Merely more market manipulation by the federal government to subsidize technologies that are buy themselves not competitive. We see the same dung in the energy sector. No one, and I mean no one would build a wind or solar generator without the tax credits. This is nothing but an indirect tax on everyone.

It's appropriate for the government to initially subsidize developing technologies for research purposes. At some point though, we need to cut the cord and let them compete in the open market. It's time that they stand on their own. These tax credits sound really good for buyers (and the companies), but they suck for their competition.

We might need to discuss with the founding fathers. I truly doubt they would support any of this.

 

Oh yeah and it's just going to get worse and worse. We left in 2015 and IIRC that was when Toyota left Torrance for Texas. It was a big deal.

More and more will keep fleeing over time.

 

Yeah but don't you own more than one ICE?

Also, you actually are dependent on fossil fuels just like the rest of us even if you own a Tesla. Research emissions for cargo ships that bring you/us the products you use if you want a real shock.

It is not the same thing. I can't go buy a new Tahoe and take nearly $10k off thanks to my fellow taxpayers.

 

We are still the 4th largest economy in the world. That's not going to change. I've been hearing your argument since I was a kid. I'm just curious why people have such a big beef with the state that subsidizes basically most every other state in the union...can't we all just get along?

 

I wish I were allowed on here, but I could give you a laundry list of reasons. I lived there, I do have a dog in the fight. I watched what our tax dollars went to.

Of course there is no state vs state that's ludicrous, all are special in their own way.

The state of Tennessee is #1 for long-term fiscal stability so we aren't begging for your money, lowest taxes in nation too. Yes you have 40MM and a lot more taxpayers versus 7MM people here.

https://www.usnews.com/news/best-sta...lity/long-term

 

I don't know man, there are states the GIVE and don't get back, and there are states that TAKE more than they gave. I'm not trying to down another state, but TN is one of those that gets back from the Federal govt more than they gave. A study in Knoxnews shows TN to be one of the top states that gets more back from the Feds than it gives. Numbers don't lie

 

But my tax money enables you to fuel up the gas guzzler for a reasonable price. I'm not against the oil subsidy just as I'm not against the EV subsidy. The government's job is to promote the well being of our society and if they feel EVs will help in the long run, so be it. All i'm saying is that its hypocritical to bash the EV subsidy when the oil industry has had far more subsidies and will continue to enjoy the subsidies.

This isn't even that big a deal...i got far higher subsidies with my solar buildout or my high efficiency furnace or all the various other subsidies i've enjoyed over the years. Why is this one different

 

Same here in Wisconsin... don't think its $100, but $70-$80 tax surcharge fee for hybrids & electrics. A lot of Teslas and my wife RX450h are getting zapped... oh, that's me, too!

 

These are the states most against the EV credit, but have no issues with big Gas and Oil getting subsidies, and are most dependant on Federal funds:


Source: https://worldpopulationreview.com/st...l-aid-by-state

I'm not trying to start a fight here, I'm just making an observation. California we do a ton of stuff wrong, but we do a lot right. Like being the innovation hub of the world, and growing an economy that's stronger than the majority of countries. We should be called out for what we do wrong, but we don't merit the hate we receive because frankly, our hard earned tax dollars subsidize everyone else

 

And there's the difference between you and me, simple as that. My well being is my 12MPG LX570.

Ok but do you or do you not own an ICE-powered vehicle?

Again, people need to look at emissions from cargo ships. We all depend on those. The figures are staggering, mind-boggling. Something like 20 of the largest ships give off more emissions than every single car on the planet?

Going green, I commend people but we are all still heavily reliant on fossil fuels and that's not going to change.

 

Of course I own ICE but I have NO BEEF WITH OIL SUBSIDIES. None. Let them have their subsidies. Let the EV industry have their subsidy. Let both have their subsidy. I just don't want to hear the stupid criticism of the EV subsidy when oil has their subsidy.

 

Those are things beyond our control. We have to do what's in our hands, today. EV credits makes it possible for middle income people to break into this market. It made it possible for me to lease one cheaply for my wife savings us a ton on her work commute

 

All I was saying was it's different, buying an EV vehicle and them saying, "Oh thanks to taxpayers here's another $7500 off."

I can't go buy an incredibly fuel efficient Diesel Tahoe and get a discount.

 

No, another tax is more government. If EV is good and someone wants it then they should pay for it. It doesn’t need to be subsidized if it’s what people want.

 

My tax bracket for 2020 was 35%, not including state, local and property taxes I paid which probably put me around 44%. On top of that I lost a large chunk I used to deduct due to the SALT deduction being reduced. If the former Billionaire President of the United States can pay $750 in Federal taxes or Jeff Bezos can pay $0, I deserve my darn EV credits. And it's not a tax. It's a tax credit, taking money out of the Federal tax purse