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polar vortex leaves electric car owners out in the cold

 
Old 02-06-19, 11:13 AM
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rogerh00
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Default polar vortex leaves electric car owners out in the cold

Here's an issue I wasn't aware of. Cold weather is bad for lithium batteries. Might have to rethink this EV thing.

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/02/05/tesl...ng-temps-.html
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Old 02-06-19, 02:08 PM
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I feel like I've missed something here...

but yeah it's nothing new that batteries aren't as strong in really cold, before you can do ludicrous mode on the Tesla you even have to press a button that warms up the batteries for 10 minutes
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Old 02-06-19, 02:21 PM
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You didn't miss anything the OP made a thread bashing BEVs without thinking about the fact that cold weather affects ICE cars even more. At -36 degrees a Tesla still drives no problem although some things are disabled like regen. A petrol burner at that temperature will be lucky to start and will get terrible gas mileage.
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Old 02-06-19, 03:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Lexus2000 View Post
You didn't miss anything the OP made a thread bashing BEVs without thinking about the fact that cold weather affects ICE cars even more. At -36 degrees a Tesla still drives no problem although some things are disabled like regen. A petrol burner at that temperature will be lucky to start and will get terrible gas mileage.
That's what block-heaters are for. Some vehicles offer them as factory-options.
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Old 02-06-19, 03:59 PM
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Originally Posted by mmarshall View Post
That's what block-heaters are for. Some vehicles offer them as factory-options.
​​​​​​​
Need to give grid electricity to an ICE powered car in cold weather oh the irony.
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Old 02-06-19, 04:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Lexus2000 View Post
Need to give grid electricity to an ICE powered car in cold weather oh the irony.
Oh, I agree....there's no free lunch either way. But the point is that cold need not stop an ICE vehicle.
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Old 02-06-19, 04:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Lexus2000 View Post
You didn't miss anything the OP made a thread bashing BEVs without thinking about the fact that cold weather affects ICE cars even more. At -36 degrees a Tesla still drives no problem although some things are disabled like regen. A petrol burner at that temperature will be lucky to start and will get terrible gas mileage.
oh i see you were using a bit of sauwcasim...

is saying cheese and rice actually a thing?
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Old 02-07-19, 07:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Lexus2000 View Post
You didn't miss anything the OP made a thread bashing BEVs without thinking about the fact that cold weather affects ICE cars even more. At -36 degrees a Tesla still drives no problem although some things are disabled like regen. A petrol burner at that temperature will be lucky to start and will get terrible gas mileage.
Did not have any trouble starting my wife's Q7 or my loaner X1 last week during the depths of the polar vortex. Fuel economy was also fine for both. FI engines love love LOVE dense cold air.
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Old 02-07-19, 07:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Lexus2000 View Post
Did I post anything that was incorrect? And yes I did, EVs have issues in cold weather just like every machine ever built.
It's not even about incorrect or correct. I just couldnt understand some of the rambling lol. No hard feelings.
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Old 02-07-19, 09:41 AM
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Originally Posted by geko29 View Post
Did not have any trouble starting my wife's Q7 or my loaner X1 last week during the depths of the polar vortex. Fuel economy was also fine for both. FI engines love love LOVE dense cold air.
What was the temperature? What was the fuel economy?
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Old 02-07-19, 10:10 AM
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Originally Posted by Lexus2000 View Post
What was the temperature? What was the fuel economy?
-35F ambient, -56F windchill. Q7 was getting 19-20 like it always does, X1 continued to average 23 (atrocious for a vehicle that size) like it did the entire time I had it. And that's despite significant warming time (for the human's benefit, not the car's) prior to setting off in both cases, which should drag down overall economy.
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Old 02-07-19, 10:34 AM
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Originally Posted by geko29 View Post
-35F ambient, -56F windchill. Q7 was getting 19-20 like it always does, X1 continued to average 23 (atrocious for a vehicle that size) like it did the entire time I had it. And that's despite significant warming time (for the human's benefit, not the car's) prior to setting off in both cases, which should drag down overall economy.
That's a very special vehicle you have there, extended warm up (where you get 0mpg) and no change in your overall mpg even in very cold weather. Now let's compare that to a Model S which is rated 99 MPGe about the worst case I've seen in cold weather is efficiency drops in half, so a 4 second 0-60 car is getting the same mileage as what a Prius gets in the summer.

BTW denser air becomes a factor at highway speed and basically negates any hp gains.
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Old 02-07-19, 11:01 AM
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Just out from AAA: "Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40%."

https://www.detroitnews.com/story/bu...ther/39020225/

And if I understood the desk clerk correctly when we visited Fairbanks last summer, modern ICE (ha!) cars do much better in very cold weather than in the past. 0-20W oils, computer controls, and all that.
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Old 02-07-19, 11:04 AM
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from what i read in other articles, it's not about lithium batteries being 'less efficient' or whatever in the cold, it's that the HEATER goes on in the cold (for both the passengers, and apparently the battery cooling system - if liquid i guess to make sure it's not frozen?) and that uses a lot of battery power on most electric vehicles. in alex on autos review of the kona ev he mentioned that on the lower end trim levels they have electric heating elements which eat loads of battery, but on the high end trim level you get a heat pump which is MUCH more efficient. i'm sure at -35 a heat pump's pretty useless anyway, so i expect there's backup heating elements, just like in a home heat pump.

same in high temps... the a/c running chews up ev battery, especially on short trips, not so bad on long cruising trips.
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Old 02-07-19, 11:06 AM
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Originally Posted by riredale View Post
Just out from AAA: "Cold weather can cut electric car range over 40%."

https://www.detroitnews.com/story/bu...ther/39020225/
Fuel economy tests show that, in short-trip city driving, a conventional gasoline car's gas mileage is about 12% lower at 20F than it would be at 77F. It can drop as much as 22% for very short trips (3 to 4 miles). The effect on hybrids is worse. Their fuel economy can drop about 31% to 34% under these conditions.
Not sure why this stuff has to be pointed out should be common knowlege. Except if you drive a Q7 or X1 then your mpg is not affected.
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