AJT123

I know this will probably get merged to the mother thread (sorry) but I figure this is a quicker way to get answers, as I am taking car to shop ASAP because I have a coupon.

I'm still somewhat conflicted on the best course of action re: transmission fluid change, but I'm leaning towards having a full flush. The dealer(s) I have spoken with recommended that, and when I asked if anyone had problems bc of the potential "shock" to the unit, they told me that they haven't had any problems "as long as there were no problems to begin with." Service mgr said to do it every 100k.

04 LS 112k, tranny still shifts like a knife cutting through hot butter, but I've lived in the thick of stop and go traffic in Los Angeles for over a year now--fluid definitely needs a change, especially in these driving conditions. It is LITERALLY 99.9999% stop and go. The car hardly ever shifts into 5th or 6th gear--the traffic is that bad.

Wondering if anyone has had any issues after a full flush?

Lavrishevo

iTrader: (1)

The safest and best way to maintain the transmission is consistent drain and refill not flushing the system. This is why the majority of Lexus dealers do not even offer a flushing service. It's not like changing the oil. All the additives and how he clutch packs wear. Drain and refill is what Aisin engineers recommend as well. Tried and true on the ls400. Same principles apply to the 430.

KING

iTrader: (1)

Heard lots of stories, about transmissions acting up after a full flush on the LS430, and it was consistent with higher mileage cars. On the other hand, I've also talked to a few who a had a flush done, and the tranny survived and was better than before.

Don't have a straight answer for your question, sorry.

But the safest way to go, as mentioned, would be to drain and refill back new oil but same quantity as what was drained.


Fun fact, did you know that the lightest 6-speed transmission in the world, is the 2004-2006 Lexus LS430 transmission? Yes.

AJT123

I tend to agree with you, but wouldn't I have to drain and fill like 4 times before all the fluid is actually removed and changed? All those trips to the dealer (and $$), but it's not that big of a deal, I guess. I want my tranny in pristine shape, as I plan to drive this car to 400k at least.

OTOH, I have personally not seen an instance on here (and I'm on here religiously) where anyone had issues after a dealer flush.

LS400 and 430 until '04 had a non-sealed tranny, as I'm sure you know. Is it the same fluid? Or different with the '04-06 bc it's designed for "lifetime"?

AJT123

Could you elaborate? What do you mean by "Acting up"?

And no, I did not know that! It sure is a solid unit, and shifts wonderfully. I am also addressing the TSB low speed issue when I take her in....I can't take the downshifting to first gear needlessly in LA traffic any longer (not to mention the potential unnecessary wear). Can't wait to see the difference.

Lavrishevo

iTrader: (1)

Your looking at it like an oil change AJ. You don't need to replace all the fluid. Just start the process now. Do one, then wait 10 or 15 thousand miles, do another, and repeat every 25k miles or so.

There is no such thing as a lifetime fluid. This is something Lexus of United States made up. Ideally, it would be smart to start the drain and refill process by 30k miles on the car but it's not the end of the world so just start the process now.

WS fluid is synthetic. Type IV is not. Flushing the system in general is a bad idea because it can dislodge gunk or something building up and it could clog up and you could possibly lose the transmission. It shocks the system. The risk of flushing goes up the longer you wait to service the transmission. Trust me, many LS400 owners have gotten 400k+ miles out of a transmission servicing it this way. It is tried and true.

There was nothing wrong with the way my transmission shifted when I started this process. But now that I've started it I noticed that shifts even better. If anything, it's more about the health of the transmission rather than noticing a major improvement.

AJT123

Do you know how many quarts the tranny holds, and how many actually drain with the drain and fill?

Oh, I got you. There is nothing wrong with mine either, shifts beautifully. I just hate that the car just never gets a chance to stretch her legs. What I meant by "I can't wait to see the difference" is just the fix for the software issue that eliminates the low speed lurch. I'm sure you're aware of what I'm talking about. I'm going crazy having to watch my speedo so I doesn't go below 12ish MPH and having to feather the gas so I don't get an abrupt and unnecessary downshift into first gear. This is basically impossible to avoid in LA traffic, and it's very annoying. In Knoxville, it would hardly even occur (because there you can actually accelerate to 50 or so MPH and stay that speed for a while), so it didn't bother me. Here with the traffic and nothing but endless stop and go intersections on a grid, it's virtually every time I drive.

KING

iTrader: (1)

Some people experienced weird downshifts, sometimes very harsh downshifts like a sports car. Some couldn't get it into the 6th gear, tranny would shift normally till 5, but then would get stuck and it won't move to 6th.

