Most of the consumers, from people who know about car alot to an average joe, seem to consider Lexus as a tier 1 luxury brand along with the Germans (Mercedes, BMW, and Audi).
I do not quite get why.
Sure, Lexus makes expansive performance oriented RWDs as well but they do not really take up that large proportion of Lexus sales. In fact, Lexus' best sellers are the ones who mainly competes against brands like Acura and Lincoln.
Most of the Lexus' sales comes from NX, RX, and ES which are FWD vehicles that are based on Toyota cars and are cheaper than its other luxury competitors.
That is exactly the reason why, I believe, that brands like Acura and Lincoln are considered as a low tier luxury brand. I found it pretty interesting because Acura and Lincoln are struggling to have even a decent brand value while Lexus is not... Even though Lexus is basically doing the same thing as Acura, Lincoln, and etc... with its best sellers, Lexus is considered differently.

What do you guys think about this?

 

IMO, the reason Lexus is in the top 3 is because of the LS flagship, Acura, Lincoln, ect have nothing to compete with the S class and 7 series segment. The RL does not cut it not even close and same with the new Continental. They will always be tier B.

 

top 4 if you include audi.

 

Lexus is a high end luxury brand. Tier 1 or Tier 2 who really cares. What Lexus does very well is that they offer cars and cross overs right in the sweet spot between premium and higher end luxury. Most people or families are thrilled that they can afford a $40K ES or a perhaps a $50K RX. But at the same time, most of these people can't afford A GS or a LS , GX or even a LX. And forget about a LC. Add in things like good reliability, average or low cost maintenance, an somewhat easygoing dealer experience and people flock to the brand.

Another thing is that Lexus and Acura get a lot of respect in that the parent company is either Toyota or Honda. Both of those brands are world recognized and are among some of the most valuable brands in the world. The parent companies go hand in hand, if Toyota were to falter, Lexus would as well.

Compare Lexus or Acura to Cadillac and you will see a very muddied experience. Lincoln IMO is better than Cadillac,

Compare Lexus to Mercedes or BMW. MB is a full on luxury brand that generally speaking does not cater to the ES or RX type of owner. Same thing with BMW.

Finally, what people completely forget is that before Lexus and in the early days of Lexus, Toyota always had some somewhat premium models. Toyota Supra and Celica, Land Cruiser and RWD Cressida models were all a cut above the generic Camry or Corolla. In other words, people would pay more for a high end Toyota and this is where the idea of Lexus pretty much was born.

On the Forbes list of most powerful brands, Apple is #9, Toyota is #10, GM #40, BMW #54, and Ford is #64.

 

Brand value / brand equity is a value that marketing companies have quantified: If we could put a dollar-value to a brand, how much would it be worth? It is a measure of how recognizable and how well-liked a brand is.

In this Forbes ranking, it is no surprise that Apple and Google top the list; in older rankings, Coca-Cola consistently topped the list.

If we narrow the list down to automotive brands, Toyota (consistently) comes out at the top, followed by Mercedes-Benz and BMW. This should be no surprise, as Mercedes-Benz and BMW are old, extremely well-known automotive brands that have a linear, predictable history of producing consistently recognizable product.

The other automotive brands in the Top 11 of the automotive list should come as no surprise either; the exceptions are the absence of Volkswagen (perhaps due to the diesel scandal) and the presence of Lexus (the only non-European and non-German brand), the fifth premium brand behind Mercedes-Benz, BMW, Audi and Porsche (much older brands Bentley and Rolls-Royce, and Lincoln and Cadillac are not on the list).

Source: Forbes

#1 Apple $170 Billion Technology
#2 Google $101.8 Billion Technology
#3 Microsoft $87 Billion Technology
#4 Facebook $73.5 Billion Technology
#5 Coca-Cola $56.4 Billion Beverages
#8 Toyota $41.1 Billion Automotive
#17 Mercedes-Benz $29.2 Billion Automotive
#21 BMW $28.7 Billion Automotive
#26 Honda $24 Billion Automotive
#37 Audi $14.1 Billion Automotive
#39 Ford $13.8 Billion Automotive
#57 Chevrolet $10.3 Billion Automotive
#60 Porsche $9.6 Billion Automotive
#64 Lexus $9.1 Billion Automotive
#67 Nissan $9 Billion Automotive
#68 Hyundai $8.9 Billion Automotive

And the OP recognizes and gives a reason for the presence of Lexus, a young (compared to the German 4 luxury brands) up-start. It has become a well-known, well-liked brand that has become known for producing consistently good, consistently recognizable product. That is what matters.

