DIY waterpump?
05-20-15, 04:36 PM
#46
Lexus Fanatic
I know I will be going against the grain here but I wouldn't worry about replacing the belt tensioner if there is nothing wrong with it. If it ever does go bad you will hear it and you can address it then.
Toyota tensioners are pretty good and they generally last a very long time. I have replaced similar style water pump and the owner is still driving on the same tensioner many years later with probably an additional 50k miles since.
Toyota tensioners are pretty good and they generally last a very long time. I have replaced similar style water pump and the owner is still driving on the same tensioner many years later with probably an additional 50k miles since.
05-21-15, 09:48 AM
#47
But then when the old water pump is out and he is looking at the pulley, spinning it by hand and realizing that it makes a bit more noise or wiggles a bit more than he is comfortable with, and also realizing that it has spun literally millions of revolutions in 100k with only the grease that it was assembled with, and knows that bearings don't last forever, and that 95% of the labor involved in replacing it is already done.....
05-26-15, 04:15 PM
#48
Driver School Candidate
I got my LS460 back from Park Place Lexus today. They said mine was seeping too and wanted 918.00 to replace it, 115.00 to replace a front parking light, 930.00 to change a transmission solenoid, wiring harness because of more seepage. 115.00 for a differential service, 221.00 for brake fluid change, and replace the battery plus terminal for 160.00. The total was just shy of $3,000.00 for a car that doesn't so much as have a check engine light on. 930.00 for a water pump? they must be planning on spending the whole day doing it.
I declined all of the above and got my recall done. Davenport Motors is almost as bad cost wise.
Kwik Kar said they would do the water pump for $486.00. I'm going to take a chance on Kwik Kar.
I declined all of the above and got my recall done. Davenport Motors is almost as bad cost wise.
Kwik Kar said they would do the water pump for $486.00. I'm going to take a chance on Kwik Kar.
05-26-15, 04:23 PM
#49
I got my LS460 back from Park Place Lexus today. They said mine was seeping too and wanted 918.00 to replace it, 115.00 to replace a front parking light, 930.00 to change a transmission solenoid, wiring harness because of more seepage. 115.00 for a differential service, 221.00 for brake fluid change, and replace the battery plus terminal for 160.00. The total was just shy of $3,000.00 for a car that doesn't so much as have a check engine light on. 930.00 for a water pump? they must be planning on spending the whole day doing it.
I declined all of the above and got my recall done. Davenport Motors is almost as bad cost wise.
Kwik Kar said they would do the water pump for $486.00. I'm going to take a chance on Kwik Kar.
I declined all of the above and got my recall done. Davenport Motors is almost as bad cost wise.
Kwik Kar said they would do the water pump for $486.00. I'm going to take a chance on Kwik Kar.
05-27-15, 01:58 PM
#51
Lexus Test Driver
Update
Before I begin, I would especially like to thank Roadfrong and Devh for setting the groundwork and guidelines for approaching this repair. I can’t say thank you enough.
Though I consider myself a DIY guy, I am a beginner in the realm of car repair. I say this because if there is anyone who comes across this thread who has been/will be told that their 460 water pump is leaking, then presented with the absurd cost to repair it from Lexus, this repair can be done in your garage with a socket/torque socket, socket extension, phillip's and some patience. After going through the process explained below, the thing that proved to be the biggest nuisance was removing/putting back the covers beneath the car, as there are a lot of screws.
The only thing that was a bit different from the instructions that I encountered, was the removal of the dip stick tube flange. I was under the impression that there was only one bolt that needed to be removed. However, once getting into the job , I had to not only remove the tube flange, but also the part/piece that the flange was attached to, which was attached to the pump, had to be removed in order to completely remove the pump. That was an additional 3 bolts. This piece/part appeared to be a piece that divides/diverges coolant and/or air to different routes, as the top has three hoses connected to it, the piece itself attaches to the water pump and the bottom of it is where the lower rad hose attached to. This is also where I used a socket extension to reach in there to get to the bolts as they’re kind of deeply set and there is a multitude of wires in conduit covering the area. Nothing difficult though.
Once I drained and removed the parts to get to the pump and remove it and replace it with the new pump and filled the basin with OEM Toyota coolant while air purging (filling while squeezing upper/lower radiator hose with purge cap off to feed coolant through the system), once the level maintained at FULL, I started the car and I let the car run idle for 10 minutes with no visible leaks.
It wasn’t until I ran the car for 5 minutes at 1600-1700rpm’s then went to check underneath the car that I saw that coolant was leaking.
I had to re drain and go back in there and see what was wrong.
