Oh Lawd, would the two of you please move on. You both agreed to disagree, yet continue to take pot shots. Can we get this back on track please? Thanks.

 

Freakin hell. Platform sharing is NOT rebadging!! In that case, 9 years ago, Volkswagen was selling 4 types of Golfs - The Golf, Beetle, Jetta and Passat (they were all on the same platform. Now they have their own).

And btw, Infiniti and Acura (until recently) are US only brands ok? Everywhere else in the world, they're known as Nissans and Hondas.

Toyota on the other hand has Lexus as a worldwide brand except in its own country (IOW, the opposite of Nissan and Honda).


Tell me, why should I buy a Corolla if I can buy an "Acura" for the same price? (In case you forgot, we get the CSX.. aka an Acura Civic). You can't possibly tell me that's not major overlapping. Until the price hike in 2007, the lowest Acura has always overlapped the Camry and Corolla.


Or how 'bout now. Accord EX-L V6 vs. TSX.

 

Yeah that I knew lol. When the LX470 came out, our Land Cruiser was toast.


I thought I heard rumours that the LC will be phased out in the US. I guess not

 

What is your point? I never even mentioned Infiniti and Acura. How does a conversation about the Toyota Crown lead into a discussion about Infiniti/Honda anyway?


Again, I don't see where you're going with this. I am fully acknowledging Lexus as a worldwide brand, which is part of my point. It is a separate brand from the Toyota brand, so why couldn't Toyota do its own thing and offer more product in its lineup? For example, they currently do not have a full size sedan equipped with a V8 engine. So if Chrysler can offer a full size sedan without it being considered a "luxury car", why can't Toyota compete in that market and do the same thing?

I guess I just don't see the overlap thing like the rest of you do. You all seem to continue to look at Lexus as an "upscale Toyota" when you really should give it the respect as being its own entity. To suggest that adding a few models above the current most expensive Toyota models to the lineup is somehow "overlapping", kinda confirms what some skeptics say about the Lexus line in the first place - that they're nothing more than "overpriced Toyotas".

 

Boy, read up. First
This guy needs to change his handle to "lurkdontpost"

This is a rebadge.



This is platform sharing



YOU DO NOT LEARN
The LS 400 was the LS 400/430 everywhere BUT in Japan.
The GS 300/400 was a GS 300/400 everywhere BUT in Japan.(There was no 2JZ TT in American and no V-8 Aristo in Japan)
The IS 200/300 was a IS 200/330 everywhere BUT in Japan.

Its the TOTAL OPPOSITE of what Acura and Infiniti does. I fail to understand how this concept cannot be understood.

Again, I SAID PREDICTION about 400hp in the GS 460. I WAS WRONG.

https://www.clublexus.com/forums/sho...ght=horsepower


Didn't you say you were through posting here????

 

Just a really small clarification. Acura is not just a US brand. It is actually a North American brand since Canada also uses the Acura name. Also, Internationally as well, I know at least Hong Kong uses the Acura name as well.

 

Don't call me boy or I might end up calling you something you don't like as well. Of course, that might result in me getting banned, since you're such a super-duper moderator here. It's ok though, I think I'll take the high road instead


Wow. just wow.


Regardless, they were rebadged Toyotas. I don't care how many other countries they were knows as Lexus. Same car - two different badges. The number of countries that they were known as Toyota models vs. Lexus models are irrelevant.

Honestly, I really don't even care how many Toyota cars are/were rebadged as Lexus and vice-versa. You brought up rebadged Nissans in an attempt to try to explain why Toyota won't bring the Crown to the US. Who even suggested they would rebadge it as a Lexus anyway? (although IMO, it would make a better GS than what we currently have, but that's another topic).

Yes, I know.


Why? would you like me to stop posting?

 

Your two's posts are just so interesting to read...
anyway, back to the topic, Crown, IMO, are supposed to sell here as a Lexus!
It is very much up to Lexus standard, and looks so good!!
if they bring it to US, please put a V8 in it!!!

