Next Generation Corolla
07-04-11, 04:52 PM
#121
Lexus Fanatic
Allow me to defend the current-generation Corolla. It is NOT the "will-be-the-death-of-Toyota" car that Internet car reviewers would have you believe.
I made the conscious decision a year ago to trade DOWN from a 2007 Camry LE to a 2010 Corolla LE (note that the Canadian-trimmed Corolla LE is roughly equivalent to the American-trimmed Corolla XLE). I made the decision for 2 main reasons:
1. The Camry was starting to feel too big. With its high beltline and low seating position, it made it difficult (especially for my wife, who is much shorter) to judge the edges of the car, making it seem like a much larger car than it is; and with its heavy steering and initial throttle tip-in hesitation, it drove like a larger and much heavier car. (I really do not like the high-beltline styling of the new Hyundais and Kias. In addition to making it harder to judge the edges of the car, it makes it feel very claustrophobic in the back seat, especially for small children.)
2. With the job situation still uncertain, I wanted a car with lower operating costs.
I expected to be getting much less car -- trading DOWN -- when I got the Corolla, expecting that I would be giving up a Toyota ES for an econobox. While it is obvious that the Corolla was built to a certain price-point, it did surprise me in other ways. Whereas the Camry LE felt like it was built DOWN from a more luxurious car, the Corolla LE felt like it had been built UP from a basic car. It does only have a 4-speed automatic transmission, a torsion-beam rear suspension and rear drum brakes, but...
1. It is a very quiet car. I was surprised to see that Toyota puts a sound-insulation pad under the trunk-lid of the Corolla but Honda does NOT have one inside the Accord's trunk-lid.
2. It has an amazingly refined engine that is so smooth and quiet at idle and cruising that you would barely know it is on. It is also not slow, with more than enough power to get out of its own way. It is also (like all current Toyota engines) very efficient. Even without the latest engine technology like Valvematic and direct injection, it is still very competitive. Just think what a 6-speed automatic transmission or CVT could do!
3. It has a very good ride for an inexpensive compact car; I expected something flinty and choppy but got a nice balance of larger-car ride AND more than enough handling prowess to get out of its own way.
4. It also looks quite good, in my opinion. I believe that the current-generation Camry, Yaris and Corolla look very good, with good proportions and classic looks that will not age quickly. Like the Japanese (as a culture and a people), and Toyota (as a corporation), the styling of Toyotas is very subtle. It takes time to appreciate the detailing of current Toyotas (and Lexus models); creases are not knock-you-over-the-head obvious but are very subtle that show up only under the right lighting conditions. This shows great attention to detail on the part of the designers.
I made the conscious decision a year ago to trade DOWN from a 2007 Camry LE to a 2010 Corolla LE (note that the Canadian-trimmed Corolla LE is roughly equivalent to the American-trimmed Corolla XLE). I made the decision for 2 main reasons:
1. The Camry was starting to feel too big. With its high beltline and low seating position, it made it difficult (especially for my wife, who is much shorter) to judge the edges of the car, making it seem like a much larger car than it is; and with its heavy steering and initial throttle tip-in hesitation, it drove like a larger and much heavier car. (I really do not like the high-beltline styling of the new Hyundais and Kias. In addition to making it harder to judge the edges of the car, it makes it feel very claustrophobic in the back seat, especially for small children.)
2. With the job situation still uncertain, I wanted a car with lower operating costs.
I expected to be getting much less car -- trading DOWN -- when I got the Corolla, expecting that I would be giving up a Toyota ES for an econobox. While it is obvious that the Corolla was built to a certain price-point, it did surprise me in other ways. Whereas the Camry LE felt like it was built DOWN from a more luxurious car, the Corolla LE felt like it had been built UP from a basic car. It does only have a 4-speed automatic transmission, a torsion-beam rear suspension and rear drum brakes, but...
1. It is a very quiet car. I was surprised to see that Toyota puts a sound-insulation pad under the trunk-lid of the Corolla but Honda does NOT have one inside the Accord's trunk-lid.
2. It has an amazingly refined engine that is so smooth and quiet at idle and cruising that you would barely know it is on. It is also not slow, with more than enough power to get out of its own way. It is also (like all current Toyota engines) very efficient. Even without the latest engine technology like Valvematic and direct injection, it is still very competitive. Just think what a 6-speed automatic transmission or CVT could do!
3. It has a very good ride for an inexpensive compact car; I expected something flinty and choppy but got a nice balance of larger-car ride AND more than enough handling prowess to get out of its own way.
