Volkswagen Phaeton may return to U.S.(considers diesel powerplant for U.S.)
01-31-08, 05:23 PM
#1
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Thread Starter
Volkswagen Phaeton may return to U.S.(considers diesel powerplant for U.S.)
Volkswagen Phaeton may return to U.S.
Posted on Thursday 31 January 2008
The Phaeton limo may have been a major flop for Volkswagen but officials are keen to the launch of a successor. The car was priced similarly to BMWs and Audis but it wore a humble VW badge, and there was nothing particularly exciting or innovative about the car either. It had mundane styling, poor dynamics and a much heavier chassis than its Audi A8 cousin, and in the U.S. it only managed 2,814 sales since its launch back in 2003.
No wonder the car was pulled from the market last year. It appears, however, the Phaeton may make a return to the world’s largest car market. Speaking at an Automotive News conference, VW’s U.S. Chief Stefan Jacoby admitted it was a mistake to end Phaeton sales in North America. Jacoby said he still thinks the VW brand is strong enough to include models in both the volume segment and at the luxury end, hinting that the Phaeton could in fact return.
VW won’t be making the same mistakes with the successor as it did with the current model. The new model will be based on Audi’s cost-saving modular platform design strategy and is tipped to be smaller than the current car – positioned somewhere between the A6 and A8 from Audi. The next Phaeton is expected to arrive on the market in 2010, a year after the new A8.
Posted on Thursday 31 January 2008
The Phaeton limo may have been a major flop for Volkswagen but officials are keen to the launch of a successor. The car was priced similarly to BMWs and Audis but it wore a humble VW badge, and there was nothing particularly exciting or innovative about the car either. It had mundane styling, poor dynamics and a much heavier chassis than its Audi A8 cousin, and in the U.S. it only managed 2,814 sales since its launch back in 2003.
No wonder the car was pulled from the market last year. It appears, however, the Phaeton may make a return to the world’s largest car market. Speaking at an Automotive News conference, VW’s U.S. Chief Stefan Jacoby admitted it was a mistake to end Phaeton sales in North America. Jacoby said he still thinks the VW brand is strong enough to include models in both the volume segment and at the luxury end, hinting that the Phaeton could in fact return.
VW won’t be making the same mistakes with the successor as it did with the current model. The new model will be based on Audi’s cost-saving modular platform design strategy and is tipped to be smaller than the current car – positioned somewhere between the A6 and A8 from Audi. The next Phaeton is expected to arrive on the market in 2010, a year after the new A8.
01-31-08, 05:56 PM
#2
Lexus Fanatic
I said a number of times that the W12 model, especially, was a good deal and a bargain. Yes, 90K may sound like a lot of money (and, of course, it is) but similiar V12 models from BMW and Mercedes...the 760/760i and S600......ran well over 100K. The public (at least the relatively small number of 12-cylinder buyers) missed out on a good deal with the last car. But VW marketing didn't help much, either....they simply pulled the car out too early when initial sales didn't meet their expectations.
On a slightly different note, Daihatsu did the same thing in the early 1990's. They briefly entered the American market with two models, the Charade and Rocky, stayed a couple of years, and then panicked and pulled right out again because they weren't up there with Ford and GM.
One of my closest friends at the time was interested in a Rocky and almost bought one. On the day before I was going to go to the dealership with him to check out a new Rocky, inspect/test-drive it for him, make sure it was OK, and do the paperwork, Daihatsu announced its pull-out. So, of course, no new Rocky. That was a close one.
On a slightly different note, Daihatsu did the same thing in the early 1990's. They briefly entered the American market with two models, the Charade and Rocky, stayed a couple of years, and then panicked and pulled right out again because they weren't up there with Ford and GM.
One of my closest friends at the time was interested in a Rocky and almost bought one. On the day before I was going to go to the dealership with him to check out a new Rocky, inspect/test-drive it for him, make sure it was OK, and do the paperwork, Daihatsu announced its pull-out. So, of course, no new Rocky. That was a close one.
