Sulu

Did the Big 3 American automakers -- GM, Ford and Chrysler -- move their headquarters out of the Greater Detroit area?

davyjordi

cadillac moved its headquarters to nyc, but i'm pretty sure the umbrella-group makers you mentioned stayed.

mmarshall

Although not all of Ford itself, the old Lincoln-Mercury Division (before Mercury was discontinued) moved out of Detroit a number of years ago, and relocated in Southern California.

http://www.nytimes.com/1998/01/23/bu...alifornia.html

VW of America's national HQ is just a few miles from my house.....in Herndon, VA, outside of D.C. And a number of other foreign-branded automakers (though not of the Big Three) also have their American HQ in SoCal or scattered across Southern states.

Since a large portion of Chrysler was taken over by Fiat (and, earlier, by Daimler-Mercedes), it has been debated whether it is even considered one of the American Big Three any more...indeed, I've seen some references to the Big Two. I haven't taken a formal position on that (and will not so so here) as it is an interesting point and can be interpreted either way.

mmarshall

Agreed that the city's blight may be improving since its low point (entire neighborhoods in ruins, Mayor being sent off to prison, etc...). But my point is that the industry is no longer centered there to the extent that it was 30-40 years ago (or even 20 years ago)....many plants have moved south or west. And the current sales-king is the So-Cal/L.A. region, with D.C.-Baltimore probably second.

Anyhow, though, you guys are correct on one thing.....Like it or not, the show circuit is what it is, and I guess there isn't much point in arguing that it should be something else. I've just always been a believer that the largest shows should be where the highest sales are....to me, that makes the most business and economic sense. But, if the system concludes otherwise, so be it.

LexBob2

The same thing could apply to many inner city areas, including DC, but it shouldn't completely define the entire metro area.

Something to consider when thinking about new vehicle sales is the population of the largest metro areas in the U.S. Total population translates into new vehicle sales, yes, some areas may sell a higher percentage of upscale brands, and others trucks, domestic brands etc. but the metro areas with the largest populations in most cases sell the most cars. The largest metro areas by population, in order are: NYC, LA, Chicago, DFW, Houston, DC-Va-Md. Philadelphia, Miami and Atlanta have nearly the same population as DC-Va-Md..

mmarshall

D.C. and L.A., though (and, to an extent, Atlanta), are different from a number of other major metro-areas in that the suburban sprawl is incredible, and the areas depend heavily on private cars to get around.

Population does not always determine private-vehicle car sales. NYC, for example, has an enormous population, but also enormous subway, bus, and cab-systems to handle it. Many New Yorkers don't even own private cars. Thats's why D.C. and L.A. are drowning in traffic...the culture (and necessity) is basically centered around it.

mmarshall

Anyhow, we were talking about the new S90. Any other comments? Appreciate Steve's noting that the Inscription-level trim is notably better then the Momentum-level (These marketing people come up with some of the darnedest names).

SW17LS

The point is though that Detroit is still the home of the US auto industry, so what's the big deal about a major car show there? There's one in NY too. One in LA. Why shouldn't they have it in Detroit?

Where more cars are sold doesn't mean anything.

TangoRed

Yep. There's also a ton of major suppliers and satellite offices (not USA headquarters) of foreign car makers there too.

Sulu

I know that they have not moved. It was a rhetorical question to prove that Detroit still holds significance, as the (spiritual) centre and capital of the American automotive industry.

mmarshall

OK, fine. Your opinion noted. We can disagree on it.

dseag2

I don't profess to know anything about the financial workings of car shows, but I would imagine they would be held where you could get the largest number of attendees buying tickets, thus subsidizing the cost of the show and generating a profit. If the annual show is a tradition in Detroit, and would consequently attract large numbers, it seems to me it would make sense to continue to have one there.

With that said, I would think that automakers would also want to display in markets that have the highest propensity to buy their cars. Not that people actually transact at the shows, but I have certainly left auto shows with a "short list" of cars I am interested in for my next lease/purchase. That is where buyers in the big metropolitan coastal cities like NY and LA come into play. Heck, Dallas is a great market as well. I believe Plano is one of the cities with the highest per capita income in the country. And since housing is relatively affordable people have lots of money to spend on cars. I believe the Dallas Auto Show does pretty well.

mmarshall

The Detroit show is simply a tradition, more than anything else. Unlike the D.C. show, It is regularly attended by the auto press and many high-level company reps. Motorweek's John Davis is one of the few auto journalists who do regularly attend the D.C. show (I've spoken with him a number of times).

You make some good points here. I agree.

SW17LS

I'm legitimately curious as to why a big car show in Detroit bothers you? Like I said if you want to go to a big industry show NY is a 2.5 hour train ride away. One on the east coast, one on the west...one in Detroit...

You have to look at these big shows as industry trade shows really. They're opened to the public, but the point really is internal to the industry.

mmarshall

Well, if you had read my posts carefully, that wasn't what bothered me. Plenty of big shows happen outside of D.C...I couldn't care less. I just don't think it makes much sense to have the biggest show of all (and most of the newest displays) in Detroit. And, to be fair and impartial,, I'm not saying we should have the largest show in D.C., either......it probably makes more sense to have it in L.A. than D.C. The SoCal area is unquestionably the center of the country's auto culture, and sells the most new cars, even more than we do here in second-place.....and, yes, that's a lot.