Motortrend Interview: F vs. //M Engineers Responses
#1
Rookie
Thread Starter
Motortrend Interview: F vs. //M Engineers Responses
http://blogs.motortrend.com/1403_fiv...e_kiinote.html
It seems Yaguchi's answers are more direct and to the point, whereas the VP for the ///M division seem longwinded good read
At this year's Detroit auto show, BMW unveiled the much-anticipated M4, while about 200 feet away, Lexus debuted its radical new RC F. Both are high-performance 400-plus-hp coupes that will go head to head on the street and track in the coming months. I sat down with the two men behind each -- Albert Biermann, vice president of engineering, BMW M, and Yukihiko Yaguchi, deputy chief engineer, Lexus F -- and posed the same five questions. Their answers might surprise you. What car did you benchmark? Biermann: The predecessor, first of all. That was our main benchmark. The target was to make the best M3 ever. Now we call the coupe the M4, but the job was to make the best M3. Yaguchi: No benchmark. I don't care about the competitors. I want to create what I want, which is a really high-performance car offering driving pleasure to anybody, even regular drivers.
Read more: http://blogs.motortrend.com/1403_fiv...#ixzz2wic15HzL
It seems Yaguchi's answers are more direct and to the point, whereas the VP for the ///M division seem longwinded good read
At this year's Detroit auto show, BMW unveiled the much-anticipated M4, while about 200 feet away, Lexus debuted its radical new RC F. Both are high-performance 400-plus-hp coupes that will go head to head on the street and track in the coming months. I sat down with the two men behind each -- Albert Biermann, vice president of engineering, BMW M, and Yukihiko Yaguchi, deputy chief engineer, Lexus F -- and posed the same five questions. Their answers might surprise you. What car did you benchmark? Biermann: The predecessor, first of all. That was our main benchmark. The target was to make the best M3 ever. Now we call the coupe the M4, but the job was to make the best M3. Yaguchi: No benchmark. I don't care about the competitors. I want to create what I want, which is a really high-performance car offering driving pleasure to anybody, even regular drivers.
Read more: http://blogs.motortrend.com/1403_fiv...#ixzz2wic15HzL
#2
The 5 Questions
What car did you benchmark?
Biermann: The predecessor, first of all. That was our main benchmark. The target was to make the best M3 ever. Now we call the coupe the M4, but the job was to make the best M3.
Yaguchi: No benchmark. I don't care about the competitors. I want to create what I want, which is a really high-performance car offering driving pleasure to anybody, even regular drivers.
What is the best high-performance car out there today?
Biermann: That is a hard to answer question because I think we need to cut this in slices for segments, you know? But the best one would be the M1 successor -- if there were a successor.
Yaguchi: Porsche 911.
If you were to give the previous car a 10 on a scale of 1 to 10, with 10 being best, what number would you give the M4/RC F?
Biermann: Oh, that's a tough one. I mean, if it comes to lap times, speeds, overall acceleration, then we would be in a different league than the M1 successor. As a driver's car and driving involvement, it pretty much goes to a 10.
Yaguchi: The Porsche has different axis to measure. The 911 goes this direction and the RC F goes that direction. So, 10 score 911; 10 score RC F. Just different axis.
What are the five things about your car that you'd want people to know?
Biermann: First of all, to go on with the tradition of bringing race car technology onto the road. That's the job of the M3 and the M4. And there's a lot of race car concept in the new car. Then, our completely new engine, where we bring the high-revving aspects of the predecessor's naturally aspirated engine together with the efficiency and the performance of a modern -- very modern -- turbo engine. Then all the focus we put on the car regarding light weight. There's so much technological substance in the new M4, with carbon-fiber technology, like a carbon-fiber driveshaft, carbon-fiber roof. The trunklid inside layer is carbon fiber, so it's lighter, less weight than the predecessor. That's a very important statement. And then, for sure, the precision and the agility of the driving experience. We put a lot of effort into developing everything around the steering system -- the kinematics, the front axle, the rear axle, how they interact, and that was a big focus on the car. Last one is performance on a racetrack. This is not a pretender. Like all the M3s before, this a track car.
Yaguchi: First of all, styling -- the coupe design. And then the engine -- the new engine we're going to introduce. And then the handling, with a really rigid body. Then the fourth: electronic devices, which help not only just professional drivers, but those beginner drivers, who can drive really easily and enjoy. And last, everybody can be smiling when they drive the RC F.
What are your thoughts on the RC F/M4?