Last edited by mmarshall; 01-31-08 at 06:04 PM.
01-31-08, 06:09 PM
#4
Lexus Fanatic
If that is the case, then why are people buying top-line VWs like the Phaeton in Europe? The same luxury automakers you mention above also compete with VW in Europe like they do here....yet VW "prestige" seems to be much more a factor. Could it be that, like I said a number of times, Europeans simply recognize the Phaeton for the outstanding bargain it is?
01-31-08, 06:11 PM
#5
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If that is the case, then why are people buying top-line VWs like the Phaeton in Europe? The same luxury automakers you mention above compete with VW in Europe like they do here....yet VW "prestige" seems to be much more a factor. Could it be that, like I said a number of times, Europeans simply recognize the car for the bargain it is?
VW has more image in Europe as well than here. Yes its a bargain, its also REDUNDANT, especially since the SAME company makes the A8!
Again, its not a bad car but it has worse resale than a Q45
01-31-08, 06:17 PM
#6
Lexus Fanatic
True, but every company needs a top-line flagship of some sort....and Infiniti is probably going to bring back a new flagship to replace the Q45. In fact, we even had a thread and discussion on the best way to do that.
Of course, the question at VW is....how BIG and how EXPENSIVE a flagship do they need? And one answer may have been displayed at both the Detroit and Washington DC auto shows this year with the large, elongated Passat.
Of course, the question at VW is....how BIG and how EXPENSIVE a flagship do they need? And one answer may have been displayed at both the Detroit and Washington DC auto shows this year with the large, elongated Passat.
01-31-08, 06:25 PM
#7
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True, but every company needs a top-line flagship of some sort....and Infiniti is probably going to bring back a new flagship to replace the Q45. In fact, we even had a thread and discussion on the best way to do that.
Of course, the question at VW is....how BIG and how EXPENSIVE a flagship do they need? And one answer may have been displayed at both the Detroit and Washington DC auto shows this year with the large, elongated Passat.
Of course, the question at VW is....how BIG and how EXPENSIVE a flagship do they need? And one answer may have been displayed at both the Detroit and Washington DC auto shows this year with the large, elongated Passat.
Infiniti, we are not even sure how many M45s they sell as they don't break up sales figures. History has shown their price ceiling with consumers is around 50k. Who wants to be associated with a discontinued product??
Look at Jaguar. The XJ is tremendous, light, decent power, classy looks and good features. Jaguar as a brand is lackluster until recently, thus it hurts flagship sales.
Today, Lexus broke the 100k barrier with success. It took them 18 long years with precise planning and incredible execution.
If Lexus tried to sell a 100k LS back in 2001, the market might not have been ready for it. Lexus has continued to build a BRAND people want and can be proud of. People want to be associated with the brand and buy the LS (which outsells most the competition at least 3 to one) b/c it is the ESSENCE of the brand.
You pull up in a LS/S/7 it speaks for you.
You pull up in a A8/XJ/Q45/Phaeton, you have to speak and explain it.
That is the sad, brutal truth not just here, but in Europe, Asia, Russia and around the world (flip flop the LS/A8 in Europe though
).
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01-31-08, 06:32 PM
#8
Lexus Fanatic
01-31-08, 06:39 PM
#9
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01-31-08, 06:51 PM
#10
only a select few. a few people bought the V10 TDI which surprised me and that thing costs a bloody fortune.
01-31-08, 06:59 PM
#12
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Thread Starter
The new model will be based on Audi’s cost-saving modular platform design strategy and is tipped to be smaller than the current car – positioned somewhere between the A6 and A8 from Audi
01-31-08, 07:00 PM
#13
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VW battles Benz
Audi battles BMW
We have seen VW get more luxurious and Audi get sportier in recent year.
Also, the Phaeton shares its platform with the Bentley Continental, so that saves on cost.
01-31-08, 10:29 PM
#15
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Don't forget, though that this "100K" is a moving target - $100K 18 years ago is guite a different wad of cash than today, if you take then vs. today purchasing power into account.