Just as a rebuttal to the wagons thread, I will say I do love riding higher in dense traffic. I love my basic 2004 Tacoma, reg cab, 2wd, 5 speed in urban traffic. I mainly love how you ride a bit higher(this is the highest riding vehicle I've ever had) and can see above some cars. Yet its small, agile, shift it to the right gear and you can cut off that stupid **** trying to jump in front of you. Until I had this bit higher riding truck, I've had nothing but sports cars and a couple of lower, wider, longer type of RWD Cadillac sedans.

Anyways, I've decided to keep my 04 Tacoma for driver duties, put a bunch of sound insulation in it, replace the beat up front and rear bumpers, drive it till the wheels fall off it. Screw those mainstream automotive magazines that praise handling, you don't really need it when your commute is completely straight interstate, with half of it having ****ing bomb craters in the interstate.

 

No, I don't, I would ideally be riding in the back with tinted windows in one of those A8L types or S550s....if driving, then one of those cars as they're not bad to drive either...next choice would be in a manual sports car, constant clutching does not bother me. Actually, way back in 2005 at a Lexus event, I said to myself this LS430 that nobody was interested in driving, I bet this is a great car to be stuck in traffic with, and 11 yrs. later, I found it to be true....

 

I've had my F-150 4x4 for almost 2 months now and I LOVE the seating position.

 

I don't like riding high or the seating position of SUV's at all, I like moving the seat further away from the steering wheel and reclining it further then most drivers. I don't like the feel of trucks or SUV's either especially when taking corners. I am shocked some people in those vehicles take corners so fast, faster then I do in a sedan because they just don't feel very stable when I drive them and take corners. Seeing some rollovers from SUV's and trucks has convinced me further I like lower sedans and coupes.

 

that's pretty much how every SUV owner thinks.

 

In general, I couldn't agree more. Sometimes those magazines do live in La-La-Land. But, in all fairness, several of those enthusiast-magazines also have their editorial headquarters in Ann Arbor, MI...a state that has what are arguably the worst-cratered roads in the country.

 

I don't get high, and getting high in traffic would be really bad.

ok seriously now, I do miss the high seating position of the Land Rover lr3. I liked being able to see what's happening further ahead in traffic. It's easier than trying to look through the windows of the cars in front of you. I spent over 40 years in Michigan, and the roads are the worst of all the states I've lived in by far.

 

 

Some of the worst drivers in Canada are in fact, CUV and SUV drivers. The reason is that they still think they're in the 19th century running some sort of gigantic battle wagon. Yes sitting higher helps you, but it often tells you, you're better than the peasantry. Because you don't know how to observe carefully and look through windshields and constantly scan traffic in front of you and to the side - you resort to driving a gigantic big tank to overwhelm everybody around you. And then you get to ignore the people you just p****d off.

The usual suspects I've encountered: Jeep GC driver ignoring a yield sign merging right in front of me. Pickup truck drivers with aggressive torque laden engines cutting in front or tailgating over the speed limits. I don't feel sorry for anyone who rolls their vehicle and ends up on their roof. Darwin eliminates the stupid amongst us quickly.

 

Unfortunately innocent people get caught up in the mess.

Also the follow up question should be, do you like turning over in a traffic accident?

 

Now that you put it that way, riding in my lowly 4 door sedan, I have often felt less than first class driving to the farm to buy yellow peas that my wife will make into a soup on the weekends. She will often ask if I were able to bring home any meat this time, but I tell her that we just can't afford the flavorful turkey neck bones that grandma's recipe calls for, but someday when things are better we'll buy them along with one of those all wheel drive SUVs.... I can just see the wallpaper peeling off the kitchen walls from all the steam

 

statistically that's not surprising since with trucks they make up the majority of what's on the road.

 

has to be goldilocks then... just right.

 

You are crazy. I have a lot of seat time in the 2nd gen Avalon(same chassis as your 2002 Camry), but that car was longer, wider, taller, heavier, and a lot more nose heavy if your Camry had the 4 cylinder(Avalon had the V6 standard). Never once have I EVER felt like that Avalon's handling was unsafe or unsecure, there was no possible way to roll that car unless you hit the ditch. Granted if you pushed it, it would under-steer like a pig, but IMO that's pretty safe handling for people that don't know how to drive, lift off the throttle and the car will tuck into the corner where you are pointing it.

As for modern SUV's/CUV's, they are just so much better in terms of handling compared to what we were driving in the 70's/80'/s90's, those old 90's Explorers, S-10 Blazers, FJ40 Land Cruisers, K5 Blazers, Broncos, Suzuki Samurai, Isuzu Troopers, Mark I Range Rovers, old full size vans(Dodge, Ford, Chevy, take your pick). All those old trucks had wooly, completely numb steering, you had to steer them to keep them pointing straight. You drove them in a sane manner, because if you tried to push the handling limits, you were either in the wrong lane, in the ditch, sliding out of the seat, spinning, up on two wheels, rolling the truck, or a combination there-of.

Handling is the main reason all these new SUV's are selling so damn well IMO. They've finally cracked the nut in how to make your car sit higher but still drive/handle like a normal sedan that sits a lot lower. Granted if you push any of these new crossover SUV's around a bend at a quick pace, then drive the same sedan its based on, you will notice a big difference. However, nobody drives like this, almost nobody pushes the handling limits of their car on a public road anymore. Driving below 5/10ths of the limit, a modern SUV drives about the same as a lower riding sedan. As mentioned earlier, that wasn't always the case. So if your modern SUV drives/handles/accelerates/stops just as well as that old sedan you have been driving, but has a lot more room, higher seating position to where you can see out, well you can see why SUV/CUV sales have skyrocketed.

 

Having spent some time in the current generation Suburban, if drove like 1992, with the exceptions of getting 24 mpg on the highway (impressive as a GMC we used 2 generations prior got around 15-16 highway), and had modern electronics. But it drove like ****. Sitting where it sits imho is a detriment.