Biermann: I need to understand more about the technology [Lexus] put into it. If [RC F] is just another IS F with a big engine, that would not make a competitor to an M3. I can only imagine that, for their customers, [5.0-liter V-8 and eight-speed automatic] is the right way to go. That would definitely not be the right way to go for our customers. We have kind of a race car engine -- the character of our engine is almost like a race car engine. Very precise, although it's a turbo, but it's very responsive and it revs up to 7600 rpm. Very sharp. And it's a car for the track.
Yaguchi: It's kind of typical M product, which means they don't change horsepower quite a lot, but they just reduced the weight to enhance the driving performance—the typical M way. So, that's my observation. At this moment, for Lexus F, we think the non-turbo engine provides the best performance balance and also response. But I don't want to reject any performance engine's potential. If needed, I'm going to certainly study. I want to provide linear torque and power by a naturally aspirated engine.
Biermann: The predecessor, first of all. That was our main benchmark. The target was to make the best M3 ever. Now we call the coupe the M4, but the job was to make the best M3.
Yaguchi: No benchmark. I don't care about the competitors. I want to create what I want, which is a really high-performance car offering driving pleasure to anybody, even regular drivers.
What is the best high-performance car out there today?
Biermann: That is a hard to answer question because I think we need to cut this in slices for segments, you know? But the best one would be the M1 successor -- if there were a successor.
Yaguchi: Porsche 911.
If you were to give the previous car a 10 on a scale of 1 to 10, with 10 being best, what number would you give the M4/RC F?
Biermann: Oh, that's a tough one. I mean, if it comes to lap times, speeds, overall acceleration, then we would be in a different league than the M1 successor. As a driver's car and driving involvement, it pretty much goes to a 10.
Yaguchi: The Porsche has different axis to measure. The 911 goes this direction and the RC F goes that direction. So, 10 score 911; 10 score RC F. Just different axis.
What are the five things about your car that you'd want people to know?
Biermann: First of all, to go on with the tradition of bringing race car technology onto the road. That's the job of the M3 and the M4. And there's a lot of race car concept in the new car. Then, our completely new engine, where we bring the high-revving aspects of the predecessor's naturally aspirated engine together with the efficiency and the performance of a modern -- very modern -- turbo engine. Then all the focus we put on the car regarding light weight. There's so much technological substance in the new M4, with carbon-fiber technology, like a carbon-fiber driveshaft, carbon-fiber roof. The trunklid inside layer is carbon fiber, so it's lighter, less weight than the predecessor. That's a very important statement. And then, for sure, the precision and the agility of the driving experience. We put a lot of effort into developing everything around the steering system -- the kinematics, the front axle, the rear axle, how they interact, and that was a big focus on the car. Last one is performance on a racetrack. This is not a pretender. Like all the M3s before, this a track car.
Yaguchi: First of all, styling -- the coupe design. And then the engine -- the new engine we're going to introduce. And then the handling, with a really rigid body. Then the fourth: electronic devices, which help not only just professional drivers, but those beginner drivers, who can drive really easily and enjoy. And last, everybody can be smiling when they drive the RC F.
What are your thoughts on the RC F/M4?
Biermann: I need to understand more about the technology [Lexus] put into it. If [RC F] is just another IS F with a big engine, that would not make a competitor to an M3. I can only imagine that, for their customers, [5.0-liter V-8 and eight-speed automatic] is the right way to go. That would definitely not be the right way to go for our customers. We have kind of a race car engine -- the character of our engine is almost like a race car engine. Very precise, although it's a turbo, but it's very responsive and it revs up to 7600 rpm. Very sharp. And it's a car for the track.
Yaguchi: It's kind of typical M product, which means they don't change horsepower quite a lot, but they just reduced the weight to enhance the driving performance—the typical M way. So, that's my observation. At this moment, for Lexus F, we think the non-turbo engine provides the best performance balance and also response. But I don't want to reject any performance engine's potential. If needed, I'm going to certainly study. I want to provide linear torque and power by a naturally aspirated engine.
On the other side you have the passionate and modest Yaguchi who gives praise to the 911, explains the RC F is about driving enjoyment (experts and beginners), and he calls out BMW for a "Typical M product" knowing that they don't change the power as much as they work to reduce weight.
Yaguchi +1 Biermann -1
#5
Lexus Test Driver
The M engineer deserves to be smacked in the face with that smug attitude.
He seems to be unaware that the RC-F engine revs nearly as high as the M4 engine, but is naturally aspirated so the torque delivery of the RC-F engine, response and sound at high revs would be infinitely better than the M4 engine.
