka could have reached into the passenger compartment for a gun.
So the general rule is that w/out a warrant, the police need PC (probable cause) to search your car B/c they had no PC, they had no right to search the vehicle, b/c they had no cause to look for anything illegal. Hypothetically, even if they had a warrant for say, driving with a suspended license, and they found a gram of yay on u, they couldn't search the car for additional drugs. B/c the warrant is premised on the traffic violation, they had no PC to search your car for drugs. All they could do is book u for the traffic violation and possession of coke.
Basically, if you can file a complaint but its probably a losing battle. But just file a general grievance to the police station and call it a day. Hope this info helps.
02-16-10, 01:34 PM
#6
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Damn okay all i can think of is that they are on the lookout for 2nd Generation GS300s and 430s. Because ive had my buddy pulled over 3 times in his 2nd gen gs300 in that area, and Jay from Braver even got pulled over in his silver GS. Everytime they get pulled over they ask the same things "Are you in a gang? Do you have any drugs?" and they most of the time pull them out of the car, call backup and search.
Later i found out there is a gang banger in that area with a silver GS who im assuming they are looking for, but for some reason havent found him. Just curious was the cop filipino? Because that cop is the same one pulling everyone else over.
haha just my input on what i think is why you got pulled over :P
Later i found out there is a gang banger in that area with a silver GS who im assuming they are looking for, but for some reason havent found him. Just curious was the cop filipino? Because that cop is the same one pulling everyone else over.
haha just my input on what i think is why you got pulled over :P
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02-16-10, 02:28 PM
#9
i'm in law school and i'm currently taking constitutional criminal procedure. that my friend, was an illegal search and violated your 4th Amendment privacy right to illegal search & seizure.
B/c the original stop was premised as a traffic violation, the only reason to search the car had to be linked to the traffic violation (Arizona v. Gants [2009]).
They had a right to search the driver and any passenger as a search incident to seizure to only check for weapons.
They could have justified a cursory safety search of the car if they had reasonable suspicion that you were dangerous/threat. (policy rationale: officer safety)
But basically, the police can justify a search for any number of reasons, including the subjective suspicion that you posed "an imminent threat or suspicion of danger."
But in theory, the search of the car was unlawful and they needed a search warrant.
Additionally, if they did not secure you (handcuff and put you all in the patrol car) they could have justified a cursory search of the car under the 2nd prong of Gants b/c you were unsecure and theoretically had possible control of your immediate surroundings, aka could have reached into the passenger compartment for a gun.
So the general rule is that w/out a warrant, the police need PC (probable cause) to search your car B/c they had no PC, they had no right to search the vehicle, b/c they had no cause to look for anything illegal. Hypothetically, even if they had a warrant for say, driving with a suspended license, and they found a gram of yay on u, they couldn't search the car for additional drugs. B/c the warrant is premised on the traffic violation, they had no PC to search your car for drugs. All they could do is book u for the traffic violation and possession of coke.
Basically, if you can file a complaint but its probably a losing battle. But just file a general grievance to the police station and call it a day. Hope this info helps.
B/c the original stop was premised as a traffic violation, the only reason to search the car had to be linked to the traffic violation (Arizona v. Gants [2009]).
They had a right to search the driver and any passenger as a search incident to seizure to only check for weapons.
They could have justified a cursory safety search of the car if they had reasonable suspicion that you were dangerous/threat. (policy rationale: officer safety)
But basically, the police can justify a search for any number of reasons, including the subjective suspicion that you posed "an imminent threat or suspicion of danger."
But in theory, the search of the car was unlawful and they needed a search warrant.
Additionally, if they did not secure you (handcuff and put you all in the patrol car) they could have justified a cursory search of the car under the 2nd prong of Gants b/c you were unsecure and theoretically had possible control of your immediate surroundings, aka could have reached into the passenger compartment for a gun.
So the general rule is that w/out a warrant, the police need PC (probable cause) to search your car B/c they had no PC, they had no right to search the vehicle, b/c they had no cause to look for anything illegal. Hypothetically, even if they had a warrant for say, driving with a suspended license, and they found a gram of yay on u, they couldn't search the car for additional drugs. B/c the warrant is premised on the traffic violation, they had no PC to search your car for drugs. All they could do is book u for the traffic violation and possession of coke.
Basically, if you can file a complaint but its probably a losing battle. But just file a general grievance to the police station and call it a day. Hope this info helps.
probably explains why they got really nervous when they thought the OP's uncle was a cop.
its likely worthless, but i'd complain anyways...
02-16-10, 03:24 PM
#10
Just a disclaimer. The above post is by no means legal advice. It is a summary of my understanding as a law student. Gants is open to arguments on both sides, and the Supreme Court has yet to hold on a "bright line rule."
