TRSMAN

This just started and is getting worse. Car has right at 80K miles and based on the research I have done on here I suspect it is the water pump going bad. The sound does not get bad unless the engine is under load. One other note is when the car has been running for more than 20 minutes the sound almost goes away. My Lexus dealership is almost an hour away and I am nervous about driving it as I suspect it might be the water pump, but honestly I can't tell. I do not see any signs of coolant leaking. I took the following video with the car in drive. https://youtu.be/bELrSkGD8M8

Thoughts?

Gville350

iTrader: (10)

Sounds like the noise comes in short cycles. Noise gets noticeable, then slightly louder and louder...then stops for a second. Try removing all of the covers (front/side/engine) and pinpoint whether it's coming from the A/C compressor/alternator side or right in front of the engine.

Mrfix

It may be one of the pulleys or a tensioner. Get a piece of broom handle or something like that and place it on the individual parts like water pump or tensioner and put the other end to your ear and pin point the source of noise.

sktn77a

iTrader: (2)

Cam gears? Piston slap? Take it to the dealer for a primary diagnosis BUT get a second opinion from an independent before spending a dime.

TRSMAN

It got to Lexus of Mobile AL last night as I needed to make sure it sat overnight for the car to make a sound. They are doing the recall on the fuel pump "stupid nut thing" at the same time. I showed this video to the service people last night so they know I am not going away easily. Service just called to tell me they could not get it to make the sound! Ugh my day is already crappy! They asked to keep the car till Monday to continue to diagnose. I am totally fine with that although I am baffled why they can't hear it unless they let it warm up. They did tell me last night that if it were the water pump it would likely make a noise all the time and I would see coolant, which I do not. The service dude seems knowledgeable and concerned which is positive. The negative is today on the phone he threw out the cam gear as a possibility, which caused me to poop a little in my pants. I said wait, that is an issue on the 350 engine not the 250 right? He said well there is no recall on the 250. I will leave it there for now as I still do not know what the problem is which drive me nuts! I purchased a mechanics stethoscope at Harbor freight yesterday but the car was warmed up and not making the noise when I got to it.

Mrfix

When the cam gear rattles it is usually a higher pitch than what I heard in your video. It sounded to me more like a bearing in one of the pulleys. The Stethoscope should help but be careful you can blow out your ear drum with those. Lets pray it's just a tensioner that quiets down once warm. It still could be a water pump that isn't weeping, just the bearing/impeller might be starting to go. That mechanic already sounds like he wants to bend you over. F'n Lexus...

Report back, curious what they say it is...thanks..

sktn77a

iTrader: (2)

Its a different cam gear issue on the 250. Lexus has a TSB on this and cover it under the original 4/50 warranty but after that, they just say live with it (~$2500 to repair).

TRSMAN

Update: I went to the Lexus dealership today after 5 daily reports that they could just not get the car to make a sound. Once I got there one of their senor mechanics went out with me to start the car. He did tell me that when they started it last night at the end of the day he was able to hear the rattle briefly at startup. Today the car was silent! The mechanic was very knowledgeable and let me pick his brain for a solid 30 minutes about this situation. He suspects it is the cam gears as anything else should be making the sound regardless of the car temperature at least as it related to the water pump and belt tensioner. He did say it would be only the 6th time he has seen a 250 with this issue and they actually were covered under warranty. He did listen to my video and was perplexed for sure as several of us are here in this thread. He told me that even on the 350's he can get it to make the noise after several days of testing. They tested mine 5 days in a row! He suspects that it has to do with the recent oil change and the fact that I drove for 1 hour to get to Lexus as being the reason why it may not be making the noise. He suggested that maybe the wrong type of oil could have been put in last time which would have been done at Toyota. For now I have my mechanics stethoscope and he showed me where to listen to the cam gears to tell if it is them. I will post back my finding the next time it rattles. I will get to the bottom of this!