I would suggest that Lexus' brand value may actually increase in the next few years as old product is replaced with new product.

 

This list takes earnings into consideration. I'm not sure that's what op meant, meaning perhaps he meant value in a figurative, not literal sense.that's why toyota is so high up on the list.

 

Welcome to CL and to Car Chat, BrokenCar, as a new poster.

To directly address your question, from my point of view, when it comes to rating upmarket and luxury-class vehicles, I myself don't care for the Tier-system at all, though it is obvious that the average Rolls or Bentley costs far more than most other vehicles in the luxury-class, with some ultra-high-level Mercedes products excepted. As far as I'm concerned, there are basically three classes of vehicles...entry-level/economy, mainstream/bread-and-butter, and luxury/upmarket....with the possible exception of Rolls/Bentley, I don't agree with separate Tier-ratings within the luxury-class. Notice I said vehicles themselves, rather than vehicle-brands. That's because a number of manufacturers, particularly Ford, Chevrolet, Toyota, and Hyundai/Kia make a very wide range of vehicles spanning everything from bare entry-level (Fiesta, Spark, Rio/Accent) all way up to the Kia K900, which is clearly in the luxury-sedan class despite the Kia nameplate. Complicating things, though, with Kia and Hyundai, has been the new luxury-class Genesis nameplate.

 

Yeah, I should have said "brand reputation" not brand value.
It seems like ppl are thinking I am wondering about how big and worthy Lexus (Toyota) is as a company.
I was rather asking about how Lexus is perceived by the general crowd.

 

I saw the KIA K900 the other day while out and about. Total unicorn of a vehicle. At first I thought it was an updated version of the KIA Optima, although when I drove past it I realized it wasn't and then immediately thought, "Who the hell buys a K900?" It's not that the car is bad, it's that KIA has a long way to go in building brand identity and respect with regard to building quasi-luxury vehicles. This is why we see so few of the K900 on the road today.

 

How is Lexus perceived by the general crowd, people who are not necessarily enthusiasts (in other words, people who would never think about joining a forum such as Club Lexus)? It is perceived very, very highly.

When my colleagues at a former employer noticed that I drove a Lexus, they were very, very impressed. They all complimented me on my car. It did not matter that my car is only an entry-level, Camry-platform ES, nor did it matter that it is a hybrid (think Prius), they all looked past the model name and saw only the big L on the grille: "You drive a Lexus? Wow!".

Only "car enthusiasts" look down on Lexus as nothing more than dressed-up Toyotas.

 

You see so few of them because few people actually go look at one. Have you test-driven one? I did a full-review on a K900 when it first debuted.

 

I agree with this post. Most people consider Lexus = Luxury = Expensive. Very few people know whether it has an I-4, FWD based but they ALL know it is a Lexus and it's ALWAYS quiet, luxury inside and expensive.

Most Enthusiasts praise German Big-3 but do you know how many Entry-Level vehicles they sell? I don't see that many S-Class, 7-Series, A7/8 or S7/S8 on the road but most I see are 2-3 series, C/E classes, A3/A6 (not many neither).

 

I'd argue that it's harder than ever to say MB, BMW and arguably Audi stand alone as the top tier "attainable"' premium brands, as each has to one extent or another taken their range more downmarket than upmarket in recent years. I personally consider Lexus to be in the same sphere as the German Big2/Big3 as they offer a very solid blend of premium product and a premium buying and ownership experience. I've owned most of the premium brands and Lexus has, in my judgment, probably the best overall package. Lexus customers are treated very well, I've generally had a pre and post purchase experience that's easily on par and usually better than with the German top tier. There's no question that the product is of a comparably high standard and quality.

Maybe it's the familial connection to Toyota that clouds the judgement of some in relation to Lexus' place on the brand totem pole. If so, it's pretty ironic as it's this very familial connection to Toyota that drove/enabled Lexus to become what it did.

 

The Toyota connection to Lexus helps Lexus more than it hurts them. People tend to forget that Mercedes Benz is not just a "luxury brand" in Europe. Mercedes is every day brand that appeals to all types of buyers in Europe. The next generation of Lexus vehicles appear to be separating themselves from Toyota than in the past.

 

One thing not mentioned here is the dealership experience. I have been to just about every type of dealership make, and none seem to have the same standard as Lexus. They are in a league of their own with how they treat their customers, how they fix and service cars, and how they leave the condition of the vehicle when done. And even after nine years of Lexus ownership, I am still getting loaner cars, freebies, and the red carpet treatment when I take mine in. I think this nationwide customer service treatment has set a standard not often matched.