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I've shared this thought before. But i think the latest Mercedes units are a step in the right direction. Hard buttons for quick temp/fan speed changes, menu change, and volume change. Their COMAND dial has gotten better, and then with the newest ones implementing the new thumb pad swiping and push logic, you almost never need to remove hands from the wheel. I'm in my early/mid 30's
Going back to simple intuitive physical buttons and switches for the majority of functions would alleviate all this aggravation and nonsense with these awful touchscreen/mouse setups that improve nothing and just make things needlessly difficult and complicated.
The problem is that it's only the auto designers that don't like having the buttons, and prefer a "cleaner" interior look. Anyone who actually uses the system prefers function over form. Cadillac is guilty of this too with their haptic touch system. CUE and the Lexus mouse are pretty widely panned.
I have a BMW, and although iDrive was initially hated, my '14 system is really easy to use, including some functions that I can perform without even looking.
The problem is that it's only the auto designers that don't like having the buttons, and prefer a "cleaner" interior look.
only, always, never are rarely true... i don't need or want oceans of buttons. my touchscreen is great, but i still have a load of buttons, including 22 on the steering wheel (16 front and 6 on back).
The problem is that it's only the auto designers that don't like having the buttons, and prefer a "cleaner" interior look. Anyone who actually uses the system prefers function over form. Cadillac is guilty of this too with their haptic touch system. CUE and the Lexus mouse are pretty widely panned.
I have a BMW, and although iDrive was initially hated, my '14 system is really easy to use, including some functions that I can perform without even looking.
Exactly, touchscreens also save money over high quality buttons and switches so they try to cram as many features on the touchscreen. I don't understand "cleaner" interior look, I just think the interiors look dull, boring, low end, and barren when they take away all or most of the buttons, it is not like they put anything interesting in place of the buttons, it is just mainly more cheap plastic and big screens which just looks like a cheap tablets glued to the dash. Owners keep complaining yet automakers are slow to listen or want to change. I read a article where Bob Lutz hates them and he hears about owners complaining about them all the time but said it is difficult for automakers refuse to change course when they think something is so great and the "future".
The remote is brutal. End of story. My parents can’t even hard press a air conditioning button to turn off the AC. I have read the new touch pad is even worse. Almost every review I have read confirms this.
Their Limited 4Runner with hard buttons and a touch screen is worlds better in every livable way.
Dry fingers won't work well with touch screens. I have to wet my finger tip when I use it. Or try stylo.
There has to be some happy balance, I believe, and we are not there yet. Putting everything on a touchscreen, like Tesla does on the Model 3, does not work well, but neither does putting everything on look-alike, chiclet-sized buttons.
With the slippery touchscreen, it can be very difficult to aim the finger on an on-screen image of a button, and then there is no mechanical feedback to tell you that you successfully pressed the button.
I too would prefer mechanical buttons and dials, but with the sea of chiclet buttons, it can be very difficult to find the specific button you want. The HVAC controls in my ES, for example, use chiclet buttons and it takes a moment with eyes off the road every time I want to turn on the front or rear defrosters (the buttons are small, look alike and are next to each other). Dials -- even small ones -- would be better for the HVAC controls I believe, but then, I guess it would not look "high tech".
Most automakers did a good job of separating buttons for different features, I had no issues with Honda's or Acura's and I liked their setups even with a lot of buttons. Touch screens and menus are flat out dangerous when you are taking your eyes off the road too long, don't know if what you tapped registered, and trying to figure it out in a moving vehicle, they are annoying too. A button is simple and intuitive and I think if they are done properly make interiors look much nicer and higher end. When I was growing up the interiors with hardly any buttons that were "less cluttered" like that awful Tesla 3 were from cheap cars with no features, the interiors with a lot of buttons like Bentley's, Mercedes, Lexus, Aston Martin, or BMW's were from the high end cars you wanted that had a lot of features.
only, always, never are rarely true... i don't need or want oceans of buttons. my touchscreen is great, but i still have a load of buttons, including 22 on the steering wheel (16 front and 6 on back).
Somewhere between a sea of buttons and none lies a happy medium that can work for 95% of drivers.
only, always, never are rarely true... i don't need or want oceans of buttons. my touchscreen is great, but i still have a load of buttons, including 22 on the steering wheel (16 front and 6 on back).