4. It also looks quite good, in my opinion. I believe that the current-generation Camry, Yaris and Corolla look very good, with good proportions and classic looks that will not age quickly. Like the Japanese (as a culture and a people), and Toyota (as a corporation), the styling of Toyotas is very subtle. It takes time to appreciate the detailing of current Toyotas (and Lexus models); creases are not knock-you-over-the-head obvious but are very subtle that show up only under the right lighting conditions. This shows great attention to detail on the part of the designers.
07-04-11, 06:32 PM
#122
Lexus Fanatic
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What touches? The outdated 4 speed automatic? Horribly outdated interior?
I like Toyota as much as the next guy, but really? The competition has surpassed Toyota in this segment. The Cruze has a great 1.4T, 6 speed manual, etc. Focus has a dual clutch transmission, Sync, Park assist, plus other toys. The Elantra has direct injection and matches the rest in content (even has rear heated seats.) They all ride better, steer better, are more comfortable, better built...
Judging by current sales numbers, the buying public agree with me. It's basically right at the back of the pack with the POS new Civic (no idea how Honda was able to mess that up)
I like Toyota as much as the next guy, but really? The competition has surpassed Toyota in this segment. The Cruze has a great 1.4T, 6 speed manual, etc. Focus has a dual clutch transmission, Sync, Park assist, plus other toys. The Elantra has direct injection and matches the rest in content (even has rear heated seats.) They all ride better, steer better, are more comfortable, better built...
Judging by current sales numbers, the buying public agree with me. It's basically right at the back of the pack with the POS new Civic (no idea how Honda was able to mess that up)
You already criticized Toyota/Lexus sales in another thread, ignoring the fact that Toyota is still supply limited. That includes the Corolla; it is still supply limited. The Civic, too is supply limited. As disappointing of a redesign as it is, Civic sales will go up, just like Corolla sales will go up.
When and if Hyundai matches Toyota, we'll talk. When the new Corolla comes out, we'll talk. I highly doubt it looks like a Hyundai. If it does copy Hyundai's styling, I will be right there with you bashing Toyota.
07-04-11, 08:52 PM
#123
Lexus Champion
I had a problem with the over-assisted steering (especially at highway speeds) when I first got the car, but now that I have gotten used to it (and not holding the wheel as tightly), it does not present a problem.
07-05-11, 09:21 AM
#124
Pole Position
07-05-11, 10:48 AM
#126
That being said, most of their designs are copies of parts of other vehicles. I dont think they have car that is actually their design, so how can anyone copy them?
07-05-11, 10:49 AM
#127
but in any case, if Toyota continues this 2 year delay to US market, who knows when will you get new Corolla.
In Japan it came out late 2006... which means redesign is coming next year for sure.
In Japan it came out late 2006... which means redesign is coming next year for sure.
07-05-11, 10:52 AM
#128
Lexus Fanatic
i would say the Elantra is entirely theirs.
07-05-11, 12:18 PM
#130
Lexus Test Driver
Not entirely correct, early designs (pony, excel, etc) were mostly licenced (from fiat, but could be wrong). The newer designs are Hyundai, for the most part. What seems to be lacking, is that there is no inovation. All their designs seems to be putting together components of other innovators into an assembly ready package with some sheet metal skin wrapped around it. To make matters worse, even the sheet metal skin has visual cues from their competitors.
07-05-11, 01:53 PM
#131
Lexus Fanatic
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07-05-11, 01:54 PM
#132
Lexus Fanatic
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funny we've got such a huge thread about such a cheap boring car, but i guess it's important given the huge numbers they sell.
07-05-11, 04:28 PM
#133
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I don't think Toyota has its head up its butt anymore like Honda still has it. I was stunned at how bad the new Civic is with the competition currently out. Toyota I assume will not make the same mistake. If the new Yaris is any indication I think it might be great for its job.
A lot of people don't want fishy/melted soap styling. A lot of people just want a reliable, cheap, reliable transport. This is clearly evidenced by the craptastic Jetta, it is selling like no Jetta before it even as its worse, de contented and worst in class. Its cheap and looks safe.
A lot of people don't want fishy/melted soap styling. A lot of people just want a reliable, cheap, reliable transport. This is clearly evidenced by the craptastic Jetta, it is selling like no Jetta before it even as its worse, de contented and worst in class. Its cheap and looks safe.
07-05-11, 04:45 PM
#134
Lexus Fanatic
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07-05-11, 04:53 PM
#135
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