I noticed that upon loosening the bolts to remove the pump a few of the screws were loose. I had used a torque socket to tighten the bolts to spec but apparently it was working as it should. That compounded with the fact that once I tightened all of the bolts in the A,B,C pattern, I didn’t go a second time around to assure everything didn’t need to be re-torqued. So I ran out and purchased a water pump gasket sealant, torqued everything a bit more snug, refilled and proceeded with the air purging process, but forgot to unscrew that bleeder cap/screw part of the way through the process, so I then unscrewed the cap then continued.
I started the car and let it run ide for 10 minutes while adding a bit more fluid due to the level dropping, and didn’t see any leaks. However, the coolant level in the basin rose to the point where it was coming out of the pressure release valve and leaked out. Some expansion is expected, as water expands under pressure/heat, but this was too much. It continued to run and the level returned to a bit below the FULL mark.
It reached 10 minutes and I proceeded to run the car at 1600-1700rpm’s for the specified 5 minutes.
At about the 3 minute mark, I noticed that the car began to overheat, and I immediately shut the car off.
I did some quick research (googling) and saw that due to me beginning the purging process without the bleeder screw undone, I more than likely got air in the system thus pressure and the coolant wasn’t flowing freely. That and/or the thermostat was stuck closed. So I squeezed the upper and lower rad hoses a few times, started the car and got the fluid circulating and squeezed the top rad hose a few times and felt coolant rushing through a bit more than what I thought I felt previously.
I let it run for 15 minutes at idle-no temp rise.
I then proceeded to do the high rpm test for 5 minutes –no temp rise, no leaks.
Job completed.
Though I consider myself a DIY guy, I am a beginner in the realm of car repair. I say this because if there is anyone who comes across this thread who has been/will be told that their 460 water pump is leaking, then presented with the absurd cost to repair it from Lexus, this repair can be done in your garage with a socket/torque socket, socket extension, phillip's and some patience. After going through the process explained below, the thing that proved to be the biggest nuisance was removing/putting back the covers beneath the car, as there are a lot of screws.
The only thing that was a bit different from the instructions that I encountered, was the removal of the dip stick tube flange. I was under the impression that there was only one bolt that needed to be removed. However, once getting into the job , I had to not only remove the tube flange, but also the part/piece that the flange was attached to, which was attached to the pump, had to be removed in order to completely remove the pump. That was an additional 3 bolts. This piece/part appeared to be a piece that divides/diverges coolant and/or air to different routes, as the top has three hoses connected to it, the piece itself attaches to the water pump and the bottom of it is where the lower rad hose attached to. This is also where I used a socket extension to reach in there to get to the bolts as they’re kind of deeply set and there is a multitude of wires in conduit covering the area. Nothing difficult though.
Once I drained and removed the parts to get to the pump and remove it and replace it with the new pump and filled the basin with OEM Toyota coolant while air purging (filling while squeezing upper/lower radiator hose with purge cap off to feed coolant through the system), once the level maintained at FULL, I started the car and I let the car run idle for 10 minutes with no visible leaks.
It wasn’t until I ran the car for 5 minutes at 1600-1700rpm’s then went to check underneath the car that I saw that coolant was leaking.
I had to re drain and go back in there and see what was wrong.
I noticed that upon loosening the bolts to remove the pump a few of the screws were loose. I had used a torque socket to tighten the bolts to spec but apparently it was working as it should. That compounded with the fact that once I tightened all of the bolts in the A,B,C pattern, I didn’t go a second time around to assure everything didn’t need to be re-torqued. So I ran out and purchased a water pump gasket sealant, torqued everything a bit more snug, refilled and proceeded with the air purging process, but forgot to unscrew that bleeder cap/screw part of the way through the process, so I then unscrewed the cap then continued.
I started the car and let it run ide for 10 minutes while adding a bit more fluid due to the level dropping, and didn’t see any leaks. However, the coolant level in the basin rose to the point where it was coming out of the pressure release valve and leaked out. Some expansion is expected, as water expands under pressure/heat, but this was too much. It continued to run and the level returned to a bit below the FULL mark.
It reached 10 minutes and I proceeded to run the car at 1600-1700rpm’s for the specified 5 minutes.
At about the 3 minute mark, I noticed that the car began to overheat, and I immediately shut the car off.
I did some quick research (googling) and saw that due to me beginning the purging process without the bleeder screw undone, I more than likely got air in the system thus pressure and the coolant wasn’t flowing freely. That and/or the thermostat was stuck closed. So I squeezed the upper and lower rad hoses a few times, started the car and got the fluid circulating and squeezed the top rad hose a few times and felt coolant rushing through a bit more than what I thought I felt previously.
