JamesDemo

After doing a look see on the new ES 300 h: Inside looks great BUT it is a strip down model. They give you a rear window shade! There is nothing close to what we have. You can not even order the heads up display it is not possible.
The base price is around 41K but with lane keep assist ( SPECIAL ORDER) Radar cruse
( SPECIAL ORDER) your up to 51K. - 120 days to wait. PLUS ( found on line)
Frustratingly, the system locks out numerous functions (even many radio presets) while the vehicle is in motion. Maybe Lexus is doing many of us a favor by forcing ES drivers to pull over before they attempt to mouse. Then again, at speed, even co-pilots are barred from making inputs.
Read more: http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...#ixzz278fQ0Ch9

So the bottom line : I would like the 40 MPG but there is just to much to give up - so maybe next year they will add some features. Our local TV is hammering adds on the new 350 BUT really taking a wait and see.

CurryPot

Take a test drive. I had an Edsel HS250h. The ES300h is what the HS250h should have been.

JamesDemo

Sorry to say I disagree with you. Read all the reviews on line on the new ES- not impressive and there is NOTHING on them. When the dealer did a search of all the cars in the US and checked to see if next patch would have the radar cruse control or the lane keep assist -- NOT ONE.
They are pushing the steering wheel and the back window shade.
But the extra lock out did it for me.
Just my opinion - but the heads up display is beginning to be on many other car models.
The main reason I bought my HS 250 was all the tech and I did like the 30+ MPG.
This is what makes a market so I wish everyone good luck with what ever they drive.

ceads9

You need to read about the Edsel and the reasons it was D/C . Very poor quality and lots of issues . Just read and get the facts before you call it an Edsel. The SC is out of production too. Glad you had the money to blow to keep up with the jones.

CurryPot

Glad you are happy with your choice. It's totally ok for owners to agree to disagree.

And I have to say, if I had an HS250h still, I would too pause before getting an ES300h. The horrendous depreciation of the HS250h would make it a huge jump to get into the ES300h. I don't think I would do it after giving it some thought. Did we just sort of agree there? Those who leased the HS250h will be laughing there backsides off at the end of their lease for sure. You would also want to see what recalls if any appear for the new model too.

Can you let me know the extra lockouts you are referring to? I'm not seeing them at this time.

So I had the 45K HS250h with the tech package. MY ES300h was 47K and here are the differences I really like in no particular order:

• HID Lights - That upset me with the HS not having them, same for the CT200h
• LED daytime running lights
• Smog detection - when something is nasty outside, it automatically goes to internal recirculation mode
• Active head restraints - finally; it sure does take Lexus a while to catch up with other car makers
• HD Radio - I'm really liking this, way more than I thought
• IPod integration that you can actually use (Was so bad in Gen 1 of Enform, that's not an HS250h issue as such)
• USB port is hidden in center console - don't have to unplug the IPod when you leave the car
• TPS tells you which wheels, not just four random numbers on the dash
• Blind spot monitor - this is friggin' awesome, no car should be without it
• Rear cross traffic monitoring - better than just a camera (which I have), saved my bacon twice now
• Emits a sound when < 12 MPH on batteries - sneaking up on people can be fun but dangerous too
• A much smoother ride but handles just as well in the corners
• Cup holders grab smaller cups/bottles - finally! And you do not have to pull back the center armrest for them either
• CVT does not whine as much when you floor it
• Sport mode turns the Taco into a rev gauge - not sure why I like this but I do
• Whining noise from regen braking inside cabin is barely noticeable - so happy about that
• Keyless entry includes back doors - so if you have a front passenger, hand inside back door opens their door
  
• Heated steering wheel - used it for the first time yesterday
• Rear shade - putting it up when someone is tailing you seems to work for the most part
• Temperature for aircon is not on the LCD but below it, shown all the time
• Traditional gear shift; it's no longer a fancy Prius, it's now a fancy Avalon
• Analogue clock - they finally got rid of the 80s LCD clock -
• More leg room for everyone, including driver
• More soft materials - it bothered me how much hard plastic there was for a Lexus
• 40 MPG with not too much effort - my girlfriend gave me a lot of crap about having a hybrid that did not get 40 MPG, although she did go out with me because it was at least a hybrid. Only later did I tell her I used to own and ISF

As far as I can recall, the only techy things I am missing is the front camera, LKA and heads-up display.

The LKA was fun but only after the roads were painted. A hard winter made it pretty much useless here as the lane markings were eroded. What the LKA did for me was to make me take the shuttle bus to the airport when traveling to Asia. When I drove home after coming back from Asia for the first time with LKA, it was beeping all the time. It was clear I was not safe to drive which really upset me after losing a school friend to a drunk driver. I had no idea how unsafe I was. Thankfully, no incident.

I would like to say I miss the heads-up display, I did like it in the HS250h (very cool) but I just don't seem to. Although switching it to KPH when going into Canada was cool. Personal preference I guess. May be it's all the other improvements that help in this regard.

