"Autoline" interview with 2013 Avalon Chief Engineer
Lexus Test Driver
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From: Ontario
Lexus Fanatic
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From: A better place
Toyota needs to learn from Hyundai on making cars with good stance.
On another note, the ALL NEW Camry rear bumper sides flutter at highway speeds.
Just bad design. Toyota is rushing to make changes. The company is not structured to introduce fast changes. and the result is very clear.
On another note, the ALL NEW Camry rear bumper sides flutter at highway speeds.
Just bad design. Toyota is rushing to make changes. The company is not structured to introduce fast changes. and the result is very clear.
There has been NO word about this anywhere else on any car forums, as far as anyone can tell. Here you are, talking about this, and expect us to believe that the Camry has a defective rear bumper at high speeds?
Also please do some more research on Toyota, because what you stated is completely wrong. Toyota, unlike the Koreans, is not rushing anything. Toyota has extended their model cycles for quality reasons.
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From: TX
there is nothing sudden about it... it has been in works for 4-5 years now, as you can see by evolution of styling. Besides what does quality have to do with styling?
i just checked Camry forums, and not many people complaining about anything...
if anything Toyota is still too slow, they have let their models to get really old, there is really nothing fast about redesigns.
i just checked Camry forums, and not many people complaining about anything...
if anything Toyota is still too slow, they have let their models to get really old, there is really nothing fast about redesigns.
Please post actual proof of this or kindly state that this is simply your opinion because otherwise this is inciting and baiting for an argument.
There has been NO word about this anywhere else on any car forums, as far as anyone can tell. Here you are, talking about this, and expect us to believe that the Camry has a defective rear bumper at high speeds?
Also please do some more research on Toyota, because what you stated is completely wrong. Toyota, unlike the Koreans, is not rushing anything. Toyota has extended their model cycles for quality reasons.
There has been NO word about this anywhere else on any car forums, as far as anyone can tell. Here you are, talking about this, and expect us to believe that the Camry has a defective rear bumper at high speeds?
Also please do some more research on Toyota, because what you stated is completely wrong. Toyota, unlike the Koreans, is not rushing anything. Toyota has extended their model cycles for quality reasons.
Frankly speaking one cannot expect an owner to be aware that the rear bumper flutters. How can they?
I saw it number of times. Of course it does not flutter like flapping around. It "flutters" very slightly.
This is not my opinion. I am stating what I saw. Simple.
What has Quality do with design? Seriously?
Design is just design. It has to be translated to structural design that is strong.
BTW, GM was the leader in automotive engineering. Yet it failed. Every aspect has to click together.
I see Toyota waking up to the challenge from its competition. It is good. But it needs some internal organizational changes to translate that correctly.
For example, the current IS250/ outgoing gs350 structure is not nearly as rigid as I would expect a sports car to be. It flexes a lot.
Lexus saw that, understood that and came up with the new GS series that is rigid as one would expect. That is good design and very good work done there.
Last edited by chikoo; Sep 2, 2012 at 09:22 PM.
Lexus Champion
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From: TX
Regarding the ALL NEW 2012 CAMRY Rear Bumper flutter issue:
I will suggest that you follow the car on highway speeds and watch out for the driver side of the bumper. You will clearly see signs of it vibrating/fluttering.
For those who called out on me for vid or fake, I have taken the challenge and for you idiots recorded a video at 80mph. I am just as big an idiot to do it, but what the hell.
I will post it as soon as time permits.
I will suggest that you follow the car on highway speeds and watch out for the driver side of the bumper. You will clearly see signs of it vibrating/fluttering.
For those who called out on me for vid or fake, I have taken the challenge and for you idiots recorded a video at 80mph. I am just as big an idiot to do it, but what the hell.
I will post it as soon as time permits.