The main problem with having everything on the touchscreen, though, is that you are likely, on bumpy roads, for your fingertips to either hit the wrong icon, and either delete something you wanted, or turn on/adjust something you didn't want. Now, where you live, in Florida, with that warm climate and (usually) glass-smooth roads that don't get torn up by salt and/or freeze-thaw cycles, fine.....you probably won't have much of an issue with that. But try that on winter roads in Michigan, which can often look like the surface the moon, and it might be a different story.
Last edited by mmarshall; Feb 9, 2018 at 06:45 PM.
Remote Touch was revised for MY16. It has 'Enter' buttons on the sides now as well as a dedicated return function. You can go into MENU SETUP GENERAL and scroll down to FEEDBACK FORCE on your parents 2015 and set it all the way to the right '+', which will help give the remote more feedback so it doesn't jump around as much. It is an annoyance there is no AC button, but if they want to turn the AC on all they have to do is press AUTO then knock the fan down. Now if they want to turn it off, then yes they must go into the Menu.
For Remote Touch Interface (RTI) aka touch pad, the new one in the 2018 NX, LC, LS, and RC is 100x better than the 2017 NX and RC first version. Not even close. 2015-2017 ones were garbage.
I am aware that the Lexus added Enter. However, just a simple 1,2,3,4,5,6 radio presets that are absent is another thing my parents hate. Never in 30 years prior have I heard them ***** about radio presets. The base ES had the radio presets as well as the AC button.
I what Genesis is offering with the either/or option could be viable. With Lexus, perhaps not offer touch but just make the redundant buttons available.
I am aware that the Lexus added Enter. However, just a simple 1,2,3,4,5,6 radio presets that are absent is another thing my parents hate. Never in 30 years prior have I heard them ***** about radio presets. The base ES had the radio presets as well as the AC button.
I what Genesis is offering with the either/or option could be viable. With Lexus, perhaps not offer touch but just make the redundant buttons available.
With the presets on a new Lexus system. When you press RADIO, there are six pages, six presets per page. Program the stations you want (doesn't have to be all 36 of them) and can be a mix of AM, FM, and SAT. Once they are programmed all they have to do is press the up or down arrow on the steering wheel to get to the station they want. Yes the base models had them prior to 2013 redesign. Now even without navigation they still come with a screen and joystick (which works better than remote touch IMO). I agree it can be flustering.
I am aware that the Lexus added Enter. However, just a simple 1,2,3,4,5,6 radio presets that are absent is another thing my parents hate. Never in 30 years prior have I heard them ***** about radio presets. The base ES had the radio presets as well as the AC button.
I what Genesis is offering with the either/or option could be viable. With Lexus, perhaps not offer touch but just make the redundant buttons available.
In my 4GS & 3.5IS, pressing the Up/Down rocker on the left hand steering wheel spoke scrolls through the Preset Channels 1 to 6.
There is also a Mode button adjacent to switch between: AM/FM1/FM2/DAB/DVD/USB etc etc.
Plus a rocker for Up/Down volume.
Holding the Mode button down switches the hi-fi system off.
Pretty good ergonomics to me.
However, the Up/Down temperature rocker in my 4GS must be seen to be used, compared to big left and right temperature dials.
While my wife's Up/Down touch sensitive temperature slide in her 3.5IS must really be visualized to use.
With the presets on a new Lexus system. When you press RADIO, there are six pages, six presets per page. Program the stations you want (doesn't have to be all 36 of them) and can be a mix of AM, FM, and SAT. Once they are programmed all they have to do is press the up or down arrow on the steering wheel to get to the station they want. Yes the base models had them prior to 2013 redesign. Now even without navigation they still come with a screen and joystick (which works better than remote touch IMO).
Yes that is indeed the case. But on their 4Runner or even my Corolla it’s just one touch of any of the 36 radio presets. Both my car and their 4Runner also have the steering wheel up/down as well.
My point, it does not have to be so difficult. You can go from #1 to #6 just like that on my car, even quicker to move to from #1 to #36. Not so on a remote touch. It’s a two step process.
BMW does it well. Has the presets as well as the iremote