Calling the non-existent M1 successor the "best car" is like someone calling a unicorn the best horse. Also, M1 was not even one of the best cars in its own times, let alone 30 years after that.
Also, contrary to the claim of that M engineer, a highly tuned version of the RC-F engine is being used for the RC-F GT3 car that produces 108 HP/Liter while the M4 engine is not used for any race car so him downplaying the RC-F engine claiming RC-F engine is not a race engine and the M4 engine is, really shows he has no clue what he is talking about.
I would even go as far as saying, the RC-F engine is far closer to the traditional M motorsport philosophy than the new M4 engine, which is really just a retuned and modified 335i engine.
He seems to be unaware that the RC-F engine revs nearly as high as the M4 engine, but is naturally aspirated so the torque delivery of the RC-F engine, response and sound at high revs would be infinitely better than the M4 engine.
Calling the non-existent M1 successor the "best car" is like someone calling a unicorn the best horse. Also, M1 was not even one of the best cars in its own times, let alone 30 years after that.
Also, contrary to the claim of that M engineer, a highly tuned version of the RC-F engine is being used for the RC-F GT3 car that produces 108 HP/Liter while the M4 engine is not used for any race car so him downplaying the RC-F engine claiming RC-F engine is not a race engine and the M4 engine is, really shows he has no clue what he is talking about.
I would even go as far as saying, the RC-F engine is far closer to the traditional M motorsport philosophy than the new M4 engine, which is really just a retuned and modified 335i engine.
Last edited by 05RollaXRS; 03-22-14 at 10:15 PM.
#7
Racer
iTrader: (12)
LMAO the M engineer sound like the "a-typical" BMW fanboy, not like an engineer at all. His responses couldve basically said
"the bmw is a racecar and has a legacy and we the best because bmw and no other measures up because bmw....."
and it wouldve said the exact same thing with less lol
"the bmw is a racecar and has a legacy and we the best because bmw and no other measures up because bmw....."
and it wouldve said the exact same thing with less lol
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#8
A typical, we-have-the-ultimate-driving-machine BS response from intoxicated German engineers who think their cars a supposed to constantly require "maintenance."
If you recollect, their Ms with turbos were popping like overcooked hotdogs last year, and they had to discontinue sales. Of course, they just required maintenance.
My pre-order for the new F is in.
It will be a cold day in hell when I go back to BMW.
M = Mistake in my experience with the brand.
If you recollect, their Ms with turbos were popping like overcooked hotdogs last year, and they had to discontinue sales. Of course, they just required maintenance.
My pre-order for the new F is in.
It will be a cold day in hell when I go back to BMW.
M = Mistake in my experience with the brand.
#9
Racer
iTrader: (12)
A typical, we-have-the-ultimate-driving-machine BS response from intoxicated German engineers who think their cars a supposed to constantly require "maintenance."
If you recollect, their Ms with turbos were popping like overcooked hotdogs last year, and they had to discontinue sales. Of course, they just required maintenance.
My pre-order for the new F is in.
It will be a cold day in hell when I go back to BMW.
M = Mistake in my experience with the brand.
If you recollect, their Ms with turbos were popping like overcooked hotdogs last year, and they had to discontinue sales. Of course, they just required maintenance.
My pre-order for the new F is in.
It will be a cold day in hell when I go back to BMW.
M = Mistake in my experience with the brand.
#13
Lexus Test Driver
This interview is WHY I LOVE JAPANESE CAR MAKERS!! They don't care about competition, why this car is better than that car, its just straight up, "I want to create what I want, which is a really high-performance car offering driving pleasure to anybody, even regular drivers." I even like that Yaguchi said a NON Lexus Brand is the best car unlike biermann
I also think Yaguchi's final comments solidified why Lexus wont go with turbocharged engines even though there has been many speculation of turbo this and turbo that.
I also think Yaguchi's final comments solidified why Lexus wont go with turbocharged engines even though there has been many speculation of turbo this and turbo that.
At this moment, for Lexus F, we think the non-turbo engine provides the best performance balance and also response. But I don't want to reject any performance engine's potential. If needed, I'm going to certainly study. I want to provide linear torque and power by a naturally aspirated engine.
Last edited by NYKnick101; 03-26-14 at 12:04 PM.
#15
I'm not surprised with the BMW response, I've read somewhere that they didn't consider the C63 and Audi RS a competitor as well even though the cars are cross-shopped. At least they're not just hating on Lexus.