Other cases are also on point: Chimel, Belton, and Carney. Chimel is still good law; Belton has been narrowed in scope but still applicable. Carney is right on point and involves an auto stop in CA. Basically all these cases are fact specific, and there is no current bright line rule when it comes to police procedure in an auto stop. It's all case by case.
Basically:
1.) Don't give the police any reason to stop you;
2.) Never admit to anything (even if guilty);
3.) Never give police consent to search your car. This is one of the exceptions to the warrant requirement besides "Plain View" and "Search Incident to Seizure." Most in the public believe that if you refuse a search when police ask for consent to search, that refusal warrants enough suspicion to trigger PC. WRONG.
The PC analysis is an objective one. The courts have repeated struck down or suppressed evidence gained via an unlawful search based on unwarranted PC based on the officer's subjective opinion. All PC is analyzed on the objective level, or according to the "reasonable police officer standard" and must be backed with physical evidence. If not, you can take them to court and have any unlawfully seized evidence suppressed w/ a motion to suppress.
Other cases are also on point: Chimel, Belton, and Carney. Chimel is still good law; Belton has been narrowed in scope but still applicable. Carney is right on point and involves an auto stop in CA. Basically all these cases are fact specific, and there is no current bright line rule when it comes to police procedure in an auto stop. It's all case by case.
Basically:
1.) Don't give the police any reason to stop you;
2.) Never admit to anything (even if guilty);
3.) Never give police consent to search your car. This is one of the exceptions to the warrant requirement besides "Plain View" and "Search Incident to Seizure." Most in the public believe that if you refuse a search when police ask for consent to search, that refusal warrants enough suspicion to trigger PC. WRONG.
The PC analysis is an objective one. The courts have repeated struck down or suppressed evidence gained via an unlawful search based on unwarranted PC based on the officer's subjective opinion. All PC is analyzed on the objective level, or according to the "reasonable police officer standard" and must be backed with physical evidence. If not, you can take them to court and have any unlawfully seized evidence suppressed w/ a motion to suppress.
02-16-10, 03:36 PM
#12
that sucks man! was the right turn you were making at a red light? i thought that maybe even though it was green, they wouldve wanted you to stop anyway in case pedestrians or the such were walking. as for their searching your friend's ride and the constant questioning, i dont think its illegal because they were checking to see if there was anything criminally related. more often than not, including your case, there was nothing. ive seen and heard stuff like this happening around the glendora/azusa area as well. some cops just want to write tickets- thats just reality. your friend, and everyone else didnt do anything wrong, and you guys didnt get a ticket from it (which was the best part of the story). i say just forget about it. it appears that the cops covered their tracks, making sure they did everything by protocol and in a non-threatening manner at that. sorry you had to go through that. i see plenty of cops around the azusa/amar area, including on grand, so i gotta be extra careful just in case.
02-16-10, 04:34 PM
#14
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One thing that i've learned that comes in handy, whenever a cop stops you (what you think) for the wrong reasons, is unlawfull, or you think they're being harassing you etc.
always ask(nicely) for their name and badge number. Remember to ask nicely so u don't irritate them. this will usually deter them from harassing you because you now have more than just a name and an identification number to report them with.
Basically:
1.) Don't give the police any reason to stop you;
2.) Never admit to anything (even if guilty);
3.) Never give police consent to search your car. This is one of the exceptions to the warrant requirement besides "Plain View" and "Search Incident to Seizure." Most in the public believe that if you refuse a search when police ask for consent to search, that refusal warrants enough suspicion to trigger PC. WRONG.
I find that even though it doesn't give them PC if you refuse, it just irritates the cop more and they will make your life more miserable if you refuse to let them search, so if you got nothing to hide, i say let them search.
always ask(nicely) for their name and badge number. Remember to ask nicely so u don't irritate them. this will usually deter them from harassing you because you now have more than just a name and an identification number to report them with.
Basically:
1.) Don't give the police any reason to stop you;
2.) Never admit to anything (even if guilty);
3.) Never give police consent to search your car. This is one of the exceptions to the warrant requirement besides "Plain View" and "Search Incident to Seizure." Most in the public believe that if you refuse a search when police ask for consent to search, that refusal warrants enough suspicion to trigger PC. WRONG.
I find that even though it doesn't give them PC if you refuse, it just irritates the cop more and they will make your life more miserable if you refuse to let them search, so if you got nothing to hide, i say let them search.
Last edited by xuningshen; 02-16-10 at 04:41 PM.
02-16-10, 05:59 PM
#15
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My buddy is a public defender in SanBerdoo County and he also says never to consent to a search. Who cares if it irritates the cop? My PD friend said to say to the cop, "unless you are detaining me, I would like to be on my way." This lets the cop know you're at least somewhat aware of your rights or that you know at least one criminal defense attorney. When you say that, if they don't have cause, they have to cut you loose.