I let it run for 15 minutes at idle-no temp rise.
I then proceeded to do the high rpm test for 5 minutes –no temp rise, no leaks.
Job completed.
05-27-15, 03:06 PM
#52
Their finding would be a concern of mine and if possible I would locate the leak.
Just guessing here and it could be that the harness comes with the seal and that is why they recommend the complete harness change.
05-27-15, 03:13 PM
#53
Before I begin, I would especially like to thank Roadfrong and Devh for setting the groundwork and guidelines for approaching this repair. I can’t say thank you enough.
Though I consider myself a DIY guy, I am a beginner in the realm of car repair. I say this because if there is anyone who comes across this thread who has been/will be told that their 460 water pump is leaking, then presented with the absurd cost to repair it from Lexus, this repair can be done in your garage with a socket/torque socket, socket extension, phillip's and some patience. After going through the process explained below, the thing that proved to be the biggest nuisance was removing/putting back the covers beneath the car, as there are a lot of screws.
The only thing that was a bit different from the instructions that I encountered, was the removal of the dip stick tube flange. I was under the impression that there was only one bolt that needed to be removed. However, once getting into the job , I had to not only remove the tube flange, but also the part/piece that the flange was attached to, which was attached to the pump, had to be removed in order to completely remove the pump. That was an additional 3 bolts. This piece/part appeared to be a piece that divides/diverges coolant and/or air to different routes, as the top has three hoses connected to it, the piece itself attaches to the water pump and the bottom of it is where the lower rad hose attached to. This is also where I used a socket extension to reach in there to get to the bolts as they’re kind of deeply set and there is a multitude of wires in conduit covering the area. Nothing difficult though.
Once I drained and removed the parts to get to the pump and remove it and replace it with the new pump and filled the basin with OEM Toyota coolant while air purging (filling while squeezing upper/lower radiator hose with purge cap off to feed coolant through the system), once the level maintained at FULL, I started the car and I let the car run idle for 10 minutes with no visible leaks.
It wasn’t until I ran the car for 5 minutes at 1600-1700rpm’s then went to check underneath the car that I saw that coolant was leaking.
I had to re drain and go back in there and see what was wrong.
I noticed that upon loosening the bolts to remove the pump a few of the screws were loose. I had used a torque socket to tighten the bolts to spec but apparently it was working as it should. That compounded with the fact that once I tightened all of the bolts in the A,B,C pattern, I didn’t go a second time around to assure everything didn’t need to be re-torqued. So I ran out and purchased a water pump gasket sealant, torqued everything a bit more snug, refilled and proceeded with the air purging process, but forgot to unscrew that bleeder cap/screw part of the way through the process, so I then unscrewed the cap then continued.
I started the car and let it run ide for 10 minutes while adding a bit more fluid due to the level dropping, and didn’t see any leaks. However, the coolant level in the basin rose to the point where it was coming out of the pressure release valve and leaked out. Some expansion is expected, as water expands under pressure/heat, but this was too much. It continued to run and the level returned to a bit below the FULL mark.
It reached 10 minutes and I proceeded to run the car at 1600-1700rpm’s for the specified 5 minutes.
At about the 3 minute mark, I noticed that the car began to overheat, and I immediately shut the car off.
I did some quick research (googling) and saw that due to me beginning the purging process without the bleeder screw undone, I more than likely got air in the system thus pressure and the coolant wasn’t flowing freely. That and/or the thermostat was stuck closed. So I squeezed the upper and lower rad hoses a few times, started the car and got the fluid circulating and squeezed the top rad hose a few times and felt coolant rushing through a bit more than what I thought I felt previously.
I let it run for 15 minutes at idle-no temp rise.
I then proceeded to do the high rpm test for 5 minutes –no temp rise, no leaks.
Job completed.
Though I consider myself a DIY guy, I am a beginner in the realm of car repair. I say this because if there is anyone who comes across this thread who has been/will be told that their 460 water pump is leaking, then presented with the absurd cost to repair it from Lexus, this repair can be done in your garage with a socket/torque socket, socket extension, phillip's and some patience. After going through the process explained below, the thing that proved to be the biggest nuisance was removing/putting back the covers beneath the car, as there are a lot of screws.