Some folks had a problem with the sound the tranny was making after the full flush. Every change from drive to P or R had a clunk to it.

Now I can't pledge for their work or how the flush was done. Hear this all the time back in the GCC area, the heat factor could be playing a role here, but I am not %100 sure, as I thankfully hadn't to go through that problem.

But I have owned more than 10 LS430's by now, none of them did I bother with the flush. Drain and refill, that way, the old oil will re-circulate with the new one and when you drain, it pick ups any remainder of small particles or such.

Refill and drain has been tested and it works well. Take that route if you don't want future problems, OR get a full flush done at a reputable Lexus dealer, and have them stand behind their name if any future problems show up.

AJT123

Thanks for the info. I honestly think, or really want to think, that the Beverly Hills Lexus dealer (of all places) would stand behind their work if something went wrong. I specifically asked the SA to ask the "master LS430 tech" (whomever that may be) about it. They recommended a flush, but you've got me reconsidering.

BTW hah, the guy also was like "ohh, great car, better than the 460" when I said it was a 430.

Lavrishevo

iTrader: (1)

Performed Repair Fill Amount
Transmission pan and drain plug removal
1.3 liters (1.37 US qts, 1.14 Imp. qts)
Transmission valve body removal 3.9 liters (4.12 US qts, 3.43 Imp. qts)
Torque converter removal 5.3 liters (5.60 US qts, 4.66 Imp. qts)
Entire transmission assembly 5.3 liters (5.60 US qts, 4.66 Imp. qts)

Although, many people say you get about 2 quarts from a drain and refill. Capacity is less then 6.

Something else to consider is that if you start having transmission problems six months or year down the road you won't be able to go back after the dealer. They won't honor any kind of repair policy because you can't prove they caused the problem.

The 3 Lexus dealers around Atlanta do not even offer flushing. Just drain and refill. One the Lexus master techs who used to frequent the forums often was close to an engineer at Aisin. They make our transmissions. He spoke at length about how the drain and refill was the ideal way to maintain such a vital part of the car. I don't know all the technical details but it specifically has to do with the clutches and how as they wear it gets integrated into the fluid. Not really anything to do with viscosity or lubricating abilities. This again, goes back to not replacing all the fluid at once. In other words, the characteristics of how the clutch packs wear play an important role in preserving the transmission, particularly the clutches, as it ages.

I started my first at 105k when I purchased the car, 2nd was 112 or so and 3rd was 132k. I'll do another at 160k or so. I'm actually sending my sample to Blackstone from my last D&R a few days ago just for the hell of it. It's interesting to have them analyze fluids but even this does not account for the important factor that I mentioned above. As the transmission ages it becomes increasingly important to not replace all of the fluid at once specifically because of the clutches.

swfla

iTrader: (1)

Sorry you're frustrated by driving in traffic jams. Changing your fluid won't make any difference there, you need to get out to the country for a drive No one is saying you can't change the fluid, just don't do a flush. Unless you have it spelled out in writing that the dealer guarantees for 12 months no transmission problems, period, you're taking a big chance. Just do a drain and fill. I understand that it takes more time, effort and money to do it 4-6 times over an extended period. But it's safer and you can go to a Toyota dealer with experts for less money. I agree that it only makes sense to replace the fluid. Just be smart about it. We only want the best for you, the Lexus dealer wants to make money and "sometimes" will unintentionally place you in a bad spot where you will need to come back to spend more, sooner. It's up to you if you want to chance opening a can of worms.

Bob04

I'm interested in the result too. Hope you share. I have also followed a similar drain-and-fill pattern. My Lexus dealer also offers only the drain and fill. No flush is even offered.

Bob04

I'd get that in writing. I don't see a dealer covering a failed transmission because the owner thinks a fluid change made it fail.

Techs don't like the 460 around here. I've had the discussion a 5 different dealers now, and every single one says the 430 is a better car than the 460. Don't even really have to bring up the subject. Most pretty freely offer up the fact that they prefer the 430. One even told me he wouldn't own a 460.

Lavrishevo

iTrader: (1)

I definitely will share it. I planned on getting it out in the mail yesterday but was running late to the airport. I fly back home this evening and will send it off Friday for results hopefully next week. I posted a couple of pics in the main thread. Color looks pretty darn good.

Tom57

Just completed another drain and fill on my '01 with 260,600 miles. Even though I've been doing drain and fills for several years now, I'm still amazed at how relatively clean the A/T fluid is given the miles. I've never had a flush done on it.