In the wake of GM Restructure, Ford could cut workforce by 1/3rd in the coming months
12-06-18, 07:39 AM
#16
Lexus Fanatic
The new Ram is also popular because, like the last-generation Ram, it drives like a luxury car. It's clearly the most refined full-size pickup I've ever sampled. Even the perennially-popular F-10 and Silverado are now paying more attention to driver and passenger comfort.
12-06-18, 07:42 AM
#17
Super Moderator
Leveling off is fine, and to be expected. As long as they don't crater, FCA will do just fine. And the strong growth in Jeep/Dodge, which don't have anywhere near the new/exciting lineup that Ram does, implies that Ram won't "settle in" to sales that look like Chrysler and Fiat do.
12-06-18, 07:45 AM
#18
Lexus Fanatic
FCA's not going anywhere. New Grand Cherokee coming, new Ram, lots of new products at Jeep. They only sell two sedans anyways.
12-06-18, 07:45 AM
#19
Lexus Fanatic
Leveling off is fine, and to be expected. As long as they don't crater, FCA will do just fine. And the strong growth in Jeep/Dodge, which don't have anywhere near the new/exciting lineup that Ram does, implies that Ram won't "settle in" to sales that look like Chrysler and Fiat do.
12-06-18, 07:51 AM
#20
Lexus Fanatic
Not likely. Though Chrysler (-20.7%) and Fiat (-24.5%) sales are both in dumpster-fire territory, Jeep (+11.8%), Ram (+43.5%), Dodge (+15.1%), and Alfa (+35.9%) are absolutely killing it.
That has been true up to this point, but might not last forever. See below.
Yeah, with Camry and Prius sales down by almost 30% in November, helping drive Toyota's car (as in non-truck/SUV) sales down by 17.3% for the month, they're really taking the shrinking market by storm.
That has been true up to this point, but might not last forever. See below.
Yeah, with Camry and Prius sales down by almost 30% in November, helping drive Toyota's car (as in non-truck/SUV) sales down by 17.3% for the month, they're really taking the shrinking market by storm.
- Likewise, Honda's car sales were down 12.6% in November, driving the whole company negative by 9.5%
- Nissan's car sales dropped by a full third (33%)
- VW saw sales of the Golf, Beetle and Passat tank
- Hyundai-Kia is actually up 0.5% overall, but I'd be willing to bet that their SUV lineup is responsible for that (they don't break out sales by segment), considering that the Genesis brand was down 76.5% for the month.
12-06-18, 08:06 AM
#21
Lexus Fanatic
This is not at all entirely on Trump, but these tariffs absolutely had a role in pushing this over the edge. Thats not to say this wouldn't have happened eventually, but its happening now in large part to that. Talk to some economists who follow the automotive industry about it. He has enacted a lot of things that will prove hurtful to the economy as we go through the next couple years. Just wait and see,
And, its on Trump that he promised people he would not only save these jobs but bring automotive jobs back, and thats just not reality. These jobs are not coming back, and in fact we're going to lose a lot more of them, and a portion of that is going to be due to things he actually put in place. And yes, he's the nation's leader, and much of the nation's political climate and economic climate is connected to him. You can't praise him for good things that happen and discredit people who say its not him that is responsible for that, yet do the exact opposite when bad things happen. You're not even American, if American citizens and voters want to discuss our president we should be able to do so without being berated by citizens of other countries. Worry about your own leaders.
Toyota has no problem building cars here because their factories are not union, and they don't have the burdensome pension obligations to their current workers or past workers that US automakers do. There also is truth to the statement "maybe GM and Ford just suck at business", like I said, they made garbage products for DECADES.
And no, everybody else can not sell sedans. Sedan sales are dropping everywhere, you will absolutely see companies like Toyota and Honda consolidate their sedan models and offerings too going forward. You already see it, look at the GS, talk of no replacement IS, etc.
And, its on Trump that he promised people he would not only save these jobs but bring automotive jobs back, and thats just not reality. These jobs are not coming back, and in fact we're going to lose a lot more of them, and a portion of that is going to be due to things he actually put in place. And yes, he's the nation's leader, and much of the nation's political climate and economic climate is connected to him. You can't praise him for good things that happen and discredit people who say its not him that is responsible for that, yet do the exact opposite when bad things happen. You're not even American, if American citizens and voters want to discuss our president we should be able to do so without being berated by citizens of other countries. Worry about your own leaders.