The only thing that was a bit different from the instructions that I encountered, was the removal of the dip stick tube flange. I was under the impression that there was only one bolt that needed to be removed. However, once getting into the job , I had to not only remove the tube flange, but also the part/piece that the flange was attached to, which was attached to the pump, had to be removed in order to completely remove the pump. That was an additional 3 bolts. This piece/part appeared to be a piece that divides/diverges coolant and/or air to different routes, as the top has three hoses connected to it, the piece itself attaches to the water pump and the bottom of it is where the lower rad hose attached to. This is also where I used a socket extension to reach in there to get to the bolts as they’re kind of deeply set and there is a multitude of wires in conduit covering the area. Nothing difficult though.
Once I drained and removed the parts to get to the pump and remove it and replace it with the new pump and filled the basin with OEM Toyota coolant while air purging (filling while squeezing upper/lower radiator hose with purge cap off to feed coolant through the system), once the level maintained at FULL, I started the car and I let the car run idle for 10 minutes with no visible leaks.
It wasn’t until I ran the car for 5 minutes at 1600-1700rpm’s then went to check underneath the car that I saw that coolant was leaking.
I had to re drain and go back in there and see what was wrong.
I noticed that upon loosening the bolts to remove the pump a few of the screws were loose. I had used a torque socket to tighten the bolts to spec but apparently it was working as it should. That compounded with the fact that once I tightened all of the bolts in the A,B,C pattern, I didn’t go a second time around to assure everything didn’t need to be re-torqued. So I ran out and purchased a water pump gasket sealant, torqued everything a bit more snug, refilled and proceeded with the air purging process, but forgot to unscrew that bleeder cap/screw part of the way through the process, so I then unscrewed the cap then continued.
I started the car and let it run ide for 10 minutes while adding a bit more fluid due to the level dropping, and didn’t see any leaks. However, the coolant level in the basin rose to the point where it was coming out of the pressure release valve and leaked out. Some expansion is expected, as water expands under pressure/heat, but this was too much. It continued to run and the level returned to a bit below the FULL mark.
It reached 10 minutes and I proceeded to run the car at 1600-1700rpm’s for the specified 5 minutes.
At about the 3 minute mark, I noticed that the car began to overheat, and I immediately shut the car off.
I did some quick research (googling) and saw that due to me beginning the purging process without the bleeder screw undone, I more than likely got air in the system thus pressure and the coolant wasn’t flowing freely. That and/or the thermostat was stuck closed. So I squeezed the upper and lower rad hoses a few times, started the car and got the fluid circulating and squeezed the top rad hose a few times and felt coolant rushing through a bit more than what I thought I felt previously.
I let it run for 15 minutes at idle-no temp rise.
I then proceeded to do the high rpm test for 5 minutes –no temp rise, no leaks.
Job completed.
Good to hear you were successful.
Sorry to hear about the bolts not meeting up with the torque specification.
I'm actually surprised because the bolts with a little wetness would require slightly less torque.
05-27-15, 09:53 PM
#54
Lexus Test Driver
While torque tightening a bolt, the socket just gave way and the internal bearings stripped. I tried to adjust it and get it to hold/lock I'm position But it never was quite right after that.
05-28-15, 08:42 PM
#55
Lexus Fanatic
To be honest Devh, inthinkntje specs were accurate, but the socket I had (rented one from Auto Zone) was faulty. I failed to mention that, my mistake.
While torque tightening a bolt, the socket just gave way and the internal bearings stripped. I tried to adjust it and get it to hold/lock I'm position But it never was quite right after that.
While torque tightening a bolt, the socket just gave way and the internal bearings stripped. I tried to adjust it and get it to hold/lock I'm position But it never was quite right after that.
Isn't it rewarding to pull something like this off AND save a wad of cash? Great learning experience too.
Well done.
05-29-15, 08:18 AM
#56
Lexus Test Driver
I cant even begin to express enough gratitude to you and Devh for all of your help!
I made myself a small packet of the step by step instructions, the diagrams and the procedure for purging via cut/paste in a word document, and had it sitting next to me the whole time.
Yes a great learning experience and for me, the vindication of fixing the fact that it was leaking when I thought it was a faulty pump!
Now...standing back and watching the car run at idle with no leaks and engine temp regulating with a ice cold craft brew in my hand: Priceless!
Sidenote:
My neighbor stopped by and was stunned that I "dared" to venture beneath the hood of Lexus' most coveted vehicle. Then proceeded to say: "You mean to tell me that this car needs a water pump at under 70k miles..and its a LEXUS????? Water pumps don't even break or fail anymore! Man your nuts! I'd et the dealer handle that!"
I replied:
"Well, to the tune of $900+, i'll pass. Plus - A, its 8+ years old, B, stuff does break, after all its a car. And it hasnt completely failed, it has a small leak, very small, very slow, but why wait? And I don't think it matters the brand of vehicle...stuff will always need to be serviced. And C, im not sure about water pump no longer failing..thats a new one to me, but I know that this one is new and hopefully will last!"
