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I vote Toyota Corolla. As a person in business, it is the best selling. It's cheap to manufacture. It's reliable. It benefits the business because of profits. It benefits the consumer because of affordability and dependability. That's the best car.
Best Supercar - was 2000GT, but LFA took the crown
Best Sports Car - old NSX, but R35 took the crown
Best Hybrid - Prius
I seriously can't comment on it has I haven't driven the LFA. I have driven the NSX for 6 miles, slowly. I remember not being impressed by how Accordish it looks inside. I did see the LFA in car show and was already amazed on the quality on the car. Like seriously good.
If the argument is about the Japanese car that most changed cars or the automotive industry (which, notably, the quote in the OP is not arguing), it's pretty laughable to think either the NSX or LFA could be in consideration. Which makes the above back and forth seem even more silly.
Next 20 years from, now LFA will be obsolete , old , not a standard. Maybe it is the best ever made for now, but it does not shake the automotive industry.
If the same question was asked in the 90's, what would it be?
20 years from now LFA will be obsolete , old , not a standard in next 2 decades . If the same question was asked in the 90's, what would it be?
I don't think anyone would compare two cars from two different eras and somehow think they are comparable in terms of number and performance. It would be foolish to somehow compare their performance and handling or level of technology.
The original statement taken from the Piston Head article by the OP was very clear and that was context I was particularly addressing, which was:
"In terms of heart, soul, engineering and raw excitement, the Lexus LFA is the best car Japan has ever produced. No exceptions"
Question was whether this is true or false? The premise of question seemed very clear.
There is no one (including myself) who said NSX should somehow be compared to LFA in terms of performance knowing LFA was built in 2009 and NSX was built in 1990. They are 19 years apart. It would be the same for LFA in another 10 years or so. Yet, I am sure LFA will still be an extremely memorable driving experience even another 10 years from now because of its uniqueness in terms of driving experience as it is very likely to be timeless (going by what nearly everyone who drives it, says).
Keep in mind LFA already is an over 8 years old design, yet the mesmerism with the car has only grown. Especially, in the wake of cars going turbocharged, electronics and technoloigy with cars getting more geared towards bottom-end power delivery (as opposed to LFA which delivers close to max power from 8700 - 9500 pm)
Again, if you follow this forum, you will see all of the publications that get posted regularly on how this car drives, sounds and feels is unlike like any other car. The engine, again is at the center of everything. I am sure the opinions would have been vastly different, if it did not have an F1 derived V10 that screams up to 9500 rpm. I am quite sure, the intrigue will go only up over time particularly factoring in how many LFAs exist.
These days, a 552 - 563 HP 11.xx seconds 1/4 mile car like LFA is not considered in the league of the fastest in the crop (considering 670 HP 488 GTB is touching 10.xx seconds 1/4 mile) yet, you can see everyone who drives it cannot seem to care it is not the quickest because the driving experience completely makes it irrelevant.
Clarkson just recently (while interviewing about his upcoming amazon show) said, LFA remains his most favorite car of all times despite having driven it first in 2011.
There is an owner here who hinted at how someone ditched his Ferrari 599 GTO in favor of keeping his Lexus LFA. Why would that be the case? Or why two McLaren ownerson this board traded their MP4-12Cs for LFAs? Obviously, it was not the numbers, but it was something else that you,me or people commenting on the internet who have never driven an LFA can comprehend.
Update: If It's Not the Lexus LFA, What IS the Best Car Ever to Come Out of Japan?
Update: If It's Not the Lexus LFA, What IS the Best Car Ever to Come Out of Japan?
We recently posed this question: Is the LFA the Best Car to Ever Come Out of Japan? After all, it does have eye-catching styling, an exotic V10 engine, and the love of Jeremy Clarkson.
Keep in mind LFA already is an over 8 years old design, yet the mesmerism with the car has only grown. Especially, in the wake of cars going turbocharged, electronics and technoloigy with cars getting more geared towards bottom-end power delivery (as opposed to LFA which delivers close to max power from 8700 - 9500 pm)
Well, I've said it before, but I do think this is what the LFA has most going for it - the fact that it is one of the last great driver-oriented cars out there and has one of the best naturally-aspirated engines ever made, to boot. That's one of the aspects of the car that made me decide to get one, despite having turned down the opportunity for supercar ownership many times in the past.
