LexFather

One thing Tesla got right is styling. The Model S looks amazing no matter if its ICE, hydrogen, electric etc...

If Lexus makes another HS looking vehicle...forget about it....

Vladi

Not surprised there is a big hydrogen push going on. Big motor companies are tied in with major oil companies that strive to provide us "fuel" no matter what it is. I strongly believe that is the reason why we are not seeing pure EVs out of major manufacturers and we probably will see none for quite some time.

In order for "fuel up anywhere" car to win the battle against "pump station fueling only" car we need more EV manufacturers like Tesla.

spwolf

you do realize that major investors in solar and wind power generations are oil companies? So you will not be paying them at the pump but in your house.

I mean SunPower, one of the biggest solar equipment makers in the world is owned by... TOTAL SA.

Hydrogen is created by electricity... Gas Pumps are owned by franchises.

Infra

iTrader: (1)

It's almost as if you propose... some sort of free market.... where consumers can choose the product that best fits their needs... are you crazy?

Infra

iTrader: (1)

Can we please stop with conspiracy theories? They don't even make for good discussion.

Energy powers the economy. Low energy costs are good for everyone. It's one of those rare things that truly provides universal benefit.

Big motor companies simply provide cars that they think people want to buy. There is no conspiracy to force reliance upon oil, because so little oil goes towards fueling consumer vehicles in the first place! This sort of "strong belief" completely defies logic!

A "good" electric car is not an easy thing to do. The Tesla Model S is succeeding not because it's a good car, but because it's a better than than one powered by gasoline. Fisker failed to do this. GM failed to do it in the 90s. Many companies and billions of dollars have been lost chasing this endeavor.

Tesla has had to not only invent a car, but also a means to charge that car at home, on the road, and now exchange the battery pack in less than time it takes to fuel up the car. These are novel ideas that break the mold of traditional thought about how an automobile should function. They escape the groupthink that's plagued other purveyors of electric vehicles, where the only thing changing about the car is the fuel source.

Look at the Chevy Volt. An interesting idea that sacrifices too much of what makes a useful car for what makes a technology study. It's too small for most families. GM thought people cared about not using fuel, but those buying ~40k - 50k vehicles really don't care about gas mileage! They care about comfort and/or sportiness, of which the Volt offered little of either.

New technologies require new business models, and you can see the corpses of companies who've failed to recognize that.

A company exists solely to make money. You can bet (or you probably won't because you believe this conspiracy theory) that as soon as they feel electric cars make money, they'll be first in line to sell you one.

Vladi

There is no conspiracy theory here there is only common sense business. If you were manufacturing and selling something to the consumer and that something requires my product as supplement you and I would be in bed together and in search of how can we profit together even more instead of going against each other. Reason why we still use POS outdated concept known as internal combustion engine that has thousands of moving parts, requires liquids and high maintenance is hundreds of industries are milking off that turd so that is the whole point.

EV is a way to simplification of all those things, hydrogen is not. Hydrogen introduces one more unnecessary step to the equation.

Infra

iTrader: (1)

This would only make sense if automakers refused to use carbon fiber because they are in bed with the steel industry.

Or we should be wary of using EVs because then motors will require rare earth metals which will put them in bed with the mining industry.

An automaker selling a car consumers want stands to make much more money doing THAT than they'd get in kickbacks from big oil. Your theory doesn't even hold water, let alone oil.

I8ABMR

sounds great but how the hell will they fuel them ?? If its mass produced ( I dont buy it) they where can you go to fill it up?? There is less then 2 years until 2015 and I can only tell you where there is one charging station in my area, let alone a hydrogen pump. Good idea but its going to be a lot longer before they can implement it. I will buy it when I see it happen. It would be great but for 2015 I wouldnt hold my breath

My0gr81

This thread just turned from Toyota / Lexus making a hydrogen powered car to a debate on hydrogen vs gasoline and big oil conspiracy theories.

Whitigir

Hydrogen is the future. There is way to split hydrogen from water with the use of special metal and electric. Then hydrogen goes to fuel cell to create 3-4x time the energy needed to split the hydrogen. Together with solar panel roof, and oxy charged battery....the car will soon run off water, and so efficient

According to the japanese news, the US bought that patent to create hydrogen from water.....i assume Toyota some how tapped into that

pbm317

I don't know why you're definitively saying it will be a Lexus. It specifically said in that link that they're now noncommittal as to which brand it'll be.

RXSF

something this big should either me a Lexus or a Prius

I8ABMR

I only have an issue with how to refuel. Where will an owner go? Will there be options where to refuel? If the car is ready by 2015, is the country ready? Do we have the infrastructure in place that will allow us to allow this to be a viable option?

There are 5200 public EV charging stations, and only 58 hydrogen fueling stations in the United States. Is this practical ?? If the car is ready the market is not.

Vladi

That's ok if you believe that transportation industry and oil companies are unrelated and independent of each other.

My point is hydrogen will make sense once/if they sell you the technology to make hydrogen in your own house or have that process happen inside your instead of going to fuel specific pump stations. That is the sole reason why I prefer EV.

Infra

iTrader: (1)

No, this violates the laws of thermodynamics.

Catalysts lower the activation energy of a chemical reaction. Read all about it right here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catalysis