Thanks again man, I owe ya a cold 12pk of your drink of choice!
05-29-15, 10:55 AM
#57
I used to fly planes and one thing we did was preventative maintenance at hour marks. You didn't wait for it to fail, you have to replace parts on a time basis so they almost never fail while in flight a long way from the ground. If we did that with cars I think people wouldn't get all worked up over having to fix something because they'd be used to replacing things as they aged but before they broke.
At 70K miles you're probably somewhere in the 2,000 hours of operation mark - way past the 100 & 200 hour maintenance schedules a Cessna requires
05-29-15, 12:05 PM
#58
Saving cash and rewarding indeed!
I cant even begin to express enough gratitude to you and Devh for all of your help!
I made myself a small packet of the step by step instructions, the diagrams and the procedure for purging via cut/paste in a word document, and had it sitting next to me the whole time.
Yes a great learning experience and for me, the vindication of fixing the fact that it was leaking when I thought it was a faulty pump!
Now...standing back and watching the car run at idle with no leaks and engine temp regulating with a ice cold craft brew in my hand: Priceless!
Sidenote:
My neighbor stopped by and was stunned that I "dared" to venture beneath the hood of Lexus' most coveted vehicle. Then proceeded to say: "You mean to tell me that this car needs a water pump at under 70k miles..and its a LEXUS????? Water pumps don't even break or fail anymore! Man your nuts! I'd et the dealer handle that!"
I replied:
"Well, to the tune of $900+, i'll pass. Plus - A, its 8+ years old, B, stuff does break, after all its a car. And it hasnt completely failed, it has a small leak, very small, very slow, but why wait? And I don't think it matters the brand of vehicle...stuff will always need to be serviced. And C, im not sure about water pump no longer failing..thats a new one to me, but I know that this one is new and hopefully will last!"
Thanks again man, I owe ya a cold 12pk of your drink of choice!
I cant even begin to express enough gratitude to you and Devh for all of your help!
I made myself a small packet of the step by step instructions, the diagrams and the procedure for purging via cut/paste in a word document, and had it sitting next to me the whole time.
Yes a great learning experience and for me, the vindication of fixing the fact that it was leaking when I thought it was a faulty pump!
Now...standing back and watching the car run at idle with no leaks and engine temp regulating with a ice cold craft brew in my hand: Priceless!
Sidenote:
My neighbor stopped by and was stunned that I "dared" to venture beneath the hood of Lexus' most coveted vehicle. Then proceeded to say: "You mean to tell me that this car needs a water pump at under 70k miles..and its a LEXUS????? Water pumps don't even break or fail anymore! Man your nuts! I'd et the dealer handle that!"
I replied:
"Well, to the tune of $900+, i'll pass. Plus - A, its 8+ years old, B, stuff does break, after all its a car. And it hasnt completely failed, it has a small leak, very small, very slow, but why wait? And I don't think it matters the brand of vehicle...stuff will always need to be serviced. And C, im not sure about water pump no longer failing..thats a new one to me, but I know that this one is new and hopefully will last!"
Thanks again man, I owe ya a cold 12pk of your drink of choice!
Your friend is right in that mechanical water pumps these days especially from makes like Toyota and Honda can outlast the ownership. They are made so well that if they fail it can occur at any time and not necessarily at a predetermined age like they use to be.
I like the fact that Lexus keeps it simple unlike BMW and their electrical outrageously expensive water pumps.
06-01-15, 11:26 AM
#60
Thanks for all the info
Even if I don't do the repairs myself, I'm able to communicate with my private mechanic more knowledgeably.
My ls460 is at the repair shop right now installing an Aisin water pump ($48), Bando drive belt ($18), bendix front rotors ($60), akebono front ceramic pads ($60), oil and filter change. Private shop price for labor, tax and liquids is $443. If u add parts I bought for $190, then total is $633.
Not bad compared to dealer prices and mechanic is ASE Certified.
So, I save overall and get to use uber ($10 each way) while my car is in shop.
Manny
My ls460 is at the repair shop right now installing an Aisin water pump ($48), Bando drive belt ($18), bendix front rotors ($60), akebono front ceramic pads ($60), oil and filter change. Private shop price for labor, tax and liquids is $443. If u add parts I bought for $190, then total is $633.
Not bad compared to dealer prices and mechanic is ASE Certified.
So, I save overall and get to use uber ($10 each way) while my car is in shop.
Manny