This same desire for driver-oriented cars with naturally-aspirated engines also explains the insanely high demand for the 458 Speciale and Aperta. The 458 styling has never appealed to me, but I could honestly see the Aperta selling for 1mil+ if they aren't already.
Do the research on all carbon fiber cars including chassis and body panels. Now throw in a bespoke engine and limited production. An interior that, only Bugatti and Pagani can compete with and what price do you come up with....... Over a million.
I like everything about LFA, except Lexus put the engine in a wrong place. Most of super cars put their engines in the back and it should be. Not only for the center of the gravity, but also the car would look more proportional and cosmetic. It does not have the style that would make me say "Wow"
Do the research on all carbon fiber cars including chassis and body panels. Now throw in a bespoke engine and limited production. An interior that, only Bugatti and Pagani can compete with and what price do you come up with....... Over a million.
Well, that would be the perfect segway into the LFA build process video.
Possibly the reason the GT-R wasn't mentioned more is because you really don't need to or you just assume it was already posted. You can talk all you want about the LFA, but the GT-R is more influential, has more engineering/technology, is faster, and even obtainable by mere mortals. It's not even really close as the R35 GT-R is a game changing living legend and the LFA nothing more than an interesting footnote behind several other Japanese cars.
To be fair the original quote wasn't really about best overall, rather the words were carefully chosen. Heart, soul, raw excitement...maybe.
Possibly the reason the GT-R wasn't mentioned more is because you really don't need to or you just assume it was already posted. You can talk all you want about the LFA, but the GT-R is more influential, has more engineering/technology, is faster, and even obtainable by mere mortals. It's not even really close as the R35 GT-R is a game changing living legend and the LFA nothing more than an interesting footnote behind several other Japanese cars.
To be fair the original quote wasn't really about best overall, rather the words were carefully chosen. Heart, soul, raw excitement...maybe.
You lost credibility, if you think GTR has more engineering than the LFA since you probably display lack of understanding of the principle (I am an engineer, by the way). It is probably the first time I have ever heard that. I would not even begin to explain that especially when it comes to exotic materials, finish, level of precision and imagination it takes to build a car like LFA.
Also, LFA came out in 2009 as a final design that stayed the same for all 500 while Nissan has gone through what? a bazillion updates on the suspension, chassis, engine, boost pressure etc, stickier tires, ATTESSA AWD etc.. since it first was introduced to finally get quicker in a straight line than the LFA in model year 2012. At higher speeds above 100 mph, LFA still seems be the quicker car as the higher trap speed always shows up to 150+ mph beyond with superior power-to-weight.
There is an LFA owner on her (CrazyMPG) who sold his 600 who modified GTR, but still has the LFA. Does that say anything?
Also, Randy Pobst in 2011 did LFA and '12 GTR timed lap around Laguna Seca and they basically put the same lap time of 1:36 with GTR having stickier tires than the LFA.
Above everything, everyone who actually drives both cars has something to say regardless of numbers. Why should it be completely disregarded that and discredited, is simply beyond comprehension? Forged performance GTR time attack professional driver Sharreff Abdelbassett said LFA stock for stock is a superior handling machine on modest tires. Some journalists have said, it is the best car they have ever driven. Never ever heard that about the GTR.
When LFA was introduced, Motor Trend said this while comparing against the 2010 Nissan GTR. Today we talk about the same LFA that was used back in 2009, but cannot say the same thing about the GTR.
Subsequent testing proves the LFA to be dynamically superior to the GT-R in nearly every category including the much stronger acceleration of LFA beyond 60 mph. Any doubts that the Lexus is anything but a legitimate supercar are absolutely gutted on the test tarmac. Only supercars manage to brake from 60 in under 94 feet and pull 1.05 g on the skidpad. Sure, the GT-R retains bragging rights to 60 mph due to all wheel drive and shorter gearing, but to triple digits and beyond, it is all LFA. Then there is the way it handles our figure eight."