 

lol, sharing platform means rebadging, that's going to be one of the biggest jokes i have heard. the rx and es (and camry) share the same platform, the rx is a rebadge of the camry. anyway, that topic is old.

back to the original topic, you can't really compare the japanese market to the US market. cultures, the way people see money, cars, and the need for transportation, markets, etc... are so different. you can only talk about regions by regions.

here in the US, selling a toyota over 40k isn't easy. like some said that's exactly the reason for lexus brand from yrs ago. toyota saw the need of that back then, AND NOW, AND IN THE FUTURE. the toyota brand here in the US can never ever take on the luxury brands like bmw or mb or audi. it's way too much of an uphill fight.

in japan it's completely different, where toyota has been so established since decades ago. in japan driving a toyota doesn't mean you are "cheap", no one would ever think that way. that's why they could put the aristo, celsior, widom, harrier, and soarer all under toyota and they sell just damn fine.

in fact, now with the whole lexus brand in japan with all these luxury cars, while at the same time there are the other super nice toyotas like the crown and the majester, i personally would love to see how lexus japan can really pull it out itself as both a brand and its market.

what's in japan, leave it there. you can't apply that to here like that. toyota / lexus are smarter than that, even back in 1980s when they decided to put so much money to build up a whole new brand

though, on the side notes, i do wish toyota can bring in those nice cars. personally i have no problem buying them whoever goes say it's just a toyota, can't be nice, and it's a toyota after all? i feel really sorry for them

 

No, the RX & ES are not rebadged Camrys. They simply share the exact same platform as an 18k car. Nothing wrong with that I suppose


Agreed, they probably could never compete with BMW, MB, & Audi. But I think they could potentially compete with Buick, Lincoln, Volvo, & Saab. I'm not suggesting Toyota go head-to-head with Lexus. But perhaps move more upmarket and offer more high end models, maybe tapping out at about $45k.


Well, they're doing it. Different cultures and all that aside, they're still coexisting with each other. The US is a different market completely, but they still have brand respect here, which can go a long way.

Although unlikely, I hope they do bring the Crown over. It would be very interesting to see how well it could do here. I think the sales numbers might surprise a few people.

 

What the deuce happened up in here??

My quick $.02 is that even if Toyota brought over the Crown, it would not be the equivalent of what Acura did: they sold a relatively cheap car (Integra) in their luxury lineup which brought down their image. It would be more like people cross shopping the Camry XLE V6 w/ the ES 350. I have heard plenty people cross shop them but the ES 350 still sells well.

I am not that familiar w/ the Crown but does the Avalon not basically fill that slot right now anyhow?

Everybody play nice now ...

 

BACK TO TOPIC:

It would theoretically be nice to get the LS600h(L) for cheaper via the Toyota nameplate. However, by doing so, Toyota cheapens the Lexus brand by offering the same car with inferior quality materials and cost-cutting methods.

We've seen it fail with Acura.
We've seen it fail with Jaguar.
We've seen it fail with Mercury.

And I think the Camry and ES350 survive because the Camry is all about cost-savings [especially with the I4 engine], and the ES still does a good job in providing quality [not top-notch quality] materials as an entry-level luxury vehicle. Although the two share platforms, they definately are NOT rebadged, as both exhibit significant differences in quality materials and refinement.

The Camry and ES350 provides something for two different clientele (market populations), whereas some rebadged vehicles do not differentiate the different market populations...

 

Chrysler is considered a luxury marque for Dodge. Look at the pricing options they have versus Dodge. Maybe not Lexus/MB/BMW luxury but still isn't priced low with their Dodge counterparts (Charger/Magnum).

 

The Crown Majesta has a V8 in at as well.

 

ok fine North American

Yeah I know hence "until recently".. I think they also released it in Taiwan and some other Asian country.

Yes, back on topic.


I mean.. if the Crown came with a V8 (I think it only has a V6, no?) how would that compare to the GS? They're both RWD and have similar engines. I think the Crown is a bit bigger.


Or how 'bout this. How does it compare in other Asian countries? We know they have Lexus and I do believe the Crown is also sold there. Anybody living/used to live in those countries have any insight?