Lexus Fanatic
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 20,224
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Regarding the ALL NEW 2012 CAMRY Rear Bumper flutter issue:
I will suggest that you follow the car on highway speeds and watch out for the driver side of the bumper. You will clearly see signs of it vibrating/fluttering.
For those who called out on me for vid or fake, I have taken the challenge and for you idiots recorded a video at 80mph. I am just as big an idiot to do it, but what the hell.
I will post it as soon as time permits.
I will suggest that you follow the car on highway speeds and watch out for the driver side of the bumper. You will clearly see signs of it vibrating/fluttering.
For those who called out on me for vid or fake, I have taken the challenge and for you idiots recorded a video at 80mph. I am just as big an idiot to do it, but what the hell.
I will post it as soon as time permits.
Camry has not been changed for 7 years. To suggest that Toyota updated it too fast is just silly.
As to the quality, all the owners are reporting it a lot better car than before and there are no issues with the car, so I have no idea what are you writing about.
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Regarding the ALL NEW 2012 CAMRY Rear Bumper flutter issue:
I will suggest that you follow the car on highway speeds and watch out for the driver side of the bumper. You will clearly see signs of it vibrating/fluttering.
For those who called out on me for vid or fake, I have taken the challenge and for you idiots recorded a video at 80mph. I am just as big an idiot to do it, but what the hell.
I will post it as soon as time permits.
I will suggest that you follow the car on highway speeds and watch out for the driver side of the bumper. You will clearly see signs of it vibrating/fluttering.
For those who called out on me for vid or fake, I have taken the challenge and for you idiots recorded a video at 80mph. I am just as big an idiot to do it, but what the hell.
I will post it as soon as time permits.
Lexus Champion
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 3,763
Likes: 6
From: TX
As I said before, you are trying to relate styling of the car with quality, it has nothing to do with quality at all.
Camry has not been changed for 7 years. To suggest that Toyota updated it too fast is just silly.
As to the quality, all the owners are reporting it a lot better car than before and there are no issues with the car, so I have no idea what are you writing about.
Camry has not been changed for 7 years. To suggest that Toyota updated it too fast is just silly.
As to the quality, all the owners are reporting it a lot better car than before and there are no issues with the car, so I have no idea what are you writing about.
A modern definition of quality is Juran's "fitness for intended use." This definition basically says that quality is "meeting or exceeding customer expectations."
Designers designed the car using sketch, a clay model or CAD or such software.
However that may be, it finally needs to be ensured that all the structures and panels have the rigidity to stand on it's own, or be able to stand on the support it is provided.
In case of the rear bumper, it is very clear that the rear bumper side is probably(or obviously) too tall and straight with no internal reinforcement that will keep it stable. One simple rib inside the bumper or an external crease will stop this vibration/flutter issue.
I have also sat in the new camry and love it. Doesn't mean I will overlook it's shortcomings or failures.
Last edited by chikoo; Sep 4, 2012 at 08:09 AM.
Lexus Champion
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 3,763
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From: TX
Hey bud..I am assuming a clip was missing. I've seen this happen on many different cars, maybe they got hit in an accident or there was a repair not done right and the bumper flaps. I have seen it many times before and many times you can see that the clip(s) are not in place.
I recorded this video this morning. I claimed what I saw 3 days ago.
I see it everyday.
Obviously, you need a larger sample size ie. more videos to prove what I claim.
I may do it. But don't count on it.
The only other times I have seen such bumper flutter is when rice-boys get ambitious and tack on bumper/fender flares that are not properly supported. Or like you mention, cars that are obviously been hit and the bumper is loose. But new off the lot cars? C'.mon.
Maybe the person on the assembly line that was supposed to put that clip on the bumper got fired
Last edited by chikoo; Sep 4, 2012 at 08:08 AM.
I have seen (in person) what chickoo is describing on Camry SEs. The other models don't seem to have the same issue. It seems like there is too much air bypassing the rear wheel and feeding into the bumper. There is some flexing on the sides of the bumper at higher speeds.