So it can't all be good on the ES300h right? I am just over 2000 miles, past the honey moon period and honestly, I'm struggling to find things I do not like. But here goes and I really think I am being picky here:

• No pockets in the back doors - but you do get map pockets on the back seat
• It's big (for me) - but I knew that
• Gear shifter could be smoother - feels very "mechanical"
• Sound system - it's ok though. I could not get the HID and ML System, it's not one of the packages. I would have to get the UL package to get the ML System which would have taken things above 50k and no HID
• Clock is no longer on navigation screen - Analogue clock is classy, but we all seem to miss the nasty LCD clock as you have to take your eyes off the road for a longer time to read it. Sure would be nice to have it back in the Nav Screen - it's been reported to Lexus
• Still no back button for the mouse controller
• Glasses holder gone - I never used it for glasses. I kept my insurance card and stamps in there

Can you add to this list? I know you miss the Heads-up, Front Camera and LKA. What else am I missing here?

I hear you on availability though. That will improve in time. My dealer had to trade with another dealer in Portland to get the color and options I wanted. I did not want the PCS at $1500 but had to accept it. I'm happy I did. I'm using it far more than I did in the HS250h I had.

The cool thing here is that we are both happy with our cars.

DDS62

would you please provide some links to the issues and the facts you refer to.

ceads9

Links are all over the net. Any car buff knows its sad history. Yes there is more to it, like bad timing for its time and other issues. Don't have to show a link which can be found by putting Edsel in the search bar. I'm not quoting stats . It just come across like a former working talking bad about a former job. It's easy to do and we forget the good times and memory's we had at the old on or in this case the other car. Remember some of us still work at that old job ......have the car . Must have liked it at one time to buy a new Lexus. Have good one I'm going to watch some ball!

DDS62

Either put up some links, post some of your facts, show some issues or your comments are nothing more than your opinion.

ntrainer

Whoa, DDS2, I think actually ceads9 is trying to say that the comparison between the HS250h and the Edsel is a terrible one because the Edsel (unlike the HS250h) was a poorly-built and poorly-conceived car. The HS250h was neither. Ceads9 is defending the HS. Am I right, ceads9?

What I don't understand is why you, CurryPot, have decided to come on a forum for HS owners and tell us we're all idiots for liking our cars better than yours. Head on over to the ES forum and enjoy the love, but don't expect to get much over here.

I can only speak for myself, but here goes: I have a 2011 HS. There have been no recalls whatsoever affecting my vehicle yet; the recalls are on the '10 vehicle only. That being said, recalls for minor stuff happen ALL THE TIME. They have nothing to do with a car's reliability or eventual longevity. If I'd wanted an ES when I was shopping for a new car, I'd have gotten an ES. The fact that there's now an ESh doesn't convince me that I should buy an ES. The fact that I got an HS doesn't make me a moron, buying an "Edsel;" it just means it was the right car for me. Obviously it wasn't the right car for enough other North Americans to make it very popular. (And it was marketed terribly and dealers made terrible sales mistakes, yadda, yadda, yadda.) So that makes me unique. But it doesn't mean I have an inferior car. It just means that obviously I have a set of preferences about cars that aren't shared by enough others to form a significant niche. So be it. But why bad-mouth my car? Can't we all get along?

ceads9

Yes .....you explained it better than me. I agree with you .

DDS62

Yes I did interpret ceads9's comments completely wrong. I Though he was speaking about the HS as having issues and as we all well know - the HS has very few issues if any. A very trouble free car that does exactly what it was intended to do. And IMO a nice looking car.

As far as the Edsel, I was 15 when it was introduced and I remember it well. The car was seen to be horrendously ugly. It was referred to as the car with the Vagina front end and it became the object of ridicule and took a publicity beating. IMO that was the over riding reason it failed - simply because it became an embarrassment to even be seen riding in one. But even then Ford remodeled it twice before it canceled it. The Edsel actually was a three model car. Compare that with Lexus Edseling the HS after only 27 months in it's introductory model. No other car that I am aware of has been yanked so quickly, and there simply seems to be nothing wrong with the car. We keep having people drop in to insult the HS but always their criticisms are based on negativity cynicism or just anger. I have said many times that Lexus killed this car for some unknown reason that had nothing to do with poor sales. it was Lexus that appeared to jump at the opportunity of low volumes caused by the tsunami, cut back on production and then quickly killed all of the left handed HSs. May sound crazy, but I will bet the condo in essence that is correct. All of these people that are running out to rid themselves of the HS are not doing it because of issues with the car. If anyone knows of anything that is wrong or deficient with the HS please speak up. We have been asking that question for many months and have yet seen any real issues reported.

rajeev6

I fully agree - the marketing was a disaster like IBM OS/2 - if you know what I mean.
It's shaped like a sports car - that's what people tell me of their first impression. But it's a hybrid - implying that it'll be a gas saver but then it has a ground breaking "Power" driving mode which makes it quite peppy (at least for me having driven Camry last 15 years) - what are you saying Lexus - where are you positioning it?

When ESh was announced, I was very excited because back in 2010, I was intent on getting ES350 until our daughters stepped in . Here's why ESh didn't do it for me
- it has a console like an old Buick unlike a nice wraparound spaceship console in HS
- doesn't have pop-up display (it's quite impressive for others to see the console pop-up and driver's seat move up as soon as I press the ON switch)
- it's bigger and doesn't look sporty as HS does.
- 2 miles/gal of efficiency increase is very nominal - can vary from one driver to another.
- and then there's a story about my HS in 2010 and a woman who wanted to take it out for a spin when she first saw it and I said no.... one that I'm not going to tell