Professional FP GTR time attack driver (Abdelbassett) on LFA (2011):
The typical softness and understeer you find in nearly every current OEM “supercar” is nowhere to be found. In contrast, the LFA is a nimble, lightweight, and borderline twitchy car on track with the precision of a surgeon’s scalpel, all while running a modest run flat street tire.
....
Throughout my career, I’ve driven nearly every high performance sport car on various road course throughout the country. Without a doubt in my mind, the Lexus LFA is the best handling bone stock OEM car I’ve ever driven.
…I still managed a respectable 147mph GPS (155mph indicated) by the breaking zone of T10 which resulted in a 1:37 to 1:38 lap-time in the wet. To put this into perspective, a bone stone OEM GT-R would achieve a similar laptime but in the dry and while complaining all the way around the track.
(Nissan GTR vs Porsche Carrera GT vs Lexus LFA vs Clio vs Integra Type R)
LFA won this comparison and this is why:
These are the unforgettable moments the CGT lives for. Moments that are out of the front-drivers’ league and beyond the reach of even the mighty GT-R. It’s moments like these that make the CGT a shoo-in for the final showdown. Then a black LFA slides down from the back of Litchfield Imports’ trailer and all my finely reasoned thoughts are thrown into turmoil.
....
Very few cars have the LFA’s other-worldly aura. Everything about it is immaculately designed, engineered and presented, with every single facet of the car benefiting from an obsessive attention to nano-detail. Even in the wider company of our 20-car gathering it looks – and sounds – like an alien craft. It literally shines with quality and possesses a shape and stance that stop you dead in your tracks.
....
Everywhere you look there are things that delight, from the exquisite carbonfibre bonnet stay and sculptural indicator and wiper stalks to the LCD instrument cluster, which is something straight out of Stark Industries. The level of bespoke engineering is mind-blowing, the mission to create something that transcends merely building another supercar truly palpable in everything you see, touch and hear. It’s little short of a freak.
There’s so much to the LFA that’s exceptional, yet still its banshee V10 engine is the thing that makes the most immediate and lasting impression. The throttle response is totally insane, to the point where even the CGT’s motor feels a little tardy by comparison. It also sounds as good inside the car as it does outside – something the Porsche fails to do. To hear the 552bhp LFA go through its full 9000rpm aural range is to experience something part-way between an internal combustion engine and a musical instrument.
....
What I do know is the LFA steers with greater precision and a sweeter rate of response than the Porsche, smothers bumps and rides poor surfaces with more control and tracks truer and with less distraction from cambers and surface changes. In short it’s every bit as involving, but more exploitable. What I find most extraordinary is that while it has the CGT’s intensity and excitement when fully lit, it’s much the nicer car to be in when you’re simply making progress or covering miles. More comfortable, more refined, more special and the better car for long drives. It even has some luggage space, a proper satnav and a fabulous hi-fi. Its breadth of abilities is amazing.
Quite how Lexus created such a special car – from scratch – is one of the world’s great mysteries; that Toyota is unlikely to sanction its like again is one of the great automotive tragedies. Yet all of this only serves to make the legend of the LFA even more compelling. However they did it, and whatever justification they made for investing insane amounts of time and resource into such a glorious cul-de-sac, the result is something utterly spectacular and totally unique. Despite my deep love for the Carrera GT I can’t put it ahead of the intoxicating and truly wondrous LFA.
You can talk all you want about the LFA, but the GT-R is more influential, has more engineering/technology, is faster, and even obtainable by mere mortals.
I laughed out loud when I read this - I had to. How has the GT-R at all been influential - by having Porsche make the 911 Turbo .2s faster in the 0-60 than before?
I haven't driven the 2017 yet, but I was given a 2016 Nismo for a day. I returned it less than two hours later, and that included a gas stop and lunch. It strains credulity that anyone would pay $150k for such a thing. The LFA at $375k is a bargain in comparison.
05-23-16, 07:54 AM