Toyota has no problem building cars here because their factories are not union, and they don't have the burdensome pension obligations to their current workers or past workers that US automakers do. There also is truth to the statement "maybe GM and Ford just suck at business", like I said, they made garbage products for DECADES.
And no, everybody else can not sell sedans. Sedan sales are dropping everywhere, you will absolutely see companies like Toyota and Honda consolidate their sedan models and offerings too going forward. You already see it, look at the GS, talk of no replacement IS, etc.
12-06-18, 08:32 AM
#22
Dysfunctional Veteran
Thread Starter
I would say the head shed at FCA saw this coming and prepared for it, quite well.
It started back in 2001 when they eliminated Plymouth. Then, when they consolidated their global market under the Chrysler nameplate in 2009, and then again when they split Ram off in 2011, then they did it again in 2013 when SRT split into its own division.
In that time, they dropped the Neon and Avenger for the Dart and Chrysler 200 (which IMO are pretty superb little cars for what they are), Redesigned the Jeep Grand Cherokee, realigned the Chrysler Town and Country Minivan and redesigned it, calling it the Pacifica (reviving an old nameplate from the Daimler days), they took the Viper off the market, redesigned it and reintroduced it under SRT as a Premium Grand Touring car, Brought the Dodge Caravan up to par with Hyundai/Kia minivans, and they just debuted 2 new vehicles: The new 2019 Ram, and the Jeep Gladiator "pick-up), both of which will sell like hotcakes.
FCA has learned from the companies past mistakes. Ford and GM have not. They continue to make vehicles with the same mindset: "People will buy them because they know us." American consumers are waking up. We realize our auto industry has been screwing us over the last 3-4 decades, and we are sick of it. We see the improvements coming from the mainstream out of Japan, and Korea, and we are pissed that we blew billions on the american auto industry and got **** on for it. FCA has constantly adapted, continuously improved their quality, and seem to admit when their wrong (even though in the case of the paint coming off my Ram, they were reluctant, eventually, FCA stepped up and made it right).
It started back in 2001 when they eliminated Plymouth. Then, when they consolidated their global market under the Chrysler nameplate in 2009, and then again when they split Ram off in 2011, then they did it again in 2013 when SRT split into its own division.
In that time, they dropped the Neon and Avenger for the Dart and Chrysler 200 (which IMO are pretty superb little cars for what they are), Redesigned the Jeep Grand Cherokee, realigned the Chrysler Town and Country Minivan and redesigned it, calling it the Pacifica (reviving an old nameplate from the Daimler days), they took the Viper off the market, redesigned it and reintroduced it under SRT as a Premium Grand Touring car, Brought the Dodge Caravan up to par with Hyundai/Kia minivans, and they just debuted 2 new vehicles: The new 2019 Ram, and the Jeep Gladiator "pick-up), both of which will sell like hotcakes.
FCA has learned from the companies past mistakes. Ford and GM have not. They continue to make vehicles with the same mindset: "People will buy them because they know us." American consumers are waking up. We realize our auto industry has been screwing us over the last 3-4 decades, and we are sick of it. We see the improvements coming from the mainstream out of Japan, and Korea, and we are pissed that we blew billions on the american auto industry and got **** on for it. FCA has constantly adapted, continuously improved their quality, and seem to admit when their wrong (even though in the case of the paint coming off my Ram, they were reluctant, eventually, FCA stepped up and made it right).
Last edited by ArmyofOne; 12-07-18 at 08:09 AM. Reason: typo correction
12-06-18, 08:44 AM
#23
Lexus Fanatic
iTrader: (20)
it is interesting how fca has positioned themselves well. the chrysler 300 certainly isn't a big 'investment' at this point so they might as well keep making it until it no longer makes sense. the only other non-ute non-truck non-performance-nitch is the pacifica, which is just that, a niche, but i don't see it going away. the rest, challenger, charger, are just 'novelty' vehicles really.
12-06-18, 09:09 AM
#24
Advanced
Just a stupid question from a guy abroad : but are those american trucks cheaper than compact cars ?
Because, if the peoples are getting poorer and poorer, and the wealth of the middle class is going away, the peoples are going to start buying cheaper, more compact cars, or no cars at all. So I asked myself if trucks where actually cheaper than regular cars in the US.
They aren't in Switzerland, but it doesn't say that it couldn't be the case in the US (I even was shocked to know you had gas at the station for less than 2 dollars a gallon)
.