On the plus side the fuel pump nut recall thing did yield me a full tank of gas from Lexus which is good because it was nearly empty!

sktn77a

iTrader: (2)

They don't issue a TSB based on a handful of complaints, there have to be thousands upon thousands! I doubt very much they will cover it (cam gears) under warranty unless you have some kind of "in".

Mrfix

Here is a recommendation. If you can switch to a good synthetic oil it may quiet this down and perhaps cure it. The CAM gears use Oil/Oil Pressure to control the internal phasers in the Cam Gears. Sometimes when the car sits the oil can drain completely out and when you start it they are empty and rattle until full again.

If you can find a garage you trust and switch to a really good oil like Amsoil Signature Series 5w30 and a good Mobile 1 filter it may get rid of this problem (if it is the Cam Gears). If doing this is too much then ask where you typically get your oil changed if they can use a Synthetic oil (ask for the brand they use) and a long life filter. Then change your oil every 5-7k.

It's hard to tell what it is but now that you have the stethoscope it should be much easier to pinpoint when it occurs again. Keep your fingers crossed it's just a pulley bearing or something.

TRSMAN

I started it this morning and I did get a bit of the rattle upon startup and it sounds a lot like the 350 cam gear rattle. It did not rattle long enough for me to investigate. I will certainly switch to Synthetic oil on the next oil change. I'm really thinking hard about ditching this car now. I love the car, however this along with my melting dash which also conveniently is outside the recall since it is an 09 is just making me not like or trust Lexus. I also occasionally have the rough idle issue so I know carbon buildup is another problem that will soon pop up. Worth switching to a 350?

Mrfix

See if you can sell it if your getting worried. You do not want to pay for an engine rebuild. About the dash, Try and keep it cool with a window cover and that will take the tackiness out of it. It's the sun that makes it sticky. Go for the newest IS350 you can get. Like a 2010 and up model. I think you will probably avoid some of the problems the earlier cars had. the 2gr-*** is a very rock solid engine found across a lot of different Toyota's (Avalon, Venza, etc).

TRSMAN

We really do hate to sell it as we love the car! I have an 07 Camry XLE V6 with the 3.5 in it and it is a good engine, so far. In fact I have had 0 problems with that car and it has 110K miles on it. Same goes for my 04 Toyota Solara with 130K miles one it. Other than the dam dash which just got replaced the car is rock solid. I love the Lexus for the looks, the way it drives etc., but honestly I am disappointed in the quality issues that just should not be there. 1. Sticky dash. 2. Stupid clip on both outside mirrors pop off so the mirror flops around. 3. Dam auto dimming rear view mirror I can't see out of due to know issue with black spots. 4. Cam gear issue I suspect I now have. 5. I have at times had the rough idle where the car feels like it will stall and I know it has to be the carbon build up issue and it will likely only get worse. 6. Faulty airbag.
You guys are right, I don't want to replace the engine which is why I feel it may be wise to trade or sell it outright. The car is in such good shape with no scratches or dings and low miles for the year. Never been wrecked and it has been garaged. We are going to think about it more and while we do I am going to try to preserve the engine by using seafoam to clean it.

Mrfix

The Seafoam (try Berrymans as an alternative) will clean up the cylinders and injectors but it's the valves that may need the cleaning more. They sell a can of Seafoam with a special straw that you can insert after the MAF sensor and spray into the intake, do that too since it might clean some of the deposits off the valve stems. Check out youtube, lots of videos. If you decide to keep the car and take your chances install an oil catch can.

Just be aware even a used engine and install will run you 3K+. You might really want to get out of the car while it still brings a premium price. Look for a GS350, I typically find them to be priced better since they are more plentiful.

I do agree with you on the IS***. The quality is pretty ****ty. My IS350 dash and door panels are sticky when they heat up in the sun and a lot of recalls to fix major issues like valves and springs and timing gears, etc. What a let down.

sktn77a

iTrader: (2)

Interesting suggestion. Why do you think a synthetic oil would improve this?