Anyone Trade their 2IS for the 3IS
#91
Lexus Fanatic
And your opinion would be valid...assuming you have driven the 4GS.
I neither agree or disagree with you, because I haven't driven the car. Given my experience with the same engine in the 4GS I think performance is going to be just fine, but thats a meaningless opinion because I haven't driven the 3IS.
We can post and post, and decide to buy the car or not but its all just meaningless because none of us have driven the car, and only few of us have even seen it.
I've given you my basis. You ignoring them and/or not agreeing with them is another matter entirely.
We can post and post, and decide to buy the car or not but its all just meaningless because none of us have driven the car, and only few of us have even seen it.
Last edited by SW17LS; 01-22-13 at 02:28 PM.
#92
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I don't have to drive a 4GS to have a valid opinion. I've driven faster cars and I know that's the performance I'd want for my next vehicle. I know enough about these cars, their competition and what I want to apply deductive reasoning and a bit of common sense to come to the conclusions/opinions I'm coming to without having to actually drive them. We aren't the same person, you maybe NEED to drive the car to come to whatever conclusion you come to, I have enough information to not have to do that.
I suggest a logic class and maybe look up the definition of "opinion" before your next reply to me, because the only reason we are going back and forth is because you have a misconception on both these concepts.
I suggest a logic class and maybe look up the definition of "opinion" before your next reply to me, because the only reason we are going back and forth is because you have a misconception on both these concepts.
Last edited by Ramon; 01-22-13 at 11:16 PM.
#93
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LOL...you don't need to try something out to have an opinion about it, whatever. Thats the definition of a closed mind, making your mind up about something before you try it out for yourself.
It is possible for the new IS to not be enough performance for what you would want for your next vehicle and for it to still be an excellent offering that sits well within their competitors. For instance the GS' performance is very comparable to its competitors. Perhaps your needs have just outgrown a non F IS.
As to weight, the 3IS is 50 lbs heavier than the 2IS. Thats all.
It is possible for the new IS to not be enough performance for what you would want for your next vehicle and for it to still be an excellent offering that sits well within their competitors. For instance the GS' performance is very comparable to its competitors. Perhaps your needs have just outgrown a non F IS.
As to weight, the 3IS is 50 lbs heavier than the 2IS. Thats all.
Last edited by SW17LS; 01-23-13 at 04:01 PM.
#94
I don't have to drive a 4GS to have a valid opinion. I've driven faster cars and I know that's the performance I'd want for my next vehicle. I know enough about these cars, their competition and what I want to apply deductive reasoning and a bit of common sense to come to the conclusions/opinions I'm coming to without having to actually drive them. We aren't the same person, you maybe NEED to drive the car to come to whatever conclusion you come to, I have enough information to not have to do that.
I suggest a logic class and maybe look up the definition of "opinion" before your next reply to me, because the only reason we are going back and forth is because you have a misconception on both these concepts.
I suggest a logic class and maybe look up the definition of "opinion" before your next reply to me, because the only reason we are going back and forth is because you have a misconception on both these concepts.
#95
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By your logic, I would have to drive a Prius to know I want a car that's faster than it, even though I've already driven cars that easily out perform it. The difference between you and me is I've got a clue. Like I said, logic class would do you good. The thing is, I know you can't be that clueless to not realize this so ill chalk it up to Lexus bias. Particularly the IS.
#96
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Ramon, I think you've stated your opinions pretty clearly and this thread is growing increasingly antagonistic. Let's move on please.
#98
Lexus Fanatic
By your logic, I would have to drive a Prius to know I want a car that's faster than it, even though I've already driven cars that easily out perform it. The difference between you and me is I've got a clue. Like I said, logic class would do you good. The thing is, I know you can't be that clueless to not realize this so ill chalk it up to Lexus bias. Particularly the IS.
No, I'm not saying that you would have to drive a Prius to know you want a car thats faster than it. What I am saying is that whether or not its fast enough *for you* is not the metric by which a car enthusiast measures a car. I would never buy a Prius, I would never buy an IS, but that doesn't mean I don't recognize how those particular cars fit in between their competitors. I can drive a car that would never appeal to me and still recognize what positives and negatives it has with its competition.
If you want something thats over the top powerful, like a Dinan modified 335i or an ISF thats great, thats what you should buy. However, the IS350 is not poorly designed because its not as powerful as a modified 335. I think if you compared the IS350 with a stock 335 you'd find the IS is pretty comparable, thats certainly the case with the GS350 vs the 535i. Does it compare powerwise to a 550i? No. The Prius is not poorly designed because its slow, you have to look at comparable cars and compare and contrast these cars with their competitors. I enjoy experiencing cars that I would never be interested in buying because I'm a car enthusiast.
For the record I have no Lexus bias. I like Lexus vehicles a lot, and obviously have chosen to drive them but that doesn't mean I don't recognize that other manufacturers have better products in certain segments...and I've said that here. No IS bias, I have never owned an IS nor would I ever consider purchasing one. Its not my kind of car.
#99
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I suspect the 2IS shares an aluminium vertical suspension member with the 3GS, but the 2IS certainly doesn't have the 3GS's aluminium bonnet.
The new 4GS still has the aluminium bonnet, and I suspect the 4GS upper and lower suspension arms are aluminium too.
Not sure how the 3IS goes as far as aluminium is concerned?
Presently, only the 5 Series has an aluminium boot lid, and aluminium doors.
There may be a few other makes and models that use aluminum components too, especially the E Class...
The new 4GS still has the aluminium bonnet, and I suspect the 4GS upper and lower suspension arms are aluminium too.
Not sure how the 3IS goes as far as aluminium is concerned?
Presently, only the 5 Series has an aluminium boot lid, and aluminium doors.
There may be a few other makes and models that use aluminum components too, especially the E Class...
As far as trading, I did want to trade due to having a 250 and wanting a 350. But after seeing the photos, I think I'll have to wait. Maybe I can trade for a 2012 350?
#101
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Well, Lexus did not say that the new 3IS is lighter than the out going model, that's why question about using aluminum was popped up. It's weight factor for us consumer, but it's cost saving factor for manufacturer. I don't really mind if it comes steel or aluminum hood, I just want to make sure if it's the reason 3IS is not lighter.
#102
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Well, Lexus did not say that the new 3IS is lighter than the out going model, that's why question about using aluminum was popped up. It's weight factor for us consumer, but it's cost saving factor for manufacturer. I don't really mind if it comes steel or aluminum hood, I just want to make sure if it's the reason 3IS is not lighter.
#103
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No, I'm not saying that you would have to drive a Prius to know you want a car thats faster than it. What I am saying is that whether or not its fast enough *for you* is not the metric by which a car enthusiast measures a car. I would never buy a Prius, I would never buy an IS, but that doesn't mean I don't recognize how those particular cars fit in between their competitors. I can drive a car that would never appeal to me and still recognize what positives and negatives it has with its competition.
Lets just wait for the reviews, and if Lexus pulls off what i'd consider to be a miracle and the 3IS 350 is significantly faster than the 2IS 350 I'll gladly eat some humble pie and never again pre-judge a Lexus vehicles performance. If however its roughly equal, or less than the 2IS, you stop claiming I need to drive the car first. Deal?
#104
What an "enthusiast" uses as a metric is entirely subjective, and the rest of your post, while accurate, has nothing to do with the debate we were having. I see where it fits in with it's competition. I can recognize it's positives and negatives and "for me" there aren't enough positives about the car.
Lets just wait for the reviews, and if Lexus pulls off what i'd consider to be a miracle and the 3IS 350 is significantly faster than the 2IS 350 I'll gladly eat some humble pie and never again pre-judge a Lexus vehicles performance. If however its roughly equal, or less than the 2IS, you stop claiming I need to drive the car first. Deal?
Lets just wait for the reviews, and if Lexus pulls off what i'd consider to be a miracle and the 3IS 350 is significantly faster than the 2IS 350 I'll gladly eat some humble pie and never again pre-judge a Lexus vehicles performance. If however its roughly equal, or less than the 2IS, you stop claiming I need to drive the car first. Deal?
#105
Pole Position
Judging a car by 0-60 or quarter mile times is the crudest way of assessing a car. For example the previous gen BMW E90 330i was never the fastest or most powerful sedan in its segment when compared to its competition yet was widely acknowledged to be the best driver's car.Seems like you're quibbling over internet specs cos you're reaching for a reason to dislike the car and don't want an actual test drive to change your ( already made-up)mind.