I say go for the Infiniti - if you genuinely like it, this could be your only chance to get a decent one since it is no longer made.

 

If you decide and go with the infiniti, keep in mind that your handling will be minivan like

 

No...I disagree. I've driven the I35. While, like most minivans, it is front-wheel-drive, it also has a MUCH lower center of gravity and the front end is lighter. It is essentially a redone version of the Nissan Maxima, which can be considered a borderline FWD sports sedan.

The I35 also has a nice interior and good fit-and-finish. It was designed in the days before Renault and Carlos Ghosn came in and started all the cost-cutting.

( In fact, when I bought my 2001 Lexus IS300, the I35 at the time was one of my top 5 choices ).

 

and personally i think the i30/i35 handing will probably be a bit better than the es300

 

Correct. The I35 is slightly biased towards handling, the ES clearly toward ride comfort.

 

I have driven both like 10 years ago, & I also agree with that assessment

 

What he is stating is why the I30/35 did so poorly in tests, the suspension is the cheap Nissan rear beam, its not independant. They did this to save costs. Its why the 3rd gen 89-94 Maxima is much more loved that the 95-99 Maxima, even though that car is faster.

Who the HELL is worried about the handling of these cars anyway? NONE are sports sedans, I don't care if they are Type-S or T or whatever.

They are nice entry level luxo cars.

Not EVERYONE is worried about slalom times.

Even with that said, AFTER the ES, the I30/35 would be my second choice, its not a bad car at all, it looks good, the interior is nice and roomy.

 

TL Type S is a sports sedan, very much so. It handles better than most BMWs.

 

Well look at the interior pictures. the I35 does have more lines than the es300. The whole package of the ES300 is nice, but it does look plain when compared against the I35, mercedes, etc. Not that it's a bad thing because who knows, some people rather have simplicity.

__________________

1999 Lexus GS400
-Stock

 

You CANNOT be even close to being remotely serious.
1. Its HUGE for its class, as long as the current RL. The 3/IS etc are 15 inches shorter but with just as LONG a wheelbase.
2. Its FWD, that right there lets you know its not possible.
3. It never finished better than 4th in comparions. The "only" 215hp IS 300 beat it in EVERY comparison. The TL-S never came close to beating ANY BMW in ANY comparison.

Have you driven one? Yes, its very swift but far from a sports sedan. Torque steer, you feel the size, not nimble, the 3 runs circles around it.

Adding red badges and 17" wheels does not make a sports sedan.

 

The TL-S steering feels pretty good, but eh, the front end is way too heavy for performance.


I think it's weight distritbution is about 65/35

__________________

1999 Lexus GS400
-Stock

 

Since you are considering an '00-'01 ES300 I have a suggestion thats not on your list. An '02-'03 Camry 4cyl(to avoid the 3.0 V6's sludge issues). The '01 ES300 is 2 generations old now while the '03 Camry is only 1 generation old. You would also be getting a newer car with less mileage(most likely), better fuel economy & just a better car overall(a newer platform). Remember the '01 ES is based on the '97 Camry platform. In addition I personally prefer the styling of the '02-'05 Camry better than every ES300/ 330 except for the current ES which looks great.

 

I30 or ES forget the other 2 , especially the TL! My cousin had that particular year modeland it was plague with transmission problems (3) replaced.

 

Couple of thoughts- My mom and dad have a 00 I30 non-touring with 90k. Only problem was a $1200 repair to something with emissions- don't know all the details. Decent car, except I think it's a little noisy (engine and road) for a luxury auto. My gs430 is quieter with 18's. Also, for a luxury car, it does not have heated seats, which their 99 maxima does- go figure. Maybe the touring model has them. Also, the stereo sucks, again the maxima's is better.

 

the tl-s handles better than most bmw? you gotta be kidding me. bring in any of the bmw, 3, 5, or 7, and they will win over the tl-s on handling. i had the tl-s, it's a decent car with ok handling, but it's far from bmw handling. make a fast 30-35mph right turn on the tl-s and you know what's understeer. do the same on teh 3 or 5 series and you know how simple it is