Because, if the peoples are getting poorer and poorer, and the wealth of the middle class is going away, the peoples are going to start buying cheaper, more compact cars, or no cars at all. So I asked myself if trucks where actually cheaper than regular cars in the US.
They aren't in Switzerland, but it doesn't say that it couldn't be the case in the US (I even was shocked to know you had gas at the station for less than 2 dollars a gallon)
.
12-06-18, 09:33 AM
#25
Just a stupid question from a guy abroad : but are those american trucks cheaper than compact cars ?
Because, if the peoples are getting poorer and poorer, and the wealth of the middle class is going away, the peoples are going to start buying cheaper, more compact cars, or no cars at all. So I asked myself if trucks where actually cheaper than regular cars in the US.
They aren't in Switzerland, but it doesn't say that it couldn't be the case in the US (I even was shocked to know you had gas at the station for less than 2 dollars a gallon) .
Because, if the peoples are getting poorer and poorer, and the wealth of the middle class is going away, the peoples are going to start buying cheaper, more compact cars, or no cars at all. So I asked myself if trucks where actually cheaper than regular cars in the US.
They aren't in Switzerland, but it doesn't say that it couldn't be the case in the US (I even was shocked to know you had gas at the station for less than 2 dollars a gallon)
.
12-06-18, 10:36 AM
#26
Lexus Fanatic
It is more than just what you said with the administration. Tougher immigration laws make it harder for companies to attract the top and best employees (GM is placing these workers in other countries). You have an disastrous environmental situation with emissions where companies have no idea what they should do going forward. There is tariffs on steel of course. The looming threat of a trade issues. The threat of NAFTA termination did nothing to help US automakers plan, now companies are saddled with a 75% content issue which is up from 62.
Just a stupid question from a guy abroad : but are those american trucks cheaper than compact cars ?
Because, if the peoples are getting poorer and poorer, and the wealth of the middle class is going away, the peoples are going to start buying cheaper, more compact cars, or no cars at all. So I asked myself if trucks where actually cheaper than regular cars in the US.
They aren't in Switzerland, but it doesn't say that it couldn't be the case in the US (I even was shocked to know you had gas at the station for less than 2 dollars a gallon) .
Because, if the peoples are getting poorer and poorer, and the wealth of the middle class is going away, the peoples are going to start buying cheaper, more compact cars, or no cars at all. So I asked myself if trucks where actually cheaper than regular cars in the US.
They aren't in Switzerland, but it doesn't say that it couldn't be the case in the US (I even was shocked to know you had gas at the station for less than 2 dollars a gallon)
.
12-06-18, 10:53 AM
#27
Lexus Fanatic
iTrader: (20)
Just a stupid question from a guy abroad : but are those american trucks cheaper than compact cars ?
Because, if the peoples are getting poorer and poorer, and the wealth of the middle class is going away, the peoples are going to start buying cheaper, more compact cars, or no cars at all. So I asked myself if trucks where actually cheaper than regular cars in the US.
Because, if the peoples are getting poorer and poorer, and the wealth of the middle class is going away, the peoples are going to start buying cheaper, more compact cars, or no cars at all. So I asked myself if trucks where actually cheaper than regular cars in the US.
12-06-18, 12:15 PM
#28
Lexus Fanatic
Absolutely not cheaper! This is a good point, though. When (not if) we have a downturn in the economy and credit is tightened up, these trucks and SUVs, in theory, will see a slow in sales. Many people feel secure with the current state of the economy so they will splurge and finance the more expensive truck/SUV. This is the same thing we saw through the early-to-mid 2000s before the economy tanked. Auto sales slowed in general after the crash, but I think this paved the way for value brands like Kia and Hyundai to gain some market share. People were looking for the best bang for their buck.
12-06-18, 12:18 PM
#29
Lexus Champion
And Toyota has already converted one assembly line, in Cambridge, Ontario, to build the RAV4 crossover; that line previously built the Corolla. Toyota made the decision to convert the line 3 years ago, as it saw the demand for crossovers increasing.
12-06-18, 01:06 PM
#30
Dysfunctional Veteran
Thread Starter
For me, depreciation isn't as big of a deal as it is to most people. I prefer to keep my cars for far longer than it takes for them to bottom out in value. I probably won't sell my $60,000 pickup until its worth about $3